[MittenDweller82]

Originally Posted by Coldjensens

That is waht I thought when I moved away. It worked like that for about 2 or 3 years, but after that we only got back to Michigan once every two or so years. You get busy. The trips gets expensive and difficult to plan. It is nto like you can just sneak away for a couple of hours, you need to have your hwole weekend clear to visit. How often do you have a whole weekend with no obligations? Then add a spouse, a dog or cat, and later some children into the equation and now you need to have multiple persons with no obligations for a whole weekend in order to be able to come back. You also have to make arrangements for someone to watch your pet(s), drive you to and from the airport, watch your house, etc. It just does not happen. At least not for us.

Conceptually you could just fly back for one day, but that does not happen either. It just isn't worth it.




If you leave, you pretty much have to be prepared to say Goodbye unless you are going to Chicago or Ohio so you are close enough for a short car trip or 1 hour flight back.

No kitties, or puppies...just a three year old

The Michigan Flyer bus stops here in Ann Arbor so we just hop on that and get to metro in 15 mins. My daughter is an expert flight attended now (or so she thinks) as much as my wife and I travel. If I ever left Michigan it wouldn't be any further than Chicago or Madison, WI.

[ocean2026]

Its easy to say you won't leave but your friends may end up being employed much more quickly -their companies will be less likely to fold and they will have more opportunity to advance. They will make more probably spend less and the houses they buy will be worth 2 or 3 times what a Detroit house will be in 10 years.

If you're lucky the company youwork for will move and take you too!

[mkfarnam]

Originally Posted by Coldjensens

Good for you Kazoo. There are more important things in life than money. Having been both wealthy and poor and inbetween, I can tell you that life is more convenient and less challenging when you do not have to worry about how to pay the bills or what you will do if your car breaks or you get sick, but life is not better when you are wealthy, just easier. People who have money are constantly worried about losing it. Constantly concerned about getting more and/or keeping the flow going. You change your lifestyle and get a nicer house, better car and pretty soon it seems like you cannot get by without those things.

I will say that my most memorable trips or adventures were memorable because of the things that I had to do becuase I had no money.

If you go to New York for a weekend and stay in a fancy hotel, go see a show and eat in some nice resturaunts, it will be nice, but not memorable. IF you go to new your for a weekend and sleep in Grand Central station, or in your car, or just meet someone and get them to put you up for a night or two, or whatever. If you ride the subways for entratinment, eat with the ordinary people, talk your way into a museum or show that you cannot afford - you will always remember your adventure forever.

I can barely remember anything about trips where I stayed in a fancy hotel, ate at nice resturaunts and had plenty of money for whatever I wanted to do. They were nice trips, and pleasant, but not memorable. I remeber and often discuss with people who were along, pretty much every trip that I made when I was broke.

Maybe you will be lucky and find a good job soon. You certainly have the right attitude. That would be great, but if not, you will preservere and still enjoy life to its fullest.
Like you, I am absolutely confident that Michgan will come back. Amongst other reasons, we have more fresh water than almost any other place. We have a great workforce, well planned although aging infrastructure and an absolutelty beautfiul place to live.

I just hope that our politicians do not continue to underrepresent us in Washington. (Why are we still a donor state? Even with the bailout, Michigan will pay more than we will recive. What are they thinking?)

Very true and educational

Although "wealthy" 'well off" or anything close to it has never been part of my life, I've learned in my younger years to be happy what you have and adjust your lifestyle accordingly.

I could write a book on my life changes and adventerous living trying to stay afloat.

We lost our Mother when I was "15" Never knew our father. A year later the 6 of us were split up.
At 16, I left Mi. broke and on my own. I jumped a Freight train in St Louis. Mo and rode to San Diego, Ca. A 2 weeks trip (in the winter) zig zagging the US. in an empty box car.
Not to bore anyone, but for years I worked odd jobs, back then on the west coast, one of the best paying and always available jobs was help on the shrimp boats. Later in life I found an oppritunity to enter College on a BEOG (Basic Educational Oppritunity Grant) in Riverside, Ca. I've always been Mechanically Incline" so I took up "Basic Engine Overhaul". (Years later) After working 12 years as a Certified Auto Mechanic, I got tired of the customer "rip-off" schemes and job injury disputes so I moved to San Bernardino, Ca and started a Small Engine Repair Shop from my own garage.
I was self employed for 21 years. During this time, being honest with my customers and never raising prices (wth some reasonal exceptions) I made enough to keep the business going and pay my bills and taxes.
In 2004 I fly back to Mi. to visit friends and relatives I had'nt seen in 30yrs(since childhood) stops were in Royal Oak, Warren, Chesterfield, Saginaw, Cadillac, Mesick, Charlevoix, and Ashland, Ohio.
The beauty of Michigan is one thing no one forgets.

Anyway...at this point in time my business was taking a turn for the worse because Illegal Immigrants were taking over the neighborhood and running the original owners out.
2 years later, because I owned the business but not the property it sat on, it was pulled out from under me by eminent domain (Redevelopment)
To make a long story short.
In 2006 I moved from SoCal to SW OK. and cut my living expences in half.
Case-in-point
If a person enjoys where they are and what they're doing, they will make their life as happy as they want it by adjusting their lifestyle accordingly.

If someone takes an unknown leap, example, from the East to the West, without some kind f plan already set-up. they will most likely turn out to be miserable in more ways than one. Climate change, culture shock, enviromental change (from green to brown, dry and HOT! ect. Not only is the unemployment rate high out there, the cost of living is so high, it's hard to live with a job, let alone starting over without one and scratching and struggling living day by day not knowing where your next meal is coming from
I suggest, have a plan and a back-up.
But that's just my opinion from experience.

[malamute]

Originally Posted by kazoopilot

I'm graduating from college this year, and many people I'm graduating with plan to leave the great state of Michigan. Many are heading to Sunbelt states like Texas, Georgia, North Carolina, and Arizona. It's true, there are more jobs in other states. However, unless God calls me to go somewhere else, I'm staying. As long as I can find a job that pays the bills, I will be fine. It doesn't have to be a professional job - I'll dig ditches or scrub toilets at McDonalds before I leave Michigan! To me, it's not worth leaving home to find a job - especially one that could go away next week. I'd rather make $8.50/hr in Michigan than six figures in the desert. In my opinion, you can't put a price on home and quality of life.

I'm not judging anyone who leaves - you have to do what you can to support yourselves and your families (if any). However, the economy here WILL turn around and there WILL be more jobs in this state. Things will get better.

The thing is -- in the past, people graduating from college thought nothing of leaving home, seeing and trying new places.

The problem with "professional jobs" is that relocating to them has always been the case, some professions much more than others of course.

If you have a degree and you choose to flip burgers for a number of years, fine if that's what you want to do, but keep in mind that others will make the effort to build their resume. How many years do you want to have between your degree completion and the start of a professional career?

You can't always sit and believe everything will come your way soon enough, sometimes you have to make things happen. Or maybe the expense of college wasn't all that big a deal and you can just take the chance of losing out.

[malamute]

Originally Posted by Coldjensens

That is waht I thought when I moved away. It worked like that for about 2 or 3 years, but after that we only got back to Michigan once every two or so years. You get busy. The trips gets expensive and difficult to plan. It is nto like you can just sneak away for a couple of hours, you need to have your hwole weekend clear to visit. How often do you have a whole weekend with no obligations? Then add a spouse, a dog or cat, and later some children into the equation and now you need to have multiple persons with no obligations for a whole weekend in order to be able to come back. You also have to make arrangements for someone to watch your pet(s), drive you to and from the airport, watch your house, etc. It just does not happen. At least not for us.

Conceptually you could just fly back for one day, but that does not happen either. It just isn't worth it.


If you leave, you pretty much have to be prepared to say Goodbye unless you are going to Chicago or Ohio so you are close enough for a short car trip or 1 hour flight back.

What I do is take a two week vacation up there every summer, I try to get the best weather times which are in July. For two weeks you can camp out in the woods, along a lake, you can swim, tube down a river, check out a number of waterfalls, hiking trails.

Maybe people up there can do that every weekend but where I like to go, the summers are so short anyway that two weeks of solid Michigan outdoors is more than some people get who live there.

[malamute]

Originally Posted by wagonproject

Trying to make my mind up on staying at age 21! I know Ill miss MI. But AZ or NC look nice...

When you're young and not bound with a family, it's good to try other places for the sheer adventure of it, to prove something to yourself, discover the world.

I left Michigan but not for money, money isn't my biggest motivator. I think with certain careers, the money is nice, it's a good side aspect but you want the career because it's interesting. If you have to work 40-50 hours a week, it should be in something that excites you at least somewhat. More than money I think that's the reason to go to college, to get a job that stimulates you because otherwise you might find your job too much a dead end kind of thing. I've done plenty of minimum wage jobs especially in college to know they aren't what I want to do, I didn't hate those jobs, I learned from them but when you first get out of college is the best time to tackle the challenging jobs.

I left because I really didn't enjoy being cold too much, I didn't like grey skies and I didn't like the idea of throwing out money in heating bills. I was working up there and everyone was planning trips to Florida every January and February, or spending all kinds of money on some Carribean cruise to see the sun. I just decided I could have the sun every single day instead.

[leaving513forever]

Originally Posted by kazoopilot

I'm graduating from college this year, and many people I'm graduating with plan to leave the great state of Michigan. Many are heading to Sunbelt states like Texas, Georgia, North Carolina, and Arizona. It's true, there are more jobs in other states. However, unless God calls me to go somewhere else, I'm staying. As long as I can find a job that pays the bills, I will be fine. It doesn't have to be a professional job - I'll dig ditches or scrub toilets at McDonalds before I leave Michigan! To me, it's not worth leaving home to find a job - especially one that could go away next week. I'd rather make $8.50/hr in Michigan than six figures in the desert. In my opinion, you can't put a price on home and quality of life.

I'm not judging anyone who leaves - you have to do what you can to support yourselves and your families (if any). However, the economy here WILL turn around and there WILL be more jobs in this state. Things will get better.

I like your positive attitude

[allistercrowly]

Originally Posted by kazoopilot

I'm graduating from college this year, and many people I'm graduating with plan to leave the great state of Michigan. Many are heading to Sunbelt states like Texas, Georgia, North Carolina, and Arizona. It's true, there are more jobs in other states. However, unless God calls me to go somewhere else, I'm staying. As long as I can find a job that pays the bills, I will be fine. It doesn't have to be a professional job - I'll dig ditches or scrub toilets at McDonalds before I leave Michigan! To me, it's not worth leaving home to find a job - especially one that could go away next week. I'd rather make $8.50/hr in Michigan than six figures in the desert. In my opinion, you can't put a price on home and quality of life.

I'm not judging anyone who leaves - you have to do what you can to support yourselves and your families (if any). However, the economy here WILL turn around and there WILL be more jobs in this state. Things will get better.

Money = quality of life paln and simple, it is combined with health first, family second and money. You are young and idealistic, cute but not pratical. You remind me of my wifes sister who would say money did not mater and she could live on love. Well one divorce later because of money again the idealistic attidutd takes a dump. Living in Michigan on 8 an hour not able to afford rent or living in moms basement while others are useing their education to get ahead is not a good life choice. But you are going to have to learn how hot the stove is by touching it and getting burned.

[malamute]

Originally Posted by leaving513forever

I like your positive attitude

A positive attitude could mean someone would want to have job experience and a bullet proof resume ready for when times get better.

When companies start hiring will they pick someone moving back who has the needed job experience or someone who chose not to pursue the career for a number of years, obtained no pertainent experience but was content to work minimum wage. Often the employer hiring will look at employment history, that's why it's on so many job applications. A long gap between the degree and the job search will make a college degree useless.

[leaving513forever]

Originally Posted by malamute

A positive attitude could mean someone would want to have job experience and a bullet proof resume ready for when times get better.

When companies start hiring will they pick someone moving back who has the needed job experience or someone who chose not to pursue the career for a number of years, obtained no pertainent experience but was content to work minimum wage. Often the employer hiring will look at employment history, that's why it's on so many job applications. A long gap between the degree and the job search will make a college degree useless.

So why are you telling me this? Tell the original poster..