[MittenDweller82]

Originally Posted by Virginia1

Wow..........should I stay or should I go. Some of us southerners are coming up to Michigan for various reasons, so far I know of 4 people from Virginia that are moving up. I have been on this forum for a few months and I have heard good and bad things about Michigan. I have also visited Michigan (fiance lives in Flint) on many occasions. So far my favorite area is the West side of Michigan, seen Detroit several times, stayed downtown over long weekends and have made some keen observations. I never ran into any problems or rude people, but I know for sure I would not want to live there. Look the whole world is changing. Manufacturing is dead in the Western Hemisphere, our manufacturing jobs are going elsewhere, even in Europe VW's and other automobiles are being built elsewhere. German autoworkers are pitching a fit because they might have to work up to 40 hours a week(which begs the question are unions good or bad in todays world ) global competition. China is now coming out with there own line of cars and we will see them in the future and don't think we won't buy them. Remember that tiny little Honda that everyone laughed at, look whose laughing now. So as other posters have said, the Southeast corridor has always relied on the auto industry and places like the south, ex NC with it's research triangle, or other cities that have high tech industries that cater to the government. These are the kinds of industries that I guess should have been lured to Michigan by offering tax incentives or breaks to make it attractive for the business to set up shop. I could go on and on, but I think this thread is about worn out. Just one little statistic about throwing money at education in K-12. Washington D.C. spends the most money per student in the U.S. but they have the lowest test scores, and the highest drop out rate in the nation. I work in a childrens hospital and I can tell you, ITS THE PARENTS. No discipline. How many of you have children who complain about students talking in class, no respect for teachers or seeing 4 or 5 year old kids up until all hours of the night. Most people know how to raise there kids, but there has been a huge increase of people who don't. The schools are there, the teachers are there, a lot of the students could give a crap. How many of you have seen parents cuss there kid out in public and jerk them around. I know you wanted to say something to them, but you dont' in fear of getting shot. Well I plan on coming to Michigan and where ever I live I plan on getting involved in the community in some way, so watch out the south is coming up to provide a little warmth to the cold attitudes. Oh by the way I think Michigan will be the next hot property, according to Al Gore my area will be underwater and Michigan will be a warm state, maybe even a hot state. Good luck everyone, rambling is over for the evening

Wow, I must say....comparing the state of Michigan against VA Beach is certainly a different universe in difference. And Flint, of all places being consistently ranked as the worst place to live in America year after year. Not trying to rain on your parade, although if you have seen the affect that our congressmen have made trying to get involved in a community, its hard to expect an impact from a citizen. It would probably take our lifetimes to convert Michigan into a "hot property". We'll you'd have to call all the people (the most of any state in the country) that have left, tell them to re-invest in their homes, repair their credit and make a 3:1 job ratio for every citizen in the state, fire the current governor, move phizer, ford, gm, and Toyota back into the state........well sorry for perpetuating the thread here. Just write back in 5 years and tell us your location. Cheers!

[MonaLisaVito]

Number one reason not to stay - Jennifer Granholm

[RedWingsFan]

Originally Posted by mjb68-19

Number one reason not to stay - Jennifer Granholm

Amen! I about fell over when people voted her back in. Crazy!

[endlosung]

Well I live in norther michigan, Michigan imo sucks as bad as any state in the union, and has nothing to offer compared to many southern states. Yes it is nice in the winter, but it is like having a beautiful wife that you know will turn to a corpse in 6 months [winter].
I have 53 acres an nice exclent condtion 2000 foot cape cod overlooking the acrage, if I can see you on from my home you are on my property. The tax man did not even catch the property for 5 years as you can not see it from the road and the assessors changed hands just as I finished and they did not do the proper paper work.
It has a 30x40 pole barn for toys storage.
You can hunt the deer,turkey,woodcock,partridge,bobcat, bear. or any other of the wildlife. on the property, or just watch them with a camera, even has elk, shopping is only 16 miles away with all you need from gaylord mi. and 30 miles from skiing and high end shopping in petoskey mi. But Michigan is becoming a crap hole and I have lowerd my price to 199900 for all of the land and home, a couple of lookers but no offers, I now have rearanged the price to home and 18 acres to 169900 and holding 35 ac on class a paved road frontage and side road line county maintaind gravel to 70000, I am hoping that this will put the price in line with what people of lesser means can afford
I love my home and property, michigan winters, taxes,and attitudes in general I can no longer stand.
If I had what I have in arkansas,missouri,n carolina,s carolina,georgia,florida,tenn,ky,and half a dozen other states, I would be sitting on easy street, but not in ol michigan, Nope.
How bad is michigan property values, what is selling?
My realtor just sent me a list of what sold, a newer 2500 sq foot two story with 2 car garage on 25 ac for 122500, It was a bank repo. and sale granted but this is what is selling. The auto industry collapse has destroyed the economy in michigan.
If you love the snow now is the time to buy in michigan. I can not get hurt as some people, as I bought in the last auto industry plung when chrystler bought out the last amrecian auto company amercian motors company by chrystler, which in turn was purchase by the germans, and now is laying off workers and shutting down 3 facrotys and trying to sell chryster off. The us car makers never learn. they get what they deserve. They make these big hummers, youkons,and other gas suckers then when the gas price goes up and single status symbol mom can no longer afford to run little jhonny to socker practice in it and it holds no value to trade in, and buyers flock to the better made, longer lasting, much better gas milage getting, japan made units. And we get what we have now, an economy that is the worst in the nation, Michigan has the worst economy among the 50 states.
And is shows no signs of recovering soon.
Michigan has no economy apart from the auto industry, it is all satalite business orbiting around the auto industry, when the michigans sun nova's [auto industry] even the north tourist industry collapses. we do not get tourists from the south, west or new england. They do not come to michigan in the numbers need to make a good economy.
We get out tourists from southern michigan, some from north ohio and indiana. a few from chicago. I do not see michigan coming out of this slump till the auto industry recovers, and I may not come back this time.
Ford still does not get it. btw bill ford has a 660 acre ranch in wolverine just down the road from me right next to lance lake. He wanted to keep it a secret. but then tried to shut down a easment to the pigen stream, and with his money got it shut down. *******s.

[CoffeeAddict]

I haven't had the time to read all of the responses, but I'll just offer my quick opinion on how bad Michigan is.

I live in a suburb, about 45 minutes by freeway from Detroit. It's a decent town, there's low crime, nice houses, and people are generally friendly.

But, I HATE it. I cannot wait to move. It's too cold, the housing is way too expensive, it's boreing, trust me when I say NOTHING happens here. If you're okay with going to Walmart to pass the time, don't need any culture or nightlife, then pick a Michigan suburb and you'll be happy.

Sure, there are a few places I wouldn't mind living in. Ann Arbor being one of them. But on the whole, I've lived here all my life and I'm not happy with it anymore. I probably never really was.

It's not a horrible place, but it certainly isn't wonderful either.

[endlosung]

I saw michigan go through the same type of rundown in the late 70s.
I saw flint almost dissapear off the map.
Low gas prices and quality come back in the auto industry [the 70s the us car industry made some of the worst crap ever put on the amercian people] slowly made a differance in michigan, in the early nintys to 2001 sep. michigan was a hot economy.
I can remember adds in the paper wanting carpenters with starting pay 20$ an hour and no exp. nessary warm bodies only.
After the last big dip in the early seventies the buzz was that michigan had to rebuild and not base its economy on the auto industry, but it did just that, and again here we are.
My wife worked with a girl that moved north to indian river with her husband, and they could not stay because their home would not sell for even what they owed on it in detroit.
It is a domino effect, Like I said in a post above, we do not get tourisim from florida, or california, we get it from southern michigan, chicago,ohio. When the economy in these areas collapse then it directly affects the the buying and selling of second homes, and building and people staying at hotels ect.
one of the towns that I live near [Gaylord] had a real chip on its shoulder in the 90s, It was a hot market. We used to say you could dig a hole pee in it and call it water front and some one would over pay for it.
now business has over built for the area, they are still putting in a town this size a home depo,lows,target,khols,starbucks,and every thing inbetween, People are not buying homes and coming north near as much, I do not know who will support these business.
The biggest employer Georgia Pacific shut down the plant. put 300 high paying jobs out to pasture.
Petoskey and harbor springs is a rich mans area and is seeing a slow down.
I do not see michigan coming back anytime soon.

[cksh]

I moved to Michigan in 94 for the job market. But since 2001 it has been horrible. Sure it has had its ups and downs since, but with all the layoffs the market is saturated with unemployed workers both salaried and hourly. I would not recommend moving to michigan for any reason. Unless you can be sure that you have security which is unlikely.

The housing market is horrible accross the country and Michigan is the canary. Unless you are planning on staying in the same house for 5 to 10 years do not try to buy. And because of this ,places like Lowes and Homedepot are performing poorly and anything else related to housing (construction etc) so its not just Automotive thats being affected, its one big circle and I do not see us recovering for a few years if at all.

The housing taxes are also horrible. I am gonna have to spend 5 grand a year just for a 200k house. That really affects how much house I can buy. I know we are not the worse for home tax but when the house is 60 years old in a just ok neighbord with just ok schools it tends to irritate me.

On the plus side there is plenty to do in Michigan if you can handle the cold (7 degrees and -18 wind chill here this winter) although I think the winter was mild.

It is most definitley a recreational state. Hunting, Snowmobiling, 4 wheeling, hiking etc. Not to mention the amount of lakes and watercraft to spend time on.

I would recommend moving near the east side (not actually in Detroit) or thereabouts if you are into the night life. Or Ann Arbor if you like the college town atmosphere. I do agree with one response regarding the suburbs and the lack of anything to do so be careful.

But overall I would say stay away from Michigan a few years if possible and more power to those who can tough it out. I am on my last ounce of patience and have been contemplating a move for the last year.

[ldyminerva]

My family and have decieded to move to Texas.....husband has family down there. I admit i'm scared cuz i've lived here my whole life and i have a good job here. But my husband can't find a job to save his life and the economdy is just so bad now that we have to go.....but i'm still so scared to move. cuz we don't have new jobs lined up and i do have a good job now.......but i can't support my family by myself. i'm so torn really and i don't know what to do!

[Fredly]

Speaking from the vantage point (if you want to call it that) of a person that actually lives in Grand Rapids, and have been here over twenty years, I have to tell you this much: Although it's bad now, we haven't seen anything yet. Unless you're in the medical field, or need medical attention, stay out. The Grand Jobs at Meijer are now Department managers, making a whopping 30k. I quit working for Meijer in '93 after 13 years, and made more then than most of them do now. Foremost Insurance has a boatload of telemarketing jobs, if you want one of those, but not many Executive jobs left. Show me a company in Grand Rapids that hasn't laid off a bunch of people in the last 2-3 years (besides the parasitic Wal-Mart) and I'll be surprised. Last year Detroit had 13,000 homes reposessed by banks due to forclosure, and it's filtering this way. I have a 5 year plan to get out of here before it implodes, and if you're not in Michigan by then, I'll leave the light on for you, because I may be the last one out.

[M TYPE X]

Grand Rapids isn't Muskegon. Don't be unnecessarily pessimistic.

Yes, I miss my home state.