[telepicker97]

I mean REALLY...it can't be as bad as everyone makes it out to be, right?

And how bad are the winters there?

[Bydand]

Originally Posted by telepicker97

I mean REALLY...it can't be as bad as everyone makes it out to be, right?

And how bad are the winters there?

No it isn't as bad as a some people will have you believe. Is it as good as it was a few years ago? No, but neither is most places in the US right now. As for winters, depends on where you are in the state and where you are coming from. In general if you are coming from Minnesota, it will be like a tropical paradise; if you are coming from Key West it will be like an ice age has set in and you are about to freeze to death. There is a wide range of winter weather in Michigan. From an average of 40+ inches down in the Battle Creek area to 200+ averages in Hancock area in the UP.

[mewith3]

It isn't good and many more jobs are leaving - my guess is all the announcements haven't been made as to what's shutting down, and yes many are automotive related.

try this link:

Michigan Economy at a Glance

In the survey of data found here:
America's Top States for Business 2007- CNBC.com
Michigan was rated 41st

and from the Detroit News in June 2008:
Wednesday, June 13, 2007
Worst yet to come for Michigan economy
'A lot needs to go right for the state economy to bottom out,' Comerica's chief economist says.
Louis Aguilar / The Detroit News

Michigan is quickly becoming a "relatively poor state" that is likely to get poorer unless the auto industry rebounds to pull the economy out of its "one-state recession," according to Comerica Bank's chief economist.

The analysis released Tuesday by economist Dana Johnson echoes recent gloomy assessments from other experts and is sapping hope that Michigan will halt its long slide.

Johnson backed away from predictions he made last year that the state's job losses, distressed real estate market and declining population might begin to trend upward this year.

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"A lot needs to go right for the state economy to bottom out," Johnson wrote. "Michigan's one-state recession is now three years old and counting."

Last year, Michigan was the only state with a shrinking gross domestic product, or GDP, Johnson noted. GDP is the value of all goods and services produced in the state, and in 2006 it fell 0.5 percent, while the national GDP grew 3.4 percent. In 2003, Michigan's GDP ranked 23rd in the United States. Last year it fell to 35th.

Johnson's new report doesn't predict when the state may catch up with the rest of the nation. Not only would the U.S. economy -- beset by high gas prices, slowing growth and a deflating real estate bubble -- need to get stronger, but Detroit automakers would need to halt their market share slide and return to profitability.

"Even if all that occurs, the recovery in the near term will be gradual," Johnson said in his quarterly Michigan Brief.

The report is the latest to find Michigan's economy in the grips of profound structural change, and to declare that how or when it will end is unclear. The state's economy is almost 700 percent more concentrated in the auto industry than the national economy. While the U.S. economy has been creating jobs for the past three years, Michigan has seen tens of thousands of jobs vanish.

"The Michigan economy remains stuck in a crater formed by the impact of the domestic auto industry," said the most recent University of Michigan economic outlook released in May.

A March Southeast Michigan Council of Governments report predicts losses in the auto industry will keep Metro Detroit mired in an economic funk.

If the forecasts are correct, the changes herald profound implications for health care, housing, education and government throughout the region and state.

The pain stems mainly from three industries: manufacturing, construction and government. They accounted for more than 80 percent of the state's GDP declines from 2003 to 2006, Johnson wrote.

The auto industry accounts for 6 percent of Michigan's GDP, yet its influence is devastating -- the loss of one auto job affects three others, Johnson noted.

The state lost 20,000 auto jobs from April 2006 to April 2007, the latest data available. Michigan also lost 26,600 nonauto jobs during the same period.

In the 1950s and '60s, Michigan was among the most prosperous states. Workers flocked here in hopes of getting good-paying factory jobs. In the mid-1960s, Michigan accounted for 4.5 percent of the country's overall population and had the ninth-highest U.S. per-capita income.

Today, Michigan makes up about 3.5 percent of the nation's population, and its $33,000 per-capita income in 2005 ranked 22nd among states, Johnson said.

But Detroit automakers are showing some signs of life. In May, buoyed by a surge in demand for cars, crossovers and fuel-sipping hybrids, U.S. auto sales jumped 5 percent.

General Motors Corp. sales rose 9.6 percent over last May, giving the automaker 23.7 percent of the domestic market. The Chrysler Group reported a 4.3 percent gain in May, for a 12.7 percent market share. Only Ford Motor Co. slipped, with sales falling 6.9 percent in May, giving it 16.5 percent of the market.

"It seems General Motors has leveled off. Ford and Chrysler are not losing dramatic market share," said Kim Hill, an economist with the Center for Automotive Research in Ann Arbor. "Most people like to say Michigan needs to diversify its economy. But the truth is Michigan really needs to diversify its auto base."

[mewith3]

Originally Posted by telepicker97

I mean REALLY...it can't be as bad as everyone makes it out to be, right?

And how bad are the winters there?

Sorry forgot to answer the 2nd question:
Winters aren't that bad, imo. I also think it all depends on what you are used to.

I grew up in upstate NY in "snowbelt" country. So quantity her is less.

To me what I find bad about the snow here is the lack of cleaning it up as it snows. It seems they always wait until it stops making the in-between times if you have to travel worse. Never happened where I lived.

[mich2fla]

I live in the Grand Rapids area...construction is booming downtown and south of town on M6. It's a great time to buy a house if you have a steady job.

Last winter we had a lot of snow...most of it came in Feburary and the snow stuck around. Most winters, we get a break and see the grass between snow falls. The cold doesn't really bother us much.

[Bydand]

Originally Posted by mewith3

Sorry forgot to answer the 2nd question:
Winters aren't that bad, imo. I also think it all depends on what you are used to.

I grew up in upstate NY in "snowbelt" country. So quantity her is less.

To me what I find bad about the snow here is the lack of cleaning it up as it snows. It seems they always wait until it stops making the in-between times if you have to travel worse. Never happened where I lived.

Agree the snow removal is useless here. Always has been, probably always will be.

[Ivorytickler]

Originally Posted by telepicker97

I mean REALLY...it can't be as bad as everyone makes it out to be, right?

And how bad are the winters there?

1 out of 12 people here is out of work and on unemployment. But that unemployment rate doesn't consider people like me who just lost 60% of my former income just to have a job. I suppose if you never lost your job, it doesn't look bad here but if you did, you appreciate just how bad the market is.

During the 9 months I was on unemployment, I had 4 job offers. Three of them from out of state without solicitation. The fourth is the teaching job I took for this year. I'm lucky to have that and I know it. With an impressive resume, education and experience, I was floored to have not even a nibble in S.E. Michigan in engineering. Several of my coworkers who were let go when I was walked away from homes and left the state. Two more are still trying to sell as they can't find work either.

FTR, we're not slackers. We were let go in something like the sixth round of reductions in our former company but none of us found work other than temp assignments. I think I"m the first one to find a job in state and I'm making a lot less than I was before. Hopefully, it will be enough that I can hold out until I can sell my house and then I can start looking out of state. If I'd been free to move, I would have been working within a month of being laid off. Maybe we should have just walked away from out house like I've seen others do. When I look at what I'm making now, I don't think it's worth it to stay. Not when I can make three times as much elsewhere and find work in only a few weeks.

It's pretty depressing here if you're among the unemployed. I suppose if you never lost your job in the first place, it probably looks pretty good. Hence you'll hear different answers from different people. It didnt look that bad to me until I got my pink slip. Then it looked awful. Still does. Maybe I should follow my best friend. She went on vacation to Kentucky for a week and came back with two job offers. She keeps telling me there are plenty of jobs there.

[Ivorytickler]

Originally Posted by Bydand

Agree the snow removal is useless here. Always has been, probably always will be.

You don't go out when it's still snowing around here either. Crews won't hit the main roads here for about 2 hours after the storm. Side streets could take days.

[lilbear]

I think MI winters only seem terrible if you can't afford your expensive gas heat. Woodstoves make great backups. That's my plan when I move back anyway lol.

[Driller1]

Originally Posted by lilbear

I think MI winters only seem terrible if you can't afford your expensive gas heat. Woodstoves make great backups. That's my plan when I move back anyway lol.

Propane is my back-up for geo. Join the 21st century.
They make generators now too!