[krock1dk]

My parents moved from West Branch to E Lansing last year. Things in W Branch are really getting bad too. So bad that your considered 'top dog' if you work at the Walmart on old 76, or for WBRC Schools, or the hospital. And the Kmart has become desolate as has ome of the Tanger Mall. I hate to say it, but that formely cute little town is dying. And its young (younger than 18) are moving out in the droves for 'greener' pastures in southern MI or out of state. The old plastics factory I used to work at closed several years ago. West Branch's population is definately on the decline. And the only people left are the old farts and maybe a few younger people who've been there almost their entire lives and wont leave.

[Driller1]

Originally Posted by Bydand

That isn't a "common sense" fact, it is your lame attempt at a slam toward a State you hate. I am NOT the one who is making the claim that 99% of the tourists are from those areas, you are, that places the burden of proof on you.

I never said the State wasn't doing bad, just not as doom and gloom as you are trying to make it out to be. I will still stand by that statement. I HAVE said I personally am doing better now than ever in the past and it is a direct result of moving BACK to Michigan.

You have read posters such as myself for a couple of years now? How is that? You have been a member since February of this year...?

Welcome to the ignore feature, which I am sure you are already there under a couple of different names. I get tired of reading your false "facts" and your argumentative posts directed towards a State you hate with a passion, but spend an extraordinary amount of time on its forum.

Agreed. A statement without a link is an opinion, not a fact. Even with a link someone will find another link. Just the www. world.

[magellan]

Originally Posted by allistercrowly

Do you need a citation for every common sense fact? I guess I would have to cite the sky is blue for you instead of telling you to look up. LOL I am going to reverse it on you, You research it and give me quotes and citations where I am wrong. I am not going to argue with every Michigan ostrich that comes down the Detroit River.

There are a few Harold Hill's here that are not worth talking to. Has anyone ever noticed that they are not contented to just to stay of topics and threads they do not like, they feel they have to dominate and make every one see things like they do. I have read many of the posters such as the one quoted from above from a few years ago. They have been saying that Michigan is not doing bad up until they could not deny it at all.

The burden is on the person making a claim that something is a "fact", not the person who calls you on it. Sorry dude. Welcome to the internets.

Personally, I think you are wrong. For West Michigan and Northwest Michigan, most of the tourists I would brand as "Chicago suburbanites." Of course, I could be wrong and I have no facts to back it up. But a ton of foreign imports and big SUV's headed North on 131 on Friday afternoons in the Summer with personalized vanity Illinois license plates leads me to that conclusion.

BTW, wasn't Allister Crowley an old Ozzy song?

Also, as anecdotal evidence, we were in the Torch Lake area this weekend and it was BUSY! Way busier than any time I can remember last season. However, I think lower gas prices have a lot to do with it.

[malamute]

Originally Posted by topshop

Good point.

It is also worth noting that in Michigan (and most other states for that matter), government works overtime to destroy incentives for individuals and businesses.

Here in West Michigan, the fruit harvest is in jeopardy since the state has not approved many places where migrants normally stay which means no one to pick the fruit. Of course there are hundreds of thousands of unemployed in the state, but it pays better to do nothing than to pick fruit.

When such policies have become normal, the collapse of a society is likely not far off.

That's pretty crazy. It would be better for the state to not worry about approving migrants but get the unemployed working. At least have them working to subsidize the unemployment.

[magellan]

Originally Posted by malamute

That's pretty crazy. It would be better for the state to not worry about approving migrants but get the unemployed working. At least have them working to subsidize the unemployment.

You can thank anti-Mexican-immigration Republicans like John McCain for that one.

[allistercrowly]

Originally Posted by magellan

The burden is on the person making a claim that something is a "fact", not the person who calls you on it. Sorry dude. Welcome to the internets.

Personally, I think you are wrong. For West Michigan and Northwest Michigan, most of the tourists I would brand as "Chicago suburbanites." Of course, I could be wrong and I have no facts to back it up. But a ton of foreign imports and big SUV's headed North on 131 on Friday afternoons in the Summer with personalized vanity Illinois license plates leads me to that conclusion.

BTW, wasn't Allister Crowley an old Ozzy song?

Also, as anecdotal evidence, we were in the Torch Lake area this weekend and it was BUSY! Way busier than any time I can remember last season. However, I think lower gas prices have a lot to do with it.

Aleister crowley was the man who started occult groups and Satanism in the turn of the century. As far as you see "Chicago people" I think what you were seeing as far as crowds go is all those people who were laid off for several months from Chrysler. I talked to several of the people I saw up north and the biggest share said they were laid off and did not want to sit around the house drawing unemployment worrying about their jobs. I do not think it is some sign that things are really not as bad as they are or that the Michigan economy has some how magically turned around on a corn husk and a prayer.

[Northman]

Originally Posted by magellan

BTW, wasn't Allister Crowley an old Ozzy song?

The song is actually called "Mr. Crowley", but it is indeed in reference to Aleister Crowley, who a lot of English rock musicians (Ozzy, Jimmy Page) were obsessed with at the height of their careers. But I digress....

You know, I'm trying to ride this thing out up here, and not to blame Michigan for my woes, but I have NEVER worked at a facility that cut the hours of direct patient care employees such as myself to save money before now. The more I think about it the madder I get.

I had my buddy over to watch the Wings game the other night. He also happens to be the lead tech on our staff........I asked him how long he thought this would go on, and he says "Until the economy improves".

WHAT? THE ECONOMY HASN'T IMPROVED IN MICHIGAN FOR 45 YEARS!! HA!

I guess my fate will be determined shortly.......the influx of old folks and tourists happens right around now every year in these parts and we are going to be much busier. If they continue to shave our hours and leave us short staffed over the summer I am out of there, and possibly out of Michigan.

[magellan]

Originally Posted by allistercrowly

Aleister crowley was the man who started occult groups and Satanism in the turn of the century. As far as you see "Chicago people" I think what you were seeing as far as crowds go is all those people who were laid off for several months from Chrysler. I talked to several of the people I saw up north and the biggest share said they were laid off and did not want to sit around the house drawing unemployment worrying about their jobs. I do not think it is some sign that things are really not as bad as they are or that the Michigan economy has some how magically turned around on a corn husk and a prayer.

Ah, you're probably right. All of those people laid off from that one Chrysler plant in Illinois were traveling to Northwest Michigan in their Lexus's and BMW's.

I already said that I thought the bigger crowds were probably more due to lower gas prices compared to last year than anything else. I think Memorial Day last year was when gas prices jumped the $3.50 mark. I remember filling the boat with gas for about $4.00/gallon that first weekend last year, which we always pay about $.40 - $.50 more per gallon at the marina.

I guess my memory is not getting so bad after all:

Historical Price Charts - Michigan Gas Prices

[kanhawk]

I find this thread fascinating and scary too. I am hoping this isn't where my state of Washington is in a couple of years.
I don't want to hijack or divert this thread but I am interested in knowing if there has been a noticeable disappearance or decrease of Hispanic migrants (legal or illegal) from your state as your economy has gotten worse?
Here in Washington I am noticing small signs of this, for instance some apartment complexes that were almost exclusively Hispanic migrant are now seeing some vacancies and a few native born non-Hispanic Americans moving into these places as some of the construction and food processing jobs dry up.

[allistercrowly]

Originally Posted by kanhawk

I find this thread fascinating and scary too. I am hoping this isn't where my state of Washington is in a couple of years.
I don't want to hijack or divert this thread but I am interested in knowing if there has been a noticeable disappearance or decrease of Hispanic migrants (legal or illegal) from your state as your economy has gotten worse?
Here in Washington I am noticing small signs of this, for instance some apartment complexes that were almost exclusively Hispanic migrant are now seeing some vacancies and a few native born non-Hispanic Americans moving into these places as some of the construction and food processing jobs dry up.

Them migrants are moving to Mexico where there are still drug jobs and those who are loosing their homes and Lesus and BMWs are moving into the migrant appartments. LOL. Its all good.