How bad do you think MI really is? (Grand Rapids, Ann Arbor: houses, rent)

[Globusproject]

Originally Posted by Sociologist

Obviously, no people, no jobs=poverty. What constitutes as "poverty" has also changed since 99-00 when the economy was eons better than currently. Even more silly, the map shows the Detroit area in rather good shape.......??? Wow, even in 2000 the market in Detroit was one of the worst in the country. The 2010 census will reshape the way politicians seek policy, and will play a huge role in fostering change with our tax system, insurance corporations and our tactics to compete with rapid globalization.

Without the companies cutting costs by laying off people and remaining as viable companies, making a profit, the companies will cease to exist. That means no jobs for everyone. No tax revenue for the State from the employees.

Companies have to cut costs so as to save the jobs of those who still have jobs.

The whole United States has a standard of living that is dropping. We are transferring much of our wealth to countries like India and China. The problem as we transfer wealth we usually expect to have access to their markets. But we don't export to their markets. We import their goods, but we don't export.

This makes us lose jobs. But it allows the companies, which are American Companies to make profits and pay the taxes on the profits, at least.

And as the Chinese and Indians increase their standard of living, they too will start to buy products from abroad. But it will take a while before China starts to buy our golf clubs etc.

Rick Wagner, President of GM said that he plans on stepping up production of car parts in China this year. Goodbye Delphi, Visteon and Gedas....

Poverty is what now? You only get three M and M's a day instead of six???

If you have $40,000 a year worth of fixed expenses to run the household, cars, pay insurance then if you only have $39,000 you are in poverty. By $1000.

If you only have an income of $19,000 and have a family of four, then you can't make it anyway. How anyone can live on less than $40,000 for a family of four and try to own your own home, I don't know. Government has to stop taxing the poor.

And providing the rest of us with services that I never asked for.

Like have a sociologist tell me how to raise my children. Like having a Judge make decisions about my family contrary to my wishes. Or having a lawyer tell me I can no longer make decisions concerning my children.

Or the man who has a wife who is unfaithful to him and he divorces her and she still takes half of the community assets and screws him around concernign his children???

Some of us are really tired of Sociologists and Social Workers and Psychologist and LIbersal Judges and thieving lawyers providing us with these Government services THAT WE NEVER ASKED FOR, NEVER REQUESTED AND HAVE NO USE FOR.

By cutting these non asked for services, we could cut out 1/4 of our government in Michigan tomorrow. Solve the deficit problem and have the money needed to implement new IT Systems in Michigan. AND FIX THE ROADS.

AGHHHHHH Sorry. That was the plan the Replicans had. Get rid of all the excess regulations and liberals telling the conservatives how we have to live our lives. When are we going to start laying off the liberal judges and lawyers from government. At $300 an hour, we could allow 15 social workers to work for every Judge or Lawyer we laid off.

We have a liberal government in Michigan because the special interests are not wanting to stop their revenue flow into their pockets. That is, those people who directly benefit from larger and more intrusive government.

We want the Police to put the dangerous people in jail. Don't worry about the jay walkers. If they get hit, it is there own fault. And make sure that if they get hit, they can't sue you for their error.

It is time we started to get some common sense back into government. Some moral values, where whatever you say is criticized if you don't make any sense and don't have a clue.

Put oversight committees of citizens on the activiites of the government, especially the lawyers and the Judges who have no oversight or independent public or citizens group within government to watch over this part of our government. We need an Inspector General to watch over and investigate all parts of our government when there is a citizen complaint. And this goes for the administrative practices of the members of the judiciary also. They are a part of government and have no one watching over their shoulder on how they administer this part of our government.

Do you actually know where the money from your traffic tickets go??? And where does all of the other fines. Did yo know a large part of it goes into the pension funds of the Judges, the Lt. Gov. and the Gov??? Act of 1963 set up a special pension fund for these people separate from every other Michigan Government Employee!!!

There are many many problems with our Government in Michigan. Much more than you see.

[Sociologist]

Michigan is one of the most interesting places to do a community study. I agree completely that we need a form of supervision that would encompass the actions of our state government. When Granholm says "we are creating Michigan jobs" she means that companies whom which move to Michigan primarily because of tax incentives almost always carry their employees from other states. We dont actually hire employees here, we make our demographics look pretty so other companies will want to jump on the boat. Which incidentally is the exact reason why companies are leaving this little mitten. Why would I want to bring my company to MI when demographics show all our skilled labor, (and most of the 20 somethings with education) are leaving? What were left with is a high average age, loads of retired people who hoard their money made when the big three was alive. How can morality let everything go (knowing well in advance it would) and have no formulation as to how we will rebuild or economic base? Conspiracy theory! Lets wipe out the working class, and create a barrier 20 miles wider between the middle and upper classes. We'll keep welfare and the perpetuating system of dependence so we wont loose anymore people. We'll narrow our special interests so we have ease in controlling what type of labor we want in michigan, oh and we'll also take away the pleasure of having recreation affordable by making camping and other activities almost impossible to afford. At the same time we'll make public education obsolete by making prospective teachers change their mind about what they study in college. Hell we'll make it impossible to afford college. And in 20 years when the economic base has "Shifted" again, we'll conjure more reasons to bring it down again.

[ejbx2]

About six years ago, I left all my family and friends back in Michigan, and although I miss them, it was worth it. Unlike many others, my wife and I had good paying jobs so it was not the economy that forced us out. It was the fact that it is so cold, grey, and depressing. When I lived in Michigan, I was one of many that I know of who suffered depression and anxiety. Since moving my depression is gone and my anxiety attacks are held to a minimum. It took a couple of years to get that out of my system, but since I moved I feel much healthier. It makes a huge difference when you can go outside and play with your kids all year long.

[magellan]

Originally Posted by ejbx2

About six years ago, I left all my family and friends back in Michigan, and although I miss them, it was worth it. Unlike many others, my wife and I had good paying jobs so it was not the economy that forced us out. It was the fact that it is so cold, grey, and depressing. When I lived in Michigan, I was one of many that I know of who suffered depression and anxiety. Since moving my depression is gone and my anxiety attacks are held to a minimum. It took a couple of years to get that out of my system, but since I moved I feel much healthier. It makes a huge difference when you can go outside and play with your kids all year long.

And why didn't you go outside and play with your kids in the winter? My kids love to go out and play in the snow.

I think globusproject hit all the points that could possibly me made. ;-)

[ejbx2]

I didn't play with my kids in the winter because my daughter has asthma and after a while I developed it as well. After going to the hospital for over night stays with my daughter, I thought it might be a good idea not to chance it with the cold seems that is one of the triggers. Also I did not know that you had the market cornered on opinions about Michigan. So sorry I spoke out of turn.

[magellan]

Originally Posted by ejbx2

Also I did not know that you had the market cornered on opinions about Michigan. So sorry I spoke out of turn.

You said, and I quote "It makes a huge difference when you can go out and play with your kids all year long" in regard to your depression. I would argue that if you get out and play/work/walk/ski/snowshoe, etc. in the winter, you wouldn't be as depressed. That's why I asked the question. You didn't mention anything about asthma.

If you want to express your opinion, expect someone to counter your opinion, that's all.

[michiganmoon]

JenM,
I love Michigan. Well at least Lake Michigan and its sanddunes. I think this state also has a lot to offer. However, my job has kind of been depressing lately and I am also kind of on the same boat. I am still young and part of me wants to take the money I've saved and move out of state and get a fresh start of things while I can.

I have been weghing a lot of things.

Moving out of state would mean that I would be apart from family, shoreline, and my new job might be as good. However, it could open a lot of new opportunities in my life. So I am still kind of playing it by ear.

[Sociologist]

Originally Posted by michiganmoon

JenM,
I love Michigan. Well at least Lake Michigan and its sanddunes. I think this state also has a lot to offer. However, my job has kind of been depressing lately and I am also kind of on the same boat. I am still young and part of me wants to take the money I've saved and move out of state and get a fresh start of things while I can.

I have been weghing a lot of things.

Moving out of state would mean that I would be apart from family, shoreline, and my new job might be as good. However, it could open a lot of new opportunities in my life. So I am still kind of playing it by ear.

My family is in the same boat, I am waiting to finish my graduate work while my wife is looking elsewhere in her field. I have family here, and dont necessarly want to leave but your right, once the economy has affected you in a way in which you are no longer able to afford a move, then what to do? Alot of my friends are moving to colorado, i have looked at north and south carolina in respect to their job climates, although I'm still researching myself. Good luck

[Globusproject]

Originally Posted by ejbx2

I didn't play with my kids in the winter because my daughter has asthma and after a while I developed it as well. After going to the hospital for over night stays with my daughter, I thought it might be a good idea not to chance it with the cold seems that is one of the triggers. Also I did not know that you had the market cornered on opinions about Michigan. So sorry I spoke out of turn.

Asthma is what is called COPD (Chronic Obstuctive Pulmonary Disease). There are Obstructive and Restrictive Diseases. Asthma, Emphysema and Bronchitis are the COPD's. Restrictive diseases are due to musulo skeletal diseases that prevent you from expanding your chest to breath. Or lack of innervation of the muscles that are used to breath.

Asthma is caused by the muscles of the alveolar sac located in the terminal bronchioles of the lung, contracting or spasming. This can be caused by three things. External antigens or agents that irritate the lung tissue. Spasm of the smooth muscle of the terminal bronchioles caused by nerve stimulation such as in anxiety. And last, cold air can cause the muscles of the terminal bronchioles to spasm. If you have the first type of antigen based asthma. You can scuba dive with asthma. If you have cold induced asthma or anxiety based asthma, you shouldn't scuba dive with asthma.

It is important to determine what type of asthma you have. Children generally have the antigen type of asthma that oftentimes passes. Cold induced asthma can be had by anyone, as can be anxiety.

So before you change the habits or your behavior, it is important to know what causes the asthma.

Emphysema is usually caused by smoking or other diseases that damage the tissue of the lung. This causes less surface area of the lung to exchange Oxygen with the blood. Severe forms also cause an inability to exhaust CO2. CO2 difuses 20 times easier than Oxygen so you don't get CO2 retention (Hypercarbia) until your emphysema is severe.

Bronchitis is caused by the irriation of the bronchus. Thereby causing the narrowing of the large air tubes of the lung which then can not get enough air to the lung.

Hope this helps.

[Globusproject]

Originally Posted by Sociologist

Michigan is one of the most interesting places to do a community study. I agree completely that we need a form of supervision that would encompass the actions of our state government. When Granholm says "we are creating Michigan jobs" she means that companies whom which move to Michigan primarily because of tax incentives almost always carry their employees from other states. We dont actually hire employees here, we make our demographics look pretty so other companies will want to jump on the boat. Which incidentally is the exact reason why companies are leaving this little mitten. Why would I want to bring my company to MI when demographics show all our skilled labor, (and most of the 20 somethings with education) are leaving? What were left with is a high average age, loads of retired people who hoard their money made when the big three was alive. How can morality let everything go (knowing well in advance it would) and have no formulation as to how we will rebuild or economic base? Conspiracy theory! Lets wipe out the working class, and create a barrier 20 miles wider between the middle and upper classes. We'll keep welfare and the perpetuating system of dependence so we wont loose anymore people. We'll narrow our special interests so we have ease in controlling what type of labor we want in michigan, oh and we'll also take away the pleasure of having recreation affordable by making camping and other activities almost impossible to afford. At the same time we'll make public education obsolete by making prospective teachers change their mind about what they study in college. Hell we'll make it impossible to afford college. And in 20 years when the economic base has "Shifted" again, we'll conjure more reasons to bring it down again.

REPLY PART I

Jennifer Granholm just got finished speaking while I was replying to the other entries.

You can cry doom and disaster. Or you can turn a negative into a positive. This employment crisis in Michigan is an opportunity to modify what Michigan is.

Her ideas for providing educated employees is good. Except sending a child to pre kindergarden school at age 4 is not going to solve the employment problem today. At age 22, the child will enter the job market educated. But we can wait 18 years for this. False Piste. False Route. But a good idea in the long term to increase the level of education and get people off of unemployment. The community college education ideas I had espoused earlier for the person who didn't know if she should leave or stay. IF she didn't have the job skills. leaving she would find herself in the same position, unemployed and without needed job skill sets- but instead of Michigan, the person would be in another state.

Jennifer should thank L. Brooks Patterson for getting rid of the small business tax (SBT). In this way, she was forced to reduce the cost of government. She was forced to make government efficient. And taxes were lowered for the business sector that is responsible for making most of the jobs- the Small Business Owner.

As to raising taxes. NO. What part of NO doesn't government understand???

When the new businesses arrive because you have lowered taxes, then you will have more money to invest in improvements in society. But you have to get the businesses here to begin with. Raising taxes on employees is not going to do that. (Although this is better than raising the taxes on businesses- who then wouldn't even considering coming to Michigan).

Stimulating new industry growth is wonderful. The University of Michigan is full of wonderful smart people. But they don't know how to do technology transfer from the brainy people to the business people that they despise. This is an area that needs much work on. Technology transfer. It is a management problem. Not what academics and scientifics are known for. It is a business function- perhaps the scientists and academics could learn from the business people, in the area of management.


As to academics and scientists. The Federal government is requirements that the States conform to Federal Computer standards in Project Management and in computer security. (OMB A-11 and OMB 123- and FISMA). The Scientists at the University of Michigan are implementing Federal National Centers for Biomedical Computing networks (Internet 2) but are not conforming to Federal Standards of Project Management and Security. This is a no no. A big NO NO that could make these same scientists and academics prison material. Just a word of warning.