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The drive from the current Meijer to the aintnevergonnahappen Meijer would be over 30 minutes. That's the real problem in this area - too many NIMBYs so all the stores are concentrated in bring-it-on Garfield township. An Acme Meijer would relieve traffic in TC and probably in Acme too. And at today's prices, 1 or 2 gallons of gas is not trivial either.
A fact that escapes some of the locals. Many of them just don't comprehend development & growth. Two things that are inevitable and must be handled correctly.
The old-fogey-local-politics is a HUGE problem. These dimwits don't realize that a Meijers in Acme is necessary. So much fun shopping in Meier in July, waiting on line for 20 minutes and having all of your dairy products spoiled when you get home (even with the stupid insulated bags they SELL you). Short sightedness is a huge problem up here that will eventually go away when the ill-informed are removed from positions of authority and replaced by folks who think progressively rather than regressively.
When I brought up the Acme Meijer's I meant it was a problem because of this:
Right now Traverse City's economy is lousy and is getting worse. There aren't any big companies coming into the area and jobs are dwindling day by day for various reasons. In a time like this, the best way to provide growth is to allow reatil development wherever it wants to be. So if Grand Rapids-based Meijer wants to build 1 or 2 or 5 Meijers in or near Traverse City - LET THEM. Each store will create a couple hundred jobs, many of which will be full-time and provide benefits. When people visiting from down- or out-of-state hear about or visit Traverse City they will hear about it growing. They will move here - they may bring new companies and jobs with them. It's a domino effect and it's absolutely necessary in this economy.
I worked at the Acme K-Mart for four summers when I was in college in the early '00s...they had to jump through hoops to accomodate Acme township people. They actually had to decorate the ROOF of Kmart a certain way so that people in the Grand Traverse Resort wouldn't have to look at something ugly...(...or so "common and lowly" is more like it). The Acme people had THAT much control.
And you know what else? For people who know the area...you know that Walgreens that was built just around the bay near Burger King before you start hitting the hotels? When that store was built I heard it took over $40,000 of business AWAY from Kmart each week. That one little store just 3 or 4 miles away.
People need to remember that Michigan is not the ideal place to drive nowadays given the high cost of gas...people would gladly welcome a new store like Meijer or a theater or something in Acme if it'd save them an extra 30 minutes of driving.
I'm going off on a rant now so I better stop. .....er....I just hate northern Michigan sometimes. It's like Traverse City simply doesn't want to keep people living nearby happy.
A fact that escapes some of the locals. Many of them just don't comprehend development & growth. Two things that are inevitable and must be handled correctly.
I have to stop and scratch my head when someone who labels themselves a "progressive" thinks that building a new Meijers is the epitome of responsible development.
The Acme/Williamsburg area does not have the demographics to support a Meijers, without it having a devastating impact on the established local retail stores. What exactly can you buy at Meijers that you can't get at K-mart or Tom's, both of which are already existing in Acme? What is the net job gain when Tom's and other local retailers (who are locally owned and keep and spend their profits locally instead of shipping them off to Grand Rapids) is forced under because of a new Meijers?
What is going to be the cost to local taxpayers, who are already paying high taxes, to make the infrastructure improvements for the road, water and sewer improvements that would be needed if a new big-box super store is built in Acme?
There are a whole host of other impacts that need to be assessed instead of just worrying about your Ice cream melting on the trip back across town from the existing Meijers. Buy your ice cream at Tom's and then you don't have to worry about it. Better yet, move to the west side of TC, where you are closer to shopping and the downtown. Then you can ride your bike to the store like a true progressive would.
I have to stop and scratch my head when someone who labels themselves a "progressive" thinks that building a new Meijers is the epitome of responsible development.
The Acme/Williamsburg area does not have the demographics to support a Meijers, without it having a devastating impact on the established local retail stores. What exactly can you buy at Meijers that you can't get at K-mart or Tom's, both of which are already existing in Acme? What is the net job gain when Tom's and other local retailers (who are locally owned and keep and spend their profits locally instead of shipping them off to Grand Rapids) is forced under because of a new Meijers?
What is going to be the cost to local taxpayers, who are already paying high taxes, to make the infrastructure improvements for the road, water and sewer improvements that would be needed if a new big-box super store is built in Acme?
There are a whole host of other impacts that need to be assessed instead of just worrying about your Ice cream melting on the trip back across town from the existing Meijers. Buy your ice cream at Tom's and then you don't have to worry about it. Better yet, move to the west side of TC, where you are closer to shopping and the downtown. Then you can ride your bike to the store like a true progressive would.
The East side of Traverse has the demos to support such a store. Which local stores will suffer a "devastating impact"? You forget how may folks drive to Meier's in TVC who live in Acme/Williamsburg. Like I stated earlier, lots of you "local folks" don't get it.
...The Acme/Williamsburg area does not have the demographics to support a Meijers, without it having a devastating impact on the established local retail stores. What exactly can you buy at Meijers that you can't get at K-mart or Tom's, both of which are already existing in Acme? ...
You can't be serious. I don't spend $50 a year at Kmart. The parking lot is never more that 10% full for a reason. And what makes Kmart any better for the local economy than Meijer? For those of us in the Holiday Hills area, East Bay Tom's is just as Close as Acme. Plus you can pass other stores you might like to shop at on the way. And how about some selection, and to not having to constantly watch for expired dates on posted sales and not watching the checkout for errors. Compare the Meijer parking lot the Fourteenth St. Toms and its pretty clear who's doing the better job satisfying customers. If they scraped off the Acme Tom's and Kmart and put up a Meijer on that spot business would probably increase 5 fold.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jswee
...What is going to be the cost to local taxpayers, who are already paying high taxes, to make the infrastructure improvements for the road, water and sewer improvements that would be needed if a new big-box super store is built in Acme? ...
Ah, the old new development doesn't pay it's own way and fair share of taxes lie. Local governments do not spend money on roads. You'd know that if you drove around Holiday Hills. Sewers? - another example of Acme ineptitude. Developers offered them a sewer system for free years ago but Acme didn't want to run it and collect the revenue. Now we get to pay for TC's boondogle. The fact is, the majority of Acme taxpayers have repeatedly supported Meijer at the polls.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jswee
... Better yet, move to the west side of TC, where you are closer to shopping and the downtown. Then you can ride your bike to the store like a true progressive would.
Yes, ride your bike in the snow, salt slurry, rain, and when it's 40 degrees in the morning on the first day of summer, etc. Move to the west side where certain realtors would prefer to ply their trade.
Screw Acme residents. They don't need their own schools or infrastructure or stores. Let TC imagine it's won the battle against big-box over there on the east side where it wasn't going to shop anyway.
lol, if you want more, more, more, more, more, more, more more, more, more, more ,more, more,more move to SE mi. Miles and miles of endless stores and concrete and pollutions and cars and people. You will never be inconvienced so much as to drive 20 mins to the store,,,,,,,,its a trade off you fools. MIles and miles of beaches, woods, clean air, peacefulness, star filled skies....I could go on and on....I take all that over a Meijers any day.
Heck, all of you who want more and more and more are going to make Northen MI look like Se mi.who the HELL wants that???? People have been getting along without the big boxes for generations and have been doing just fine. Its the younger gen who what everything close and NOW, how dare they be inconvienced with a drive to a store.
Thank goodness I am in the middles of 35 acres, all you concrete lovers can only get so close to me....I am looking into buying more land around me to keep you concrete fools away from me. Wonder how I am able to get back and forth to town without my dairy spoiling? Wonder how generations before me managed to do it? Oh I know, we have SISU, something the younger gen is sorely lacking. Take your cement and get out of here!
Yes, ride your bike in the snow, salt slurry, rain, and when it's 40 degrees in the morning on the first day of summer, etc. Move to the west side where certain realtors would prefer to ply their trade.
Screw Acme residents. They don't need their own schools or infrastructure or stores. Let TC imagine it's won the battle against big-box over there on the east side where it wasn't going to shop anyway.
With gas at $4.00+ a gallon I'll bet you will see a few more people riding their bikes this summer. Do Realtors make more money for selling homes on the west side for some reason? Who knew? I recommend the west side for the very reason that you are complaining about the east side. The east side has limited access to shopping and other services and it's a pain to drive across Traverse City in the summer. Not rocket science when considering the best place to live.
You chose to live in an area that is inconveniently located in regards to shopping. It's one of the many reasons that there is a relatively high turnover rate and low appreciation rates in the general area that you decided to live in. So to remedy the situation you want to see a big box store built in Acme. Should Meijers also build stores in Kingsley and Buckley and Suttons Bay and all of the other outlying areas where the residents have to drive 15-30 minutes to get to the existing Meijers? And next I suppose you will want Best Buy and Sam's to also build satellite outlets because you don't want to drive to the existing stores. Let's see how much urban sprawl we can promote and how closely we can replicate S.E. Michigan.
Personally, I like the fact that most of the retail development has been concentrated in Garfield Township. It makes it convenient for those coming from a distance to be able to go to Sam's, Meijers, Home Depot, Lowe's, Best Buy, etc. in one fell swoop. Replicating that concentration of retail opportunities in areas with marginal demographics is not my idea of responsible or well planned development.
Instead of advocating for retail sprawl why don't you instead promote a version of the Hammond-Hartmann bridge/bypass, that would alleviate some of east-west traffic congestion, while at the same time have a minimal impact on the Boardman River watershed. With the right design that should be achievable and would go a long way towards fixing some of the transportation problems that we have in this area.
Doesn't it seem just a bit ironic that people are fleeing the eastern and south-eastern part of the state and then saying that the place they are fleeing to needs to "progress"? Maybe the places they are leaving ought to become more like Traverse City or Grand Rapids which are the towns that are still doing well.
I did not flee another part of the state. I have lived in 5 other states and in very populated, congested areas as well as small towns. I don't think Traverse City is doing all that well, maybe just not as bad as the rest of the state. In comparison with the rest of the country, it is not doing well at all economically.
When I brought up the Acme Meijer's I meant it was a problem because of this:
Right now Traverse City's economy is lousy and is getting worse. There aren't any big companies coming into the area and jobs are dwindling day by day for various reasons. In a time like this, the best way to provide growth is to allow reatil development wherever it wants to be. So if Grand Rapids-based Meijer wants to build 1 or 2 or 5 Meijers in or near Traverse City - LET THEM. Each store will create a couple hundred jobs, many of which will be full-time and provide benefits. When people visiting from down- or out-of-state hear about or visit Traverse City they will hear about it growing. They will move here - they may bring new companies and jobs with them. It's a domino effect and it's absolutely necessary in this economy.
I worked at the Acme K-Mart for four summers when I was in college in the early '00s...they had to jump through hoops to accomodate Acme township people. They actually had to decorate the ROOF of Kmart a certain way so that people in the Grand Traverse Resort wouldn't have to look at something ugly...(...or so "common and lowly" is more like it). The Acme people had THAT much control.
And you know what else? For people who know the area...you know that Walgreens that was built just around the bay near Burger King before you start hitting the hotels? When that store was built I heard it took over $40,000 of business AWAY from Kmart each week. That one little store just 3 or 4 miles away.
People need to remember that Michigan is not the ideal place to drive nowadays given the high cost of gas...people would gladly welcome a new store like Meijer or a theater or something in Acme if it'd save them an extra 30 minutes of driving.
I'm going off on a rant now so I better stop. .....er....I just hate northern Michigan sometimes. It's like Traverse City simply doesn't want to keep people living nearby happy.
Bringing in another Meijer store would absolutely cause a domino effect. TC needs jobs, jobs, jobs and a new Meijer would bring in just that. Many people comtemplating a move to TC don't come due to the scarcity of decent-paying jobs. If a Meijer is built on the East Side, you can bet that other stores and companies would start trickling in nearby. Even with a 2nd Meijer, TC will never turn into a large city. It would always retain a rural feel, mostly due to the outlying townships, rural landscape, and one-lane roads. You could build 10 more big-box stores and it wouldn't change the feel of the area - - but TC's ecomony would certainly improve.
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