[suydam]

Originally Posted by Coldjensens

I was looking at the Michigan admission standards, they are really high (2.8 GPA) 27 ACT and 1460 I think SAT. That means that pretty much everyone who goes there was in the top 10% of their class.

I that a typo?

2.8GPA is far below a 1460 SAT.
Frankly a 27 ACT is blow a 1460 too.

1460 is about a 33 or 34 on ACT scale I think.

[Danielsam]

Originally Posted by suydam

I that a typo?

2.8GPA is far below a 1460 SAT.
Frankly a 27 ACT is blow a 1460 too.

1460 is about a 33 or 34 on ACT scale I think.

Probably?

Here is the incoming freshmen profile:
86% of students with a 3.6 GPA or higher
99% of students in top 20% of HS class

http://www.admissions.umich.edu/about/
ACT Composite of 28–32
ACT English of 27–33
ACT Math of 27–33
ACT Combined English/Writing of 26–32
SAT Total of 1920–2180
SAT Critical Reading 610–720
SAT Math 660–760
SAT Writing 610–720
HS GPA 3.7-4.0

[Coldjensens]

Originally Posted by suydam

I that a typo?

2.8GPA is far below a 1460 SAT.
Frankly a 27 ACT is blow a 1460 too.

1460 is about a 33 or 34 on ACT scale I think.

It is a typo the gpa is 3.8 (on a 4.0 scale, not the new 4.5 scale) the other numbers are correct. 34 or 35 is the top score that you can get on the ACT is it not? 1460 is high but not stellar

[Coldjensens]

Originally Posted by Danielsam

Probably?

Here is the incoming freshmen profile:
86% of students with a 3.6 GPA or higher
99% of students in top 20% of HS class

Office of Undergraduate Admissions: About Michigan
ACT Composite of 28–32
ACT English of 27–33
ACT Math of 27–33
ACT Combined English/Writing of 26–32
SAT Total of 1920–2180
SAT Critical Reading 610–720
SAT Math 660–760
SAT Writing 610–720
HS GPA 3.7-4.0

The information that I found had higher numbers. Is this 2008? This seems more rational. at a 3.8 they would hardly get any students.

[Rapunzll]

Don't lose track of the fact that it doesn't matter what a college or university's rating is if it isn't a good match for your child.

[Coldjensens]

That is the problem. What is a good match? My children are very different than I was so Icannot use experience to help them find a good match. Besides, the schools may be completely different. Are the schools still the same as they were in 1981?

From Internet posts Western appears to have taken the crown as THE party school. When I was in school it was Central. Michigan seems to have upgraded academically even though it has fallen in the national rankings. I never knew much of anything about the really small schools that my daughters are interested in, because they were not a possibility for me.

So how do you match somone who is completely different that you were with schools that you cannot really get any meaningful information about? On top of all that, some of the claims of the schools are apparantly just plain false

[magellan]

Originally Posted by Coldjensens

MSU is not an option. Too big for them. They have no interest.

U-M only is considered because it is close, becuase I and my wife both went there and because a close friend of theirs will go there. They really want smaller schools.

I was looking at the Michigan admission standards, they are really high (2.8 GPA) 27 ACT and 1460 I think SAT. That means that pretty much everyone who goes there was in the top 10% of their class.

I am surprised ot see U-M Law ranked # 9. It was juggling with Havard and Yale for the 1 ,2 or 3 spot in the 1980s. Of course different journals rank the schools very differently. Some journals always rank Berkley #1 no matter what.


Anyway. What I am intersted in as to U-M is whether they have a well known quality music teaching program and a good theater program (and English, but I already know that they have good liberal arts progras).

I am particularly intersted in learning about the other schools since I know nothing about them except what I can find ont he internet which is not a lot. I do nto know what atmosphere is good for sweet naive innocent girls. I was not like that and did nto really know many people like that. I was a bit of a hell raiser, so what was good for me, is probably not what they need.

I remember that Eastern was once known as THE teaching school in Michigan. Is it still? Eastern has appeal becuase she cna probably get a full scholarship. HIllsdale has appeal beacuse it is small and not controlled by government. But is it a good place for a teacher? DO they have a good theater program? Creative writing?

Every place seems to say that they are great for everything. Then you find out that it is not true.

One interent site said that Alma is not considered a good teachers school by the Michigan department of Education. That was a very old reference (early 1990s I think). Does anyone know where it stands now.

I would put Eastern at the bottom of your list. I just saw that their graduation rate is only 35% (and not because of high academic standards). Plus, their admission standards are pretty low even compared to WMU and Grand Valley.

Have you actually met with the heads of the departments at these schools? If it's possible, I'd go that route to see if the "tone" of the department matches up with the disposition of your child(ren). I think students who are not aggressive and ultra-competitive would be absolutely miserable in a highly competitive learning environment.

[Rapunzll]

Originally Posted by Coldjensens

That is the problem. What is a good match? My children are very different than I was so Icannot use experience to help them find a good match. Besides, the schools may be completely different. Are the schools still the same as they were in 1981?

From Internet posts Western appears to have taken the crown as THE party school. When I was in school it was Central. Michigan seems to have upgraded academically even though it has fallen in the national rankings. I never knew much of anything about the really small schools that my daughters are interested in, because they were not a possibility for me.

So how do you match somone who is completely different that you were with schools that you cannot really get any meaningful information about? On top of all that, some of the claims of the schools are apparantly just plain false

I think a huge consideration is the size of the school and the type of child you have. I mean, the girls don't have to go to the same school. Their needs very well might be different, I know that was the case with my three kids. What does your wife think? They might not be completely different from her.

Talk to your girls teachers, ask them what they think regarding your kids college choices. They are the ones who teach them, they might have some insight as to whether your child will do well in a huge school or in a smaller one. I don't know about school counselors, I always wonder how well they really know the kids.

Hey, the kids could always transfer if they end up at a place they decide isn't a good fit. If U of M has a superior music program, that daughter could always pursue her masters there. I don't remember though seeing their ranking in music education, which was what you had mentioned as being important. At least I think you mentioned that.

[mofromcheboygankalamazoo]

people always seem to underestimate Western!
I would say the top teaching schools in MI are WEstern, Central and State...with Eastern around there too

Western has a lot of nice small colleges within it that make you feel very connected....the music and dance school at western are good! i knew a lot of people in the theater program at western and the drama educators program...i took one Drama class for educators class and LOVED it, great instructor!

what are the smaller colleges your girls were looking at? i have a few friends who went to alma and i know they send their student teachers to very rural schools......at western i gained experience at urban and rural schools i feel when i started teaching out east i was very well prepared.......(i graduated four years ago.....still keep up on most of WMU's happenings)

[MittenDweller82]

Originally Posted by magellan

I would put Eastern at the bottom of your list. I just saw that their graduation rate is only 35% (and not because of high academic standards). Plus, their admission standards are pretty low even compared to WMU and Grand Valley.

Have you actually met with the heads of the departments at these schools? If it's possible, I'd go that route to see if the "tone" of the department matches up with the disposition of your child(ren). I think students who are not aggressive and ultra-competitive would be absolutely miserable in a highly competitive learning environment.

Actually EMU accepts 75% of their applicants, while WMU accepts 86% of their applicants, and also, EMU's graduation rate is: 71%. Its unfortunate such a stigma exists around the school, as a alumni myself (undergraduate) far to many spew negativity before ever seeing the campus. Many of my friends (including myself) went on to top schools such as UM and Harvard for graduate study. Its sad the school is in a bad surrounding area, and has higher crime than the other universities. I've known a great number of UM prospects that chose EMU to save money, but receive instruction from professors that have taught at both schools.


Eastern's Stats:

College Search - Eastern Michigan University - EMU - At a Glance

Western's Stats:

College Search - Western Michigan University - WMU - At a Glance

Central:

College Search - Central Michigan University - CMU - At a Glance