[tuebor]

I moved to Grand Rapids for a temporary job last summer. Now the job is completed, and I'm considering moving from Grand Rapids to someplace closer to the lakeshore, most likely Muskegon, Grand Haven, or Spring Lake/Ferrysburg. I'd appreciate any information about the Muskegon-Grand Haven area. Can anyone tell me what these places are like?

I'd like to buy a house, and I see that Muskegon has some nice beaches and good deals on homes, but the city seems kind of dreary and I'm concerned about the high crime index. Grand Haven seems nice, but it's much more expensive, and maybe a little too touristy.

I'll be working at home (writing) and maybe doing some part-time teaching at colleges in the area, so finding a job is not an issue, although staying closer to Grand Rapids would probably mean less driving.

Any advice?

[Siberia]

Originally Posted by tuebor

I

I'd like to buy a house, and I see that Muskegon has some nice beaches and good deals on homes, but the city seems kind of dreary and I'm concerned about the high crime index. Grand Haven seems nice, but it's much more expensive, and maybe a little too touristy.

Any advice?

Remember if the deals are too good, there is a reason. Muskegon, at least the northern parts of that area, have much higher rates of crime and lower school quality ratings (at least from looking at ratings from Moderator cut: linking to competitors sites is not allowed), etc...than say the southern side of Muskegon like Norton Shores (considered the "rich" side...not sure why though).

Spring Lake seems like a middle ground area...not too much tourist, not too much crime, good schools, etc. Grand Haven is a little expensive, but nice all around other than the increasing population density that is disolving the small town feel it used to have a few years ago.

Holland...well pretty much dutch and lots of tourism, and again south side more conservative than north side (do you like to mow grass on Sunday...people sometime complain on south side depending on exact location, etc). Still, holland seems well rounded...just avoid certain central parts that house the Latin King gang...although under control over the last few years, they tend to enjoy burning down rival gang enemy houses on occasion and they invest heavily in spray painting at times. It is extremely area dependant...and only a small part of south/central inner holland city limits.

Also, don't put too much emphasis on living "near the lakeshore". Taxes are higher, more crowded housing, lake effect snow is constant issue in winter within 1-3 miles from Lake MI, and cost of land is beyond reasonable (30-60K/acre)....is it really that much better living 1-3 minutes from Lake MI versus 5-10 minutes way?

Siberia

P.S. Don't go to Zeeland city limits unless you enjoy paying 2x property taxes versus counties 10 minutes away. $2K/100K of home adds up quick in Zealand...

[tuebor]

Thanks, Siberia!
I've come to similar conclusions about "near the lakeshore". I've added Fruitport to my list of places to look at, but I think I'm the wrong ethnicity and religion for Holland.

I haven't ruled out Muskegon yet; some of the good deals are in the south side. There is also the city of North Muskegon (not the north side of Muskegon), which has lower crime (due to geography it's almost like a gated community). It's more expensive than Muskegon but cheaper than Ottawa county.

[Siberia]

Originally Posted by tuebor

Thanks, Siberia!
I've come to similar conclusions about "near the lakeshore". I've added Fruitport to my list of places to look at, but I think I'm the wrong ethnicity and religion for Holland.

If you happen to be Hispanic then Holland is actually, if memory serves, about 20% Hispanic by population. A few hispanic members of the Latin King gang caused tensions for the whites every few years, but by most accounts it is under control. As for African American, the numbers used to be extremely, extremely low when I use to live in Ottawa County and I'm not exactly sure why as good, high paying jobs exist in Holland...and Holland could sure use the diversity (even more diversity for different types of white people other than white Dutch...as there is a saying that "If you ain't Dutch, you ain't much").

Originally Posted by tuebor

I haven't ruled out Muskegon yet; some of the good deals are in the south side. There is also the city of North Muskegon (not the north side of Muskegon), which has lower crime (due to geography it's almost like a gated community). It's more expensive than Muskegon but cheaper than Ottawa county.

Be sure to visit and talk to individuals in the area(s) you are thinking about in Muskegon, as like you said it is very area specific in terms of a safe place to live. At least a long time ago when I lived near there, some places in Muskegon where not safe no matter what ethnic background one belonged...poverty in spots seemed to create some crime issues.

[cbsmith]

There are many places to live in the Muskegon area that are hidden gems. I absolutely love North Muskegon, Lakeside, and the Norton Shores area. Not touristy at all, plus clean clean beaches. Please email me for more information. I'm a Realtor in Muskegon and can show you around!

[Schaumburger]

Originally Posted by tuebor

Thanks, Siberia!
I've come to similar conclusions about "near the lakeshore". I've added Fruitport to my list of places to look at, but I think I'm the wrong ethnicity and religion for Holland.

I haven't ruled out Muskegon yet; some of the good deals are in the south side. There is also the city of North Muskegon (not the north side of Muskegon), which has lower crime (due to geography it's almost like a gated community). It's more expensive than Muskegon but cheaper than Ottawa county.

Do you honestly think Holland will not except you because of your ethnicity and religion? The Holland area is a growing multi-cultural community praised for its steps towards diversity.

If you're worried about being accepted I'd look at Grand Rapids'. If you go beyond perception -- it's more than meets the eye.

[Chelle D]

I grew up in Muskegon and still have family there (I am in GR now). I also have family in Holland. I think it all depends on what you find with regard to housing and how far away you are okay with living from wherever you teach. I do think the outskirts of Muskegon have improved and the area between Norton Shores and Grand Haven is nice. Fruitport is in there so that might be good for you. What's important to you? Schools? Lakeshore? Shopping? Small-Town feel? There are many areas in there that would work for you.

[ipsect04tl]

Originally Posted by Schaumburger

Do you honestly think Holland will not except you because of your ethnicity and religion? The Holland area is a growing multi-cultural community praised for its steps towards diversity.

If you're worried about being accepted I'd look at Grand Rapids'. If you go beyond perception -- it's more than meets the eye.

Holland is indeed quite diverse, but collectively very conservative. Holland holds the U.S record for highest number of churches per capital. While it is home to a large Latino and Asian population, quite frankly Holland is very mundane and literally pure "red".

[Siberia]

Originally Posted by ipsect04tl

Holland is indeed quite diverse....

Holland is 70% white, 22% Hispanic, and very, very few other races...as you can not count seeing blacks driving up US 31 through Holland going to Muskegon as a "diverse Holland"...we are talking residents here, not commuters or pass through travelers. To say Holland is diverse is a stretch of the imagination IMO, and also according to the statistics listed on this very site itself, along with many others:

Races in Holland (city-data.com statistics:

White Non-Hispanic (70.0%)
Hispanic (22.2%)
Other race (12.4%)
Two or more races (2.7%)
Black (2.5%)
Other Asian (1.7%)
American Indian (1.1%)
Vietnamese (0.6%)

Beyond race, Holland is DEFINATELY conservative...for example, a huge stink was raised when a local tanning salon had an ad on a billboard along US31 that showed a woman in a full coverage bikini...who was laying flat on top of a guy's back (Not face to face) on a beach. Both had tans...nothing sexually exposed or suggestive, simply two beautiful youger people with tans laying on a beach. I can't say if was the tans that disturbed so many people (tans are rare in Holland due to lack of sun..LOL) or the fact fact the models were physically fit unlike the majority of americans...whatever the issue, it was pulled down after a huge stink by Holland residents. In another 30 years, this won't happen with the new generation IMO...but the older generation defines the city at the moment. Can't even buy a beer on Sunday, and I have had multiple friends who live in Holland (south side especiallY) who have had neighbors complain when mowing on Sunday... If only folks understood where the word "Sun-Day" came from...

Originally Posted by ipsect04tl

Holland holds the U.S record for highest number of churches per capital.

Not only will the Gov of Michigan "Blow you away", so will the number, size, and cost of the mega churches in Holland Michigan. From an outsider looking in, Holland has many corporate churches running mulit-million dollar enterprises living income tax free, including paying zero property taxes on 50-100 acres of high value land in many areas near and inside of Holland Michigan. And to think of the cost of heating such huge volume spaces for the 7 months of winter...tens of thousands of dollars a year of donations "up in flames", so folks can meet for a few hours on Sunday and have bible study Wednesday night.... It is amazing where the donations go...or do not go, as it was enough to make me start directing my donations direct to actual causes, and less to the church. Why you ask, things such as watching one mega church repeatedly take a "seperate" offering a few years ago to build a $80,000 clock tower that "dings" every hour...but fails to be high enough to reach God it would seem. Basically, if you didn't grow up in the area, be prepared to be "blown away"...or perhaps not. If Michigan really wanted to solve the deficits, perhaps they should tax churches worth more than a million dollars....

Luckily, there are many churches who have not super sized yet, and spend a higher percentage of donations on helping others versus bulding, heating, and maintaining their mega structures. In summary, Holland is a city of churches, with a few residential houses sprinkled in......so you will most likely find one of your liking, as long as you are Christian. Of the 56% of residents who are religious, 11% are Catholic, 12% Protestant, 32% "Other Christian", and 0.22% LDS (according to Moderator cut: linking to competitors sites is not allowed). "Other Christian" must mean "Reformed", as most churches in Holland have the word "Reformed" before the church name on the church signs. Long story...Google it...

Holland definately has its pros and cons...you just need to learn the nuances in order to be happy in Holland long term, as due the explosive population increase over a short number of years (fastest growing city in the USA a decade ago), it has a interesting mix of character, tradition, people, business, and history...at least when I used to live there a few years ago, that was the case...

Siberia

[midwestgirl]

I grew up in Laketon Township, just out side of North Muskegon. It was a nice area. Have you tried Whitehall? Small town feeling.