[Coldjensens]

Our Daughters are looking at Colleges. One daughter wanted to be a music teacher (vocal and instrumental both); the other is not sure but enjoys writing, acting and singing. Both have excellent grades and good test scores. We looked at online information, and visited a few of them, can anyone please tell me what they know about the following:

Hillsdale
Grand Valley
Eastern Michigan
Bowling green (Ohio)
Baldwin Wallace (Ohio).
U-M
Alma

My wife and I both attended U-M 20 years ago so we know the basics (as of 20 years ago) but we do not know about their teaching/music programs. Neither daugther wants to go to a school that big, but maybe they can be convinced.

Thank you

[MittenDweller82]

Originally Posted by Coldjensens

Our Daughters are looking at Colleges. One daughter wanted to be a music teacher (vocal and instrumental both); the other is not sure but enjoys writing, acting and singing. Both have excellent grades and good test scores. We looked at online information, and visited a few of them, can anyone please tell me what they know about the following:

Hillsdale
Grand Valley
Eastern Michigan
Bowling green (Ohio)
Baldwin Wallace (Ohio).
U-M
Alma

My wife and I both attended U-M 20 years ago so we know the basics (as of 20 years ago) but we do not know about their teaching/music programs. Neither daugther wants to go to a school that big, but maybe they can be convinced.

Thank you

Given the information you provided I would push UM, and possibly Bowling Green. If they attend UM, they will be placed in a large talent pool, but will have the opportunity to grow among top talent in music and theater. Several of my childhood friends attended UM and majored in music therapy, the school simply has resources that outweigh the others by far. Alma, Hillsdale, and Baldwin Wallace would be the choice if they decide they want the small liberal arts experience, although their music programs don't stand up to UM. Given that your daughters enjoy arts and music, they would also appreciate the art galleries, book shops, and music venues that Ann Arbor can provide.

The question now turns to...how competitive are your daughters? Do they enjoy it? As a ultra-competitive school in most fields, they will be surrounded by other top talent at UM and may be discouraged, but most times this helps kids do far better than they would somewhere else. No doubt it would be the opportunity of a lifetime to study at UM, but if you feel they would prefer a less competitive more laid back environment, and have more "teacher-student" interaction, I would suggest Bowling Green as my second best. Don't overlook EMU for teaching, many of their faculty come from Ivy Leauge schools, and their program is ranked in the top 25 year after year.

Good Luck!

[Rapunzll]

My daughter went to Grand Valley and loved it. Last I heard it was the fastest growing university in the state. My oldest went to MSU and loved it there and my youngest went to Hope.

Each child had different needs as far as the size of the school they went to, although I don't think that even went into their thinking on a concious level.

I do have to say, I very much admire Hillsdales decision to not take govt. money so they can do the things they want without govt. interference.

Oh, and GVSU has hands down the best architects for their buildings, they have great looking campuses!

I wanted to add that at GVSU the campus, unless it has changed, is pretty much in the middle of nothing, so the kids couldn't walk to shopping, movies, etc. unless it was on campus. They do have the Pew campus in GR, and my daughter did her last two years there, but not an area you would want them walking around at night in, I would think.

Hope is close to downtown. My son complained about it at first, nothing to do, etc. but ended up loving it. Let's face it, kids are going to say there is nothing to do no matter where they are!

[chance2jump]

I know it is not on your list, but all of my musically inclined friends from high school attended Western Michigan. WMU seemed to offer an excellent arts program, including vocals and theatre.

BGSU (I currently live 12 miles away from campus) offers affordable tuition, small campus, and very inexpensive cost of living. BGSU is also known for musical and teaching programs. My SIL is a current student for early childhood development.

UofM / MSU... big campus, bit class sizes, big tuition bill, expensive housing. I grew up near MSU with 2 siblings MSU grads. They both had excellent programs, but they were also both in the James Madison college. Had they been in the regular mainstream classes, they both said probably would not have done as well because of the class sizes and how the teaching structures are (grad students teaching for the professors .. and speaking clear English not necessarily a requirement).

I don't know enough about the others on your list to comment.

[magellan]

Originally Posted by Rapunzll

My daughter went to Grand Valley and loved it. Last I heard it was the fastest growing university in the state. My oldest went to MSU and loved it there and my youngest went to Hope.

Each child had different needs as far as the size of the school they went to, although I don't think that even went into their thinking on a concious level.

I do have to say, I very much admire Hillsdales decision to not take govt. money so they can do the things they want without govt. interference.

Oh, and GVSU has hands down the best architects for their buildings, they have great looking campuses!

I wanted to add that at GVSU the campus, unless it has changed, is pretty much in the middle of nothing, so the kids couldn't walk to shopping, movies, etc. unless it was on campus. They do have the Pew campus in GR, and my daughter did her last two years there, but not an area you would want them walking around at night in, I would think.

Hope is close to downtown. My son complained about it at first, nothing to do, etc. but ended up loving it. Let's face it, kids are going to say there is nothing to do no matter where they are!

The downtown area around the Pew campus is pretty safe. Like most cities, yes you probably wouldn't want to walk around at night alone. But I think it's mainly business students, broadcasting and mechanical engineering taught downtown.

Don't know about GVSU's music program, or how it compares academically. The campus is looking pretty nice lately, with new projects on the horizon (a new fantastic library is one). There are also express buses between downtown GR and Allendale all day long. If GVSU looked like it does today rather than it did 20 years ago, I probably would have attended.

[Rapunzll]

Magellan, I agree. When I graduated HS, way back in 1972, GV was considered to be a very good school. That might not have been fair, but it was the perception.

As to the safety of the pew campus, I guess I was thinking mostly about at night, My daughter graduated in 2002 and lived in the apartments there. It really was a nice set up.

[kazoopilot]

Western has a great music program, one of the best in the country, and #1 in the state. It's a large school, but it's nowhere near as "competitive" as U of M. I'm currently a senior at Western, majoring in aviation, and I've had a pretty good experience here. It's really easy to make friends here, so it doesn't seem so "big." My main gripes were with parking and registration, but I imagine most schools have a similar problem.

If they're set on small schools, then either Hillsdale or Alma would be great choices, as would Hope and Calvin. All have music programs, as far as I know. I don't know much about the Ohio schools (Ohio, ugh!).

[Coldjensens]

Thanks for your information.

They are competitive in that their grades place them in the top 25% (top 5% for one of them), but they are not competitive in the way people who go to Harvard are competitive. They do not like the "beat the other guy (gal)" prespective. They like to be challenged, but in an atmosphere where students support each other rather than compete.

They both strongly prefer a small school. They both expect to get scholarships for academics, singing, and/or band (or possibly theater for oen of them). They are not worldly. They have never really dated. College will be the first time that they have been apart from each other for more than a week. They do not smoke (anything) or drink. They are basically sweet and innocent and a bit naieve, so a big school might eat them up. Michigan State is too big. They will nto even consider it. THey only consider U-M because Mom and I both went there and because it is real close so they could commute if money became a big problem.

Of the schools on the list, Grand Valley, Hillsdale, and U-M have the higest admission standards so I presume that these are the top schools academically. Eastern and Bowling green have pretty low admission standards. That may make it easier to get a scholarship.

Neither they nor I had ever heard that Western Michigan has a strong music program. Do you know wehther it is a teaching or performing music program. One daughter considered Oberlin which is probably the strongest music program in the region and one of the best in the country, but it si a performing school, not teaching. (It is also insanely expensive and competitive).

One mentioned that she might consider Wayne State. I went there before Michigan and they had a pretty good english and theater department at the time. All of those professors are probably retired or dead by now though. I have no idea if they even have a music program. Anyone know?

[Cliffie]

Originally Posted by Coldjensens

Our Daughters are looking at Colleges. One daughter wanted to be a music teacher (vocal and instrumental both); the other is not sure but enjoys writing, acting and singing. Both have excellent grades and good test scores. We looked at online information, and visited a few of them, can anyone please tell me what they know about the following:

Hillsdale
Grand Valley
Eastern Michigan
Bowling green (Ohio)
Baldwin Wallace (Ohio).
U-M
Alma

My wife and I both attended U-M 20 years ago so we know the basics (as of 20 years ago) but we do not know about their teaching/music programs. Neither daugther wants to go to a school that big, but maybe they can be convinced.

Thank you

I spent a year at Alma. It was infested with Born-Agains -- fine for some people, but when I set foot in a church the place generally bursts into flames, so it wasn't too comfy for me -- and it's waaaaaaay out in the middle of nowhere. None of their academic programming struck me as being worth the exorbitant tuition. Grand Valley has such an excellent music program that someone I know, who was an "easy in" at Michigan Tech, chose Grand Valley instead because he wanted his math degree AND his musical outlet.

UofM should be their first pick, not only because it's one of the Top Ten Public Ivy League schools in the country, which would bring them into contact with lots of really excellent musicians, but because the university is broken up into intimate little subcolleges of which the Music School is one of the tiniest and coziest. They could live right on North Campus and feel like they were...well...at Alma College, even though they're only a 10-minute free bus ride from civilization. Nothing about the Music School feels big. I can also personally vouch for the Goldfish and Turtles in the pond out front -- I put most of them there myself.

[kcam213]

Originally Posted by Coldjensens

Our Daughters are looking at Colleges. One daughter wanted to be a music teacher (vocal and instrumental both); the other is not sure but enjoys writing, acting and singing. Both have excellent grades and good test scores. We looked at online information, and visited a few of them, can anyone please tell me what they know about the following:

Hillsdale
Grand Valley
Eastern Michigan
Bowling green (Ohio)
Baldwin Wallace (Ohio).
U-M
Alma

My wife and I both attended U-M 20 years ago so we know the basics (as of 20 years ago) but we do not know about their teaching/music programs. Neither daugther wants to go to a school that big, but maybe they can be convinced.

Thank you

I attended Bowling green State University. Small college town with not much to do, and not much trouble to get into. Most students during my day (late 80's) came from Cleveland and Dayton area... all 4 of my roommates (yes there were 5 of us) came from either Cleveland or Dayton.

It is totally a party college. You can get a good education from the school but definitely a party school. Unless things has changed drastically (with the drinking age now 21).