If Prop 2 fails... (tax, safe, license plates)

Bydand · 10-30-2008, 05:26 AM

This does NOT give them free rein to do what they want. READ the proposal all the way through. It allows them to use the extra embryos that would normally be disposed of only. And that is IF the persons who were seeking fertility treatment donates them. Read the proposal. I was almost sucked in by the whole "free rein" line those who don't want this are telling everybody. Right up until I looked at the whole thing. It is NOT vague, or opens up the clinics to do what they will. It is very specific as to what embryos are being talked about here.

The line the paper is talking about is this one

Quote:

(d) All stem cell research and all stem cell therapies and cures must be
conducted and provided in accordance with state and local laws of
general applicability, including but not limited to laws concerning
scientific and medical practices and patient safety and privacy, to the
extent that any such laws do not:
(i) prevent, restrict, obstruct, or discourage any stem cell research or
stem cell therapies and cures that are permitted by the provisions
of this section; or
(ii) create disincentives for any person to engage in or otherwise
associate with such research or therapies or cures.
(3) Any provision of this section held unconstitutional shall be severable from
the remaining portions of this section.

It does not remove all restrictions from research if you read it.

northstar22 · 10-30-2008, 08:25 AM

Stem cell research = good
Embryonic stem cell research = not good

I'm voting no because I can't support the slaughter of babies in any way, shape, or form. Embryonic stem cells are not proven to save lives, and even if they were, it would STILL be wrong. You can't take a life to save another. There are also other forms of stem cell research being conducted that are more effective and don't involve murder.

NO on Proposal 2!

kimba01 · 10-30-2008, 08:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kazoopilot

Stem cell research = good
Embryonic stem cell research = not good

I'm voting no because I can't support the slaughter of babies in any way, shape, or form. Embryonic stem cells are not proven to save lives, and even if they were, it would STILL be wrong. You can't take a life to save another. There are also other forms of stem cell research being conducted that are more effective and don't involve murder.

NO on Proposal 2!

Aren't these embryonic cells from embryos that were already going to be disposed of? I would not consider that "taking a life to save a life". You can't "take" a life that is already pegged for the dumpster. It would merely be "saving a life". Kind of similar to organ donation. They would have to have the ok of the donor.

northstar22 · 10-30-2008, 08:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kimba01

Aren't these embryonic cells from embryos that were already going to be disposed of? I would not consider that "taking a life to save a life". You can't "take" a life that is already pegged for the dumpster. It would merely be "saving a life". Kind of similar to organ donation. They would have to have the ok of the donor.

Organ donation is voluntary. Abortion is not. The baby doesn't have any choice in the matter. I'm against this because it supports abortion, and it would be one more roadblock to making abortion illegal.

kimba01 · 10-30-2008, 08:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kazoopilot

Organ donation is voluntary. Abortion is not. The baby doesn't have any choice in the matter. I'm against this because it supports abortion, and it would be one more roadblock to making abortion illegal.

That is what I had originally thought also, but after I read the Proposal it states that the only ones used would be the ones from people with fertility issues and they would have to ok it. If that is the case (and with politics you never know)then it would be voluntary.

My other thought is that these people are going to abort anyway. If they don't pay for the embryos, then they may as well save a life somewhere with them.

Thought patterns about these things change when you are put in a situation such as those cells being able to save your son or daughter's lives. I don't think one really knows how strongly they believe in something until they are faced with making a difficult decision such as that.

That said, I think killing them JUST for that is wrong.

JMO.

mich2fla · 10-30-2008, 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1eyedjack

According to this there is already stem cell research here. This ballot gives them free reign to do whatever they want. Seems like the dems would shoot this down because big brother wouldn't be involved !Would Prop 2 allow stem cell research oversight? | The Detroit News | detnews.com (http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20081030/OPINION01/810300336/1008# - broken link)
We have one of the six major places in the country already with 40 scientists at U of M.

A majority of the Republicians (right to lifers) are the ones that want to shoot this down. Over 40 states allow this. North Dakota, South Dakota, Louisiana and Arkansas have the same restrictions that Michigan does. It will bring Michigan to a level playing field. If this doesn't pass, we just need to head down to Indiana or Ohio, take out some embryos, then bring it back to Michigan like it's being done right now.

I'm a conservative and I will be voting Yes on Proposal 2.

Bydand · 10-30-2008, 11:37 AM

I am a conservative Republican and a "right-to-lifer" as well. And after reading the proposal and looking into it a bit deeper, the yes box is going to get checked on my ballot as well.

snoopygirlmi · 10-30-2008, 01:05 PM

My problem w/Prop #2 is that it's an amendment to the state's constitution - does it have to be in it? It's a lot easier to reform/repeal a bad law than an amendment.

Also, I just can't vote for embryonic stem cell research - especially when more has been accomplished w/ adult stem cells.

Michigansnowflake · 10-30-2008, 04:56 PM

A YES vote here

stanman13 · 10-30-2008, 05:20 PM

I will be voting yes on this. This has nothing to do with abortion. These are embryos which are created basically in a petri dish for implantation into a womb where the mother is having trouble concieving in the traditional way. They are otherwise headed for the trash. This is not ending an otherwise viable life. It is not taking a life to save a life. In these fertility scenarios, they always create extra embryos because of the inherent difficulty of the process. If they are not needed, they are discarded. This would at least allow them to come to some good. All research involving these embryos would still be subject to federal law, and this type of research is heavily regulated.