[michmoldman]

Everything in this world was made from nature, and just as in nature, she has a way of thinning things when they get out of control.
To me economy was like a run away forest. Growing and growing out of control. Now, a spark has set the forest on fire. It will burn and spark for some time, but eventually the fire will be put out. There will be large pockets of the economy that will not be burned all over the country (and world), and it will be up to these pockets to eventually regrow the forest. Now it will be up to Obama, his staff, and all who survive to play the role of Jhonny Appleseed.
I know its all pretty scary, but this thinning out process has to happen. If you have ever seen an area after a fire, it is ugly and depressing, but it eventually grows again. All the complaining about how and why the fire started is just a huge waste of time and energy. Those who write in these forums about all the doom and gloom and are so negative will only make the smoldering last longer. Not just here, but all over the world. There is nothing anyone can do now but wait till its over.
So once the smoldering has stopped, you can either sit back and cry...or start planting seeds.

[Michigan Refugee]

To Michmoldman:
Hi, Michigan Refugee here. I like your analogy of the forest fire regarding Michigan's current economy. Just like nature, economies are cyclical. My family and I were forced to leave the "burned out" areas of Michigan and relocated to Fayetteville North Carolina. My last day in Michigan was 08-05-07. I did come back for one week this last June, however it was not a holiday as my had died. The area where I'm living was traditionally agricultural about 30- 40 years ago. You would never know that today.

[Bluefly]

actually, if you study ecology and economy you realize very quickly they function on the exact same principles.

The various plants and animals of a forest function precisely like the businesses of an economy. Don't point that out to corporate hotshots, though. They like to think they're alot more sophisticated than a plant.

[upandrunning]

I see it totally opposite. The economy is man made. When the Great Depression hit, it was totally a man made product. The sun did not stop shining, and the world did not stop turning. The crops grew and the wind blew. It was humans running a muck. The only thing different now as then is that with energy we are running short on oil production. If we continue to play the old game and increase our appetite for oil and have an eating contest with the world, we will have trouble. But as we humans have an industriousness that is one of the angles of our better nature, I hope that we can figure new better ways of powering our lives. We have played with our economy and futures by waging wars that were very ill conceived. We have spent money we do not have, not only the government but us as citizens. And the big answer to all our financial trouble is to spend more, the government and citizens. The big push is not to save, but spend more, by more. In the 30s and 70s we tightened our belts, but now they are trying the opposite. Give people more loans and tell them to spend more. Instead of focusing on jobs and reviving a strong manufacturing base here, and one not based on the latest Hanna Montana doll, but based on new energy technology, and sustainable life styles.
[SIZE=3] [/SIZE]

[michmoldman]

Originally Posted by upandrunning

I see it totally opposite. The economy is man made. When the Great Depression hit, it was totally a man made product. The sun did not stop shining, and the world did not stop turning. The crops grew and the wind blew. It was humans running a muck. The only thing different now as then is that with energy we are running short on oil production. If we continue to play the old game and increase our appetite for oil and have an eating contest with the world, we will have trouble. But as we humans have an industriousness that is one of the angles of our better nature, I hope that we can figure new better ways of powering our lives. We have played with our economy and futures by waging wars that were very ill conceived. We have spent money we do not have, not only the government but us as citizens. And the big answer to all our financial trouble is to spend more, the government and citizens. The big push is not to save, but spend more, by more. In the 30s and 70s we tightened our belts, but now they are trying the opposite. Give people more loans and tell them to spend more. Instead of focusing on jobs and reviving a strong manufacturing base here, and one not based on the latest Hanna Montana doll, but based on new energy technology, and sustainable life styles.
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Yes, but it is just human nature to have "bigger and better" You can only get as big as the environment around you can handle. We have grown and grown, but the environment can no longer support this greedy growth. Since we are blind to this way of thinking, nature will do it for us. Good things will come out of this though. We will realize we do need better ways of powering our lives, and that corporate greed must be eliminated. This is going to be a painful process, but we will be better for it in the end. One thing that must change is all the idiots in government. Since they are the ones who control most everything, nothing will ever change.

[upandrunning]

MOM, I totally agree with you. We as a species keep building 3000sf homes for people who want to have little place to stay in winter. Next door to me people from Wisconsin are building a home that they want to spend the winters in. And there are only 2 of them. We need to tax people who do stupid things like this. We need to focus our attention on sustainable things. We need to tax the Hummer out of existence. As long as we try to change the constitution to a document that supports the god of free market we will have these problems. High highs and low lows. It is inevitable. As long as we refuse to see that we can not work for the good of all when we prop up a system that supports greed and the winner take all attitude. This I got mine maybe you can get yours is not something that can last forever. When the right has people like Michael Medved who says that the Earth can support unlimited amounts of humans, how can you argue with this kind of mentality? You should just put them in the lethal injection table and rid us of this toxic mentality.
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[michmoldman]

What gets me are these home shows like, whats my home worth, I think. People buy a house, do tons of upgrades, and then want to know what they can sell their home for. They buy it for $250,000 do $100,000 in upgrades and want to sell it for $500-$600,000
Then the next person who buys it wants to wait a few years and sell it for $800,000 Come on....how long can that go on? Even though I admit I do love that show, its totally rediculous.

[ergohead]

Originally Posted by michmoldman

Everything in this world was made from nature,

Can you think of anything in nature analogous to debt based money?

I would love to see a response from an advanced biologist.

Money as debt

[Indentured Servant]

Originally Posted by ergohead

Can you think of anything in nature analogous to debt based money?

I would love to see a response from an advanced biologist.

Money as debt

That would be called a Mirage…. or optical illusion…..which often naturally occur in nature.

[HeadedWest]

Originally Posted by upandrunning

As long as we try to change the constitution to a document that supports the god of free market we will have these problems.

I don't think there is any honest way to read the Constitution in a way that would discourage free markets.