How bad do you think MI really is? (Detroit: house, rent)

[Globusproject]

Originally Posted by ScrantonWilkesBarre

Well, for some people, the grass is always greener somewhere else. I'm sure there's people living in such sought-after communities as Naperville, IL, Boulder, CO, and Charlottesville, VA that do nothing but moan and groan about their individual miseries that were somehow attributed to the metro areas as a whole. Currently, I'm living in Scranton, and while it's certainly not a "great" place to live, the rebounding optimism and downtown economic stimulation that I've seen occurring in the city since Mayor Doherty took office has been enough to convince me to remain in the region for graduate school and potentially stay in the city to help it along on its revitalization process by rehabilitating an older home in which to raise my family and to open up my own CPA practice in a downtown office building.

Overall, the entire "Rust-Belt" region, extending from Upstate NY, through PA, OH, IN, and MI, (and arguably IL and WI) has always had to contend with an overwhelmingly bitter, pessimistic population. Thankfully, some communities have been seeing major reinvestment lately due largely to residents themselves starting to take pride in their communities again. I've been noticing rebounding optimism for the future in places such as the Lehigh Valley (Allentown, PA), Scranton, PA, the Capital District (Albany, NY), and Rochester, NY. Also, after poring over many of the MI threads, it appears a few cities in the Wolverine State (Ann Arbor, Grand Rapids, etc.) are beginning to win people back over again.

One thing I've noticed is that outside investment interest is beginning to occur left and right in many Rust-Belt cities, yet many natives in these areas are reluctant to accept new ideas and are resistant towards change that could potentially help to bring their cities back from the ashes (See some threads about Pittsburgh, PA, as a prime example of the "stay away" mentality).

As for me, if I wasn't so wrapped up in wanting to help Scranton to bounce back, I'd put MI right up on my list of top contenders for potential relocation. I've done thorough online research, and I find communities such as Saugatuck, Traverse City, Ann Arbor, Grand Rapids, and Lansing to be quite liveable for a Liberal "Progressive" type such as myself, who plans to establish his own business. I also see much potential in the restoration of all Michigan cities; at some point, the booming southwestern Sunbelt is going to run out of potable aquifers and reservoirs, sending residents packing and heading back north, at which point interest in the "Rust-Belt" will boom once again. If Scranton, the 1990s runner-up for "Armpit of America" has begun to round the corner towards a speedy recovery, then why are you Michiganders so hellbent on deciding that places such as Flint and Detroit are beyond the point of salvation?

Before you all start to chime in, I realize I've never been to Michigan. Nevertheless, I'm an urban pioneer who'd jump at the opportunity to help breathe new life into struggling urban cores as opposed to the wealthier townships that have fleeced their respective cities of their middle-class. Give me a rundown rowhome anyday in Downtown Saginaw, and I'd restore it, sell it to an empty-nester couple or young professional single for a marginal profit, and use that profit towards the purchase of another blighted property. If people such as myself see a "light at the end of the tunnel" for the "doom and gloom" of Michigan, then why can't any of you? Do you think Scranton hasn't faced similar struggles? Nevertheless, we'll soon be home to the "Wall Street West" movement, a new medical school, and a new commuter rail line into Manhattan, all of which should combine to cause property values to SOAR! Michigan has so much unexploited potential on every corner; why can't any of you appreciate the fine qualities your state has to offer?

REPLY PART I

I have lived in Michigan, gone to school all of my life except for 15 years that I spent in Europe (Italy and Switzerland) and Quebec, Canada. That is, for 35 years.

I applaud your attitude.

But first, Ann Arbor by no means is a problem city. It is a University town and they rent out much anything that they can to the 40,000 upper middle class students that invade the city every school year. But people in Ann Arbor tend to have a Berkely, CA attitude to life. Most people in Michigan consider Ann Arbor people as almost Californians!!! :-)

Grand Rapids, Traverse City and most "newer" towns in Michigan are coming back after the cave in of the central cities that we had in the 70's to presently. Even Detroit is putting many townhouses, with paved streets, good lighting and prices under $200,000, just South of the Detroit Medical Center.

[Globusproject]

Originally Posted by ScrantonWilkesBarre

Overall, the entire "Rust-Belt" region, extending from Upstate NY, through PA, OH, IN, and MI, (and arguably IL and WI) has always had to contend with an overwhelmingly bitter, pessimistic population. Thankfully, some communities have been seeing major reinvestment lately due largely to residents themselves starting to take pride in their communities again. I've been noticing rebounding optimism for the future in places such as the Lehigh Valley (Allentown, PA), Scranton, PA, the Capital District (Albany, NY), and Rochester, NY. Also, after poring over many of the MI threads, it appears a few cities in the Wolverine State (Ann Arbor, Grand Rapids, etc.) are beginning to win people back over again.

One thing I've noticed is that outside investment interest is beginning to occur left and right in many Rust-Belt cities, yet many natives in these areas are reluctant to accept new ideas and are resistant towards change that could potentially help to bring their cities back from the ashes (See some threads about Pittsburgh, PA, as a prime example of the "stay away" mentality).

As for me, if I wasn't so wrapped up in wanting to help Scranton to bounce back, I'd put MI right up on my list of top contenders for potential relocation. I've done thorough online research, and I find communities such as Saugatuck, Traverse City, Ann Arbor, Grand Rapids, and Lansing to be quite liveable for a Liberal "Progressive" type such as myself, who plans to establish his own business. I also see much potential in the restoration of all Michigan cities; at some point, the booming southwestern Sunbelt is going to run out of potable aquifers and reservoirs, sending residents packing and heading back north, at which point interest in the "Rust-Belt" will boom once again. If Scranton, the 1990s runner-up for "Armpit of America" has begun to round the corner towards a speedy recovery, then why are you Michiganders so hellbent on deciding that places such as Flint and Detroit are beyond the point of salvation?

REPLY PART II

There are tremendous investment opportunities for housing in Michigan. Ever since CompuWare decided to move from the suburban city of Farmington Hills to Detroit, there has been a influx of people back into Detroit. This was also because people got tired of driving for an 40 minutes to an hour to get into the city. The cost benefit analysis became negative at these distances.

Michigan's problem is that we are losing more automotive and manufacturing jobs than can be replaced with newer technology or service sector jobs. And most of the college students are leaving when they graduate. This brain drain has real long term consequences, as we may never get them back. A true loss of intellectual capital.

Because so many of the old wooden buildings are 60 years or older, many of them need to be either reconditioned or replaced. This is slowing occuring in Detroit. The city is being slowly rebuilt. There is a stream of revenue taxes that is available for city services. And the Mayor Kwame Kilpatrick has said that if the cities unions don't cooperate, then he will outsource their jobs.

Street lights are coming back on, city services are being provided and the city is starting to function and be managed like a major US city should be managed. As a CPA, you must understand that the City of Detroit has been mismanaged and financially mismanaged since the 60's. Because of the continual problems in Detroit the State of Michigan and the suburbs are now demanding that they clean up their act. From Water distribution to the suburbs (owned by the City of Detroit who sets their rates in a interesting manner) to SE Michigan Transportation (SEMTA) Authority, there is some cooperation with Detroit. CompuWare moving downtown seems to have had a positive effect as with the IT Company moving in to Detroit the city seems to have implemented some computer systems and the management or performance management of the city seems to be better.

I don't know how bad things are in Bay City and Saginaw, but with the Saginaw Transmission plant and tha type of industry shutting down up there, and in Flint Michigan, it could be worse than in Detroit.

What people don't like in Detroit is the gangs and the breakdown of the family with the father being absent, the mother not being able to control the sons and some wildness occuring with male adolescents. Added that the Detroit Public Schools are suboptimal teaching levels, and that they had a strke (for nothing) which caused another 12,000 children to go into suburban public schools, the City of Detroit is trying to solve these major problems. Kwame can only do so much.

[Globusproject]

Originally Posted by ScrantonWilkesBarre

One thing I've noticed is that outside investment interest is beginning to occur left and right in many Rust-Belt cities, yet many natives in these areas are reluctant to accept new ideas and are resistant towards change that could potentially help to bring their cities back from the ashes (See some threads about Pittsburgh, PA, as a prime example of the "stay away" mentality).

As for me, if I wasn't so wrapped up in wanting to help Scranton to bounce back, I'd put MI right up on my list of top contenders for potential relocation. I've done thorough online research, and I find communities such as Saugatuck, Traverse City, Ann Arbor, Grand Rapids, and Lansing to be quite liveable for a Liberal "Progressive" type such as myself, who plans to establish his own business. I also see much potential in the restoration of all Michigan cities; at some point, the booming southwestern Sunbelt is going to run out of potable aquifers and reservoirs, sending residents packing and heading back north, at which point interest in the "Rust-Belt" will boom once again. If Scranton, the 1990s runner-up for "Armpit of America" has begun to round the corner towards a speedy recovery, then why are you Michiganders so hellbent on deciding that places such as Flint and Detroit are beyond the point of salvation?

Before you all start to chime in, I realize I've never been to Michigan. Nevertheless, I'm an urban pioneer who'd jump at the opportunity to help breathe new life into struggling urban cores as opposed to the wealthier townships that have fleeced their respective cities of their middle-class. Give me a rundown rowhome anyday in Downtown Saginaw, and I'd restore it, sell it to an empty-nester couple or young professional single for a marginal profit, and use that profit towards the purchase of another blighted property. If people such as myself see a "light at the end of the tunnel" for the "doom and gloom" of Michigan, then why can't any of you? Do you think Scranton hasn't faced similar struggles? Nevertheless, we'll soon be home to the "Wall Street West" movement, a new medical school, and a new commuter rail line into Manhattan, all of which should combine to cause property values to SOAR! Michigan has so much unexploited potential on every corner; why can't any of you appreciate the fine qualities your state has to offer?

Reply Part III

The suburbs are absorbing these new students and the parents, and once they get out of Detroit and get to visit the suburbs they realize things are not that bad and they move out of Detroit, in droves. Putting more pressure on Detroit to clean up their act. This is a very good thing. Detroit is now working to compete for students, employees, corporations to come to live, work and play in Detroit. If not, everyone will be leaving Detroit to come and live in the suburbs. Oakland County is the 4th richest per capita county in the USA. We have a Billion $ budget surplus. So much so that Brooks Patterson, the County Executive offered the Governor Granholm (D) the money as a loan to help solve the debts of the State of Michigan. L. Brooks Patteson (R) also got the Small Business Tax removed in Michigan causing a $1.8 Billion shortfall in taxes.

Causing the State to further cut expenditures, cut services and run a tight ship. In retaliation, the Governor refused to sign and vetoed a bill that would have allowed counties to borrow money now to finance the Healthcare costs over the next twenty years. As a CPA you would appreciate the ability to finance tomorrows problems at todays cheap interest rates!!! Instead of a budget in Oakland County being in the black, we are now $9 million in the red this year. Brooks Patterson is not happy with the Governor. And she is not happy with Brooks for giving her another two Billion dollar shortfall!!! Michigan should be $800 Million in the red this year and will go to 3 Billion in the next couple of years!!!

So there is great opportunity in hard times here in Michigan for those that see the possibilities.

When are you coming up here??? We could use you to help finance a few big deals.

[Globusproject]

Originally Posted by Carrera4S

All I know is that as soon as all the I's get dotted and the T's get crossed with regard to the aquisition of BellSouth by AT&T, I'M OUTTA HERE!!! Tennessee here I come. No more paying $4-5k to insure two cars with no tickets/accidents. No more paying $1500-2000 for homeowners insurance. No more having to volunteer for "Angel's Night" trying to prevent the knuckleheads who live here from burning the place down. No more $600 gas bills in the wintertime, HELL, NO MORE WINTERTIME!!! No more dealing with security storm doors and bars across windows. Looking forward to selling my house here, taking the proceeds to buy a bigger house down there and pay only a third of the property taxes for a bigger home. I make $80k per year AND I CANNOT AFFORD TO LIVE IN DETROIT. Bye Kwamme, bye Jennifer, bye Ford, GM and Chrysler (never bought your cars anyway). Gonna miss my Detroit Piston's, Fred Lavery Porsche/Audi and Aston Martin of Troy. Yes I'll have to pay 9.75% sales tax on the first $1600 of whatever I purchase but this will be offset by the fact that I won't have to pay local/state income taxes. When I got out of the Navy back in 1989, all I could think of was "coming home to Detroit". Turns out it wasn't one of the more 'intelligent" decisions I've made in my life. A lot of you say "Don't talk badly about Detroit". On one side, I agree with you. If you are not from here nor have ever been here then no, you have no right to speak negatively about Detroit. However, if you are like myself and have been stuck in this 'hellhole' for a number of years while at the same time dealing with all the crap you have to deal with to live here, I feel you are more than justified in dogging this place to the bitter end. Detroit has no job market to speak of. Detroit has no housing market to speak of. Detroit has no mass-transportation system to speak of. Detroit does however have redlined insurance rates and ridiculous property tax rates and I believe that the citizens of Detroit subsidize the suburbs when it comes to DTE energy bills. I recall several years ago looking at a house in N. Rosedale Park with a price of $184,000 and a house in Novi for $187,000. The taxes in Detroit were $5900 per year. The taxes in Novi, $2400. The basic makeup of cities usually goes like this.

You have Downtown
Then you have the Ghetto
Then you have the residential areas
Then you have the suburbs

In Detroit it's more like this
You have Downtown
You have the Ghetto
You have some neighborhoods
You have another Ghetto
You have some more neighborhoods
Still another Ghetto
A couple more neighborhoods
and finally,
The Suburbs

So why are you living in Detroit and paying three times the car insurance rates, twice the property taxes and double the home insurance rates???

Why don't you move to Northville and get out of the "hellhole' of Detroit???

As you said, it is the local knuckleheads that are causing the robberies, the car thefts, the drugs, the murders with the resultant increase in insurance rates.

What are you living in Detroit putting up with that. Come and move to the suburbs. Leave it to the knucklehads until the City starts to solve these problem with the knuckleheads.

[Globusproject]

Originally Posted by magellan

Got a source for that foreclosure "factoid" there sociologist?

People here seem to keep perpetuating the same falsehood, that Michigan leads the country in foreclosures. For December 2006:

1 Colorado
2 Nevada
3 Georgia
4 Massachusetts
5 Texas
6 Michigan
7 Ohio

http://realestate.msn.com/buying/Art...mentid=2507006

Grand Rapids city has a 60% homeownership rate
Lansing 58%
Muskegon 57%
Jackson 57%
Michigan as a whole 76%
National average 68.9%

http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0004920.html

Pfizer's news was not good, but hardly the crash you're talking about.

People over in Ann Arbor knew it was coming sooner or later. The Asst. Director of Bioinformatics at Pfizer left a year and a half ago and started working with the University of Michigan to develop Bioinformatics Research Grid (National Centers for Biomedical Computing-NCBC). Pfizer was pulling out of that area then. 25,000 good paying jobs gone. And Michigan doesn't have much of a pharmaceutical industry left. With Parke-Davis and Upjohn now gone.

But we do have high home ownership and this will only affect the Ann Arbor area mostly. But job growth and development is strong on the West part of the State.

[Globusproject]

Originally Posted by joenc

The majority of the well paying jobs are not created through the tax breaks and proverbial race to the bottom. Raleigh-Durham is seeing biotech announcements every other week of 500+ new jobs, Charlotte is seeing many new jobs in the financial sector and professional services. The rural areas are the only ones seeing any dollars from the incentive games, and they haven't recovered at all - they were hit hardest of all in the recession.

I'm originally from Michigan, but I moved down with my parents to Charlotte 8 years ago. Michigan is a very depressing place nowadays, and I can say the grass is greener in the major growing cities of the South (especially if you have skills and are educated). Metro Atlanta, Raleigh, Austin, Charlotte are all great choices and have higher median incomes and higher education-obtainment rates than most cities in Michigan before 2000.

Good to know about the jobs in the Biotechn sector in Raleigh-Durham areas. I have been contacted about work at Warsau in Charlotte. Seems that is the new banking capital of the USA.

If things don't work out in Grand Rapids, I may be down there in the Atlantic States with you.

The danger of a hurricane once in a while down there, is much better than the constant hot air coming out of Lansing, MI all of the time.

[Globusproject]

Originally Posted by Sociologist

They then are not calculated into our state percentage. If you have ever seen "Cool City" signs around Jackson or small communities a long time friend and class mate of mine who now is a city planner has funded a lot of initiative for that program. I too have had a role in meeting with city officials discussing alternative ways to stimulate growth. I also have a problem with the media, especially the papers. If your a reporter you can do little research and publish your information and Joe Shmoe will believe it, and not think twice about it. Yes, a lot of people talk really bad about Michigan, and the only reason I have is because of how I have had to watch it go down hill in the last decade. What can we do? Virtually nothing, unless you can change the demographic makeup of our state to attract different employers. To people thinking of moving here: If your industry is thriving, then Michigan will probably be the highest paying place you can find, with great housing value. If your in manufacturing or education, maybe you should reconsider or find a community that needs those areas. Overall, I am sadden by what our leaders are doing, and not doing.

You had the chance to change leadership in the November election. But it seems like the women in this State voted for the woman Governor incumbent. Even though you have just said that there is bad leadership. You had the past CEO of Amway running for governor in an effort to help solve the business problems of Michigan. He had the support of the people who could help bring capital and investment to Michigan. And who did you all vote for??? A lawyer (who was born in Canada by the way) who has not the support of the business community and who has no clue about what has to be done to fix Michigan's economy.

The whole tax abatement discussion is misrepresented. You can tax a company. Or you can have the company employ people and tax the well paid people. On one hand you have people with no jobs getting by with welfare and unemployement and on the other hand you get people with jobs who pay taxes. Which one did you say you wanted??? If other states are wanted the companies to come into their state with no taxes on the companies, then you have to compete. You don't get to make the rules of the game. You have to compete with other states are doing. Period. This B.S. where you are not sure about the tax abatement. Well if you don't get the company into your state, you don't get the corporate taxes nor do you get the employee taxes. So you go without ANY revenue income and everyone pays for your lack of insight into how the states must compete with each other. The founding fathers wanted the best ideas in state government to compete with the worst ideas. Those that are managed well will prosper over thost that are badly managed. And which camp have you chose to put Michigan with your vote for an incumbent Governor who hasn't a clue to what has to be done to create jobs in Michigan????

The election was decided by women, mostly single and some married who didn't vote for the male Republican candidate who was very qualified to run a $42 Billion State economy. This was the group that decided the election in November 2006. Amway BTW runs the company in 70 countries worldwide. Dick DeVos had plans to heavily invest in modernizing the State government, cutting the cost of delivering services to Michigan's Citizens. And he was going to invest heavily in new technologies. And cut business taxes to get companies to move into Michigan instead of moving into Indiana as they have been.

But the lawyers, the unions, the teachers and the academics and scientists generally supported Jennifer Granholm (and sociologists) to continue her march into the sea. She absolutely refuses to lower taxes and cut spending. And at the same time she is refusing to absolutely stop the insane welfare system where you can stay on welfare forever in Michigan. Welfare is to help you get over the bumps in life. It is NOT a way of life.

So the people of Michigan, you could say, deserve the leadership that they have voted for.

[Globusproject]

Originally Posted by Sociologist

All the talk about moving out: I have lived in 3 states, NC, IN, and MI. Raleigh, NC, Fort Wayne, IN, and several cities in Michigan. I must say that everything is realitive and will stay that way. Raleigh was nice, and yes NC has the highest influx of people right now but they also have problems: Raleigh has three of the largest universities in the nation, and many doctoral graduates running around working at the mall. A whole lot of over qualified people. Fort Wayne was one of the cheapest places I've ever seen, but finding a position that payed 30K was unheard of; no room for growth. I've lived in metro Detroit, Ann Arbor, and Chelsea area. Many displaced factory and automotive workers looking for a job pushes the young and elders (who still work) down into low paying wages. Would I move back to Michigan if I left (which I am leaving). Yes, if the state was to begin investing in high tech industry and if we had a entirely new tax system, government and initiatives. If your looking to relocate to MI: Grand Rapids, Ann Arbor, and Metro Detroit have the most abundant employment. Anyone looking to move out: You'll find different problems that will hamper you to do things as well. Move where you want to and be happy!

The college educated have skills sets that are in demand. Unskilled workers can at best hope to make $10 in Michigan presently. Many times it is $8.00 an hour.

Again, unless you get a company that wants to come into Michigan and create jobs, you have unemployment, with the government paying benefits and neither the company nor the employees (unemployed employees) paying any taxes what so ever.

So rather than give tax abatements you would prefer what has been going on her in Michigan to continue to occur.

SBC moved 1000 jobs out of the State of Michigan because the Governor refused to give any tax abatements to them. They moved the jobs to Indiana, Wisconsin and Illinois.

This great leadership is so good, that if it keeps up, would the last person who leaves the State of Michigan, please turn out the lights (if they are still on and haven't already been turned off because no on had the money to pay the pill in the first place!!!).

[Globusproject]

Originally Posted by Spats

I have lived in Michigan for 42 years- born and raised in Flint, and lived for 7 years in Kalamazoo on the west side of the state. Let's see...you have world class violence along the I 75 corridor with Saginaw, Flint, and Detroit leading the COUNTRY in violent crime. This is not new. Flint and Detroit have been on a downward slide since the riot in Detroit in 67, and the 73 oil embargo pretty much killed Flint. Just to make sure GM whacked 60,000 jobs in 86.. But let me be clear GM did not owe Flint anything, the city had the highest per capita income in the country in the late sixties and early seventies yet neither the city fathers, nor the state leaders did anything to diversify the economy...hence when GM sneezes Detroit got penumonia..and Flint got the Buboinc plague! Before you get all excited about the west side of the state take a look at all of the job losses from Pfizer, GM, James River, Steelcase, and others and it doesn't look good. When we moved back to east side of the state we were shocked at how much more we had to pay for a comparable home - our old home in Kzoo just sold under appraisal again- 7 years later. In the meantime we have re-elected a WEAK gov. who has done nothing for the state of consequence. In plain terms she either a) is useless..or b) is great or at least good..and threfore no one can do anything..in which case cancel Christmas...we are in deep **** and sinking fast. Other than the economy and record violence (Detroit most dangerous city in America in 2006, Flint number 2), bad roads, and crubmbling infrastructure - we are also cursed with some of the worst weather in the country, and probably the worst. While some other states are colder by a margin, we claim victory (or is it defeat?) by virture of the fact that we have about 300 cloudy days. Look at CNN's analysis of best places to live and observe that Scottsdale, AZ enjoys 223 days of sunshine to our 65...and you will see why so much scotch is consumed in this state 9 months out of the year. As for my hometown...time and space do not permit elocution as to the pathetic, disgusting and vile levels to which it has sunk. If you want to see the future of Flint- pick up a copy of Coleman Youngs autobiography...you'll get the idea...the current mayor holds a 9th grade education, is a convicted felon, and is engaged in open hatred and war with his own police department! Oh for all of you ' we love west michigan' people - take a look at the racial tensions in Grand Rapids, Niles, Kalamazoo, and of course Benton Harbor and you'll get a good idea of why you should not bash the east side. As for Traverse City, and the rest of the super frigid north and UP- I say bravo- and congrats on avoiding skin cancer since you NEVER see the sun, and have warm weather a whole 77 day s a year..there are people in Greenland who see more real sunshine- but damn those leaves are pretty in the fall..which brings me to the " I love the change of seasons crowd" and to them I say - what seasons? Michigan football kicks off to 93 degrees every year and somewhere around Halloween goes to 10 below and the sun disappears for oh about 7 or 8 months...during which we get to enjoy opening day for the Tigers while wearing a skimask and thermal underpants. So why don't I leave? I have been lucky enough to have an outstanding job for almost all of my working life- and an income that would be difficult to recreate quickly elsewhere, I have close family ties, and long term friendships..and here I stay..there are some other attriubutes, good golf courses, Troy is a cool little city, northern michigan is beautiful for the 70 days of summer, and Michigan is a superb sports state. But it's mostly the job and family, and MOSTLY family that cements me here. I cherish the closeness with my small clan more than the torment of riding the back of a stubmbling, mortally wounded dinosaur. I use the ability to buy a winter home someday in AZ of FLA, or NV as total motivation to be work hard adn be successful....for a tragedy indeed if I were to clutch the Tryanosaur's neck for another 40 plus years....methinks It would long prior collapse in a heap taking my tired, angry, light deprived carcass with it. So my advice is as the man once said- " Go West Young Man"- and no, I do not mean Battle Creek!!!!

We have terrible leadership and we have a state ful of uneducate yokels who have no idea how to manage a $42 Billion state economy.

Would the last person in Michigan who has a good paying job please pay the light bill so when we leave the state, we don't have to turn out the lights???

[Globusproject]

Originally Posted by Sociologist

I must agree, but shall not indulge in the strife of Michigan's downfall. That IS just the word for it....tragic. And no one seems to be interested in changing th effects (those in power to do so). When you encompass a nearly 1 billion shortfall for state money your talking about decades of recovery. State and local media has continued to ignore and distort truth about our state and the severity of our situation. Automotive is no longer a Michigan term, it is a ball and chain that Granholm is trying to hold on to. Southern states such as Alabama and Louisiana have taken the premise of manufacturing due to the fact that no unions exist in those areas. Encompass change or encompass nothing". As a Michigan native its becoming sad to continue to see the state dive but help cant come from the common individual. But what will staying in the state do? Restructuring takes decades, and more so for a state that has been built on manufacturing for over a century. Come back to Mi in 40 years....maybe

The first step was to change the leadership in Lansing. And then start making the innovative changes that must occur if Michigan is to recover.

People had the chance to change things at the elections in 2006 but they chose not to do anything. So we will sit here for four years and watch the deficit go up to $3 Billion and then when the liberals get desperate enough, they will finally admit that they have not a clue as to what economics and business management are.

When do you think Michigan will have riots again???

As a sociologist??? Summer of 2007??? Maybe the long hot summer of 2008???

Reminds me of 1967.......


I guess that still remains one of the power perks of being a Governor- calling out the National Guard when you economic policies stink.