[JimmyInGreatLakes]

Originally Posted by Wulf67

I have seen these signs at a few UAW office parking lots. No further comment...

Does this mean I could park my Nissan Altima but not my Chevy Impala?

That's the joke these days. A Ford Fusion made it Mexico is "PC" but not all the Honda Accords made in America? I have an Accord but was seriously thinking of supporting GM because I heard their Malibus are pretty nice and I really DID want to support an American worker. Then the current administration started cashing in their political favors to GM and Chrysler (UAW) and turning capitalism on its head. So the only "American" company I would support now is Ford, who didn't have to grovel at the foot of the King and actually made serious strides with the UAW to improve their competitiveness. Otherwise, I'll consider any foreign car maker that builds in the US and doesn't kowtow to job-killing unions. If Michigan had ever become a right-to-work state (the ones doing pretty good these days), I believe they wouldn't be in the mess they are now.

[Nu$]

I drive a big black Mercedes-Benz S550. I know some people don't like it but in my neighborhood it is the status quo. I would say see what your neighbors are driving. I know the Benz isn't the most reliable but it sure is comfortable.

[cardboy2454]

one day i was in flint and i counted 3 foreign cars and 2 were owned by american companies and if your honda dies on the highway it may be missing a few pieces when you come back for it. since you are going to michigan these are things you should know; Ford; 'Found On Road Dead'. GMC; 'Got a Mechanic Coming', Freightliners are Freightshakers and Mopar stands for 'Most Often Parts Are Required'.

[scolls]

Originally Posted by JimmyInGreatLakes

That's the joke these days. A Ford Fusion made it Mexico is "PC" but not all the Honda Accords made in America? I have an Accord but was seriously thinking of supporting GM because I heard their Malibus are pretty nice and I really DID want to support an American worker. Then the current administration started cashing in their political favors to GM and Chrysler (UAW) and turning capitalism on its head. So the only "American" company I would support now is Ford, who didn't have to grovel at the foot of the King and actually made serious strides with the UAW to improve their competitiveness. Otherwise, I'll consider any foreign car maker that builds in the US and doesn't kowtow to job-killing unions. If Michigan had ever become a right-to-work state (the ones doing pretty good these days), I believe they wouldn't be in the mess they are now.

Perhaps you can explain to me how these job killing unions works. Less than 10% the price of the vehicle is from labor. Toyota actually pays more per hour than the Big 3, Honda slightly less, and both have highers starting wages.

GM had nearly 600,000 UAW workers in 1998. They mad 8 million cars and posted a 2 billion dollar profit. In 2008, GM had less than 300,000 UAW workers, made 8 million cars, and posted a 30 billion dollar loss.

Lets also consider GM's sales are down nearly 50%. How do you expect to make money when you sell half of what you did last year? Is that the union's fault? What about the fact that GM's market share is half of what it was? Is that the union's fault as well?

Is it the union's fault GM did not invest in the retirement fund 30 years ago like they were suppose to? the union even compromised and took all the retiree health care off of GM's hands.

[jmlowman]

Originally Posted by Wulf67

I have seen these signs at a few UAW office parking lots. No further comment...

Does this mean I could park my Nissan Altima but not my Chevy Impala?

Is local 659 the one in Flint? If so, my great uncle worked as a custodian there years ago.

[Coldjensens]

At first I was going to anser "Yes - most people in Michigan drive US or foreign cars" However the correct answer is probably that most people in Michigan drive cars that are both US AND foreign.

However to answer what you are actaully asking, one of the things that we first noticed when we moved here from Califronia is the lack of foreign car brands. Mazda is pretty common since they are fords, and Saab is pretty common (I think that GM owns them or most of them). Honda and Toyota defintely have a presence here, but not the majority that is clearly visible in California and other Western States. However the overwhelming majority of cars are form the Big 3 automakers. You do not see a lot of BMW, Jaguar, Range Rover, Mercedes, Ferarri, Porsche, VW, Subaru, Rolls Royce, Smart, KIA, Hyundai, or the smaller foreign companies and exotics. In fact, there are very few dealerships for "foreign" cars. When my father in law was visiting and needed a new starter in his honda, we had to drive 40 miles to get to a Honda dealership.

I am looking for a pick up truck right now and I cannot realistically consider a honda or toyota because you simply never know when a client or potential client has strong family ties to the auto industry and may be offended by the money that he spends going to buy a foreign marque vehicle. It is not super common to offend someone but it does happen and is not worth the risk for me. You are never going to offend someone by driving a big three vehicle. (Foremer big three, not the current big three).

It can be a problem. It is not as bad as it was in the early 1980s when I was driving a honda and was run off the road several times by people who flipped me off and yells "Buy American A-hole". I do nto think that happens much any more if at all, but if you are in service or sales, I would not drive a foreign marque in the metro detroit area (meaning wihtin 60 miles of Detroit).

[jmlowman]

I bought a Chevy Avalanche new in 2006 and I love it. If you actually use it as a truck, though, you may want a more standard pickup. I would also consider Ford; they have some nice-looking F-150s.

Before buying it a tried a Nissan Titan and wasn't as happy with the quality of acceleration or comfort. The Avalanche is a perfect fit for comfort.

In the past, my wife and I drove Isuzu mini-pickups and we had a Rodeo at one time. The mini-pickups had a known defect that caused the manifold to crack, and the Rodeo was barely out of warranty before needing expensive transmission (on a manual!) work and a head gasket.

Of course, it depends on your requirements for a pickup truck. No way on earth do I really need something that large, but call it the old-man-and-Cadillac syndrome. With my bad knee it's easier to climb in and slide out than having to deal with conventional (even full-size) cars where the chassis is barely off the ground. And the Avalanche was a perfect fit from the beginning. I'd buy another one.

[zthatzmanz28]

I have both...neither were bought new so no one benefited from my money other than the private owners I bought them from...

sry GM....

[JimmyInGreatLakes]

Originally Posted by scolls

Perhaps you can explain to me how these job killing unions works. Less than 10% the price of the vehicle is from labor. Toyota actually pays more per hour than the Big 3, Honda slightly less, and both have highers starting wages.

GM had nearly 600,000 UAW workers in 1998. They mad 8 million cars and posted a 2 billion dollar profit. In 2008, GM had less than 300,000 UAW workers, made 8 million cars, and posted a 30 billion dollar loss.

Lets also consider GM's sales are down nearly 50%. How do you expect to make money when you sell half of what you did last year? Is that the union's fault? What about the fact that GM's market share is half of what it was? Is that the union's fault as well?

Is it the union's fault GM did not invest in the retirement fund 30 years ago like they were suppose to? the union even compromised and took all the retiree health care off of GM's hands.

Too little too late (the union "compromise"). The hourly wage is only one component of the cost of a worker. The benefits that American companies pay ramp up the cost to a lot higher than that of a foreign carmaker. Plus, the work rules that unions foist upon these companies put up a big red flag to any foreign car company that is even thinking about putting a plant in a pro-union state. The line worker doesn't dare pick up that paper on the floor for fear of doing the job of the $28/hour janitor. None of that Mickey-Mouse stuff happens at Toyota or Honda because the company, that takes the risk and provides the JOBS, has more flexibility in the way they run THEIR company. Then there are the ever-present strikes and the "jobs bank". Yes, there's more to it than labor problems. The union workers didn't design the cars but the bottom line is, which companies and states are in less trouble? Right-to-work states or union states?

[curliq]

My Ohio-built '03 Honda Civic certainly does draw a lot of ire from the Big-3 cars on the expressways. Here's an example of the treatment you might expect with your Toyota:

On the drive home from Glen Arbor this past weekend, I was driving with the flow of traffic on southbound I-75 (we're talking 80-85 mph, middle lane traffic). A new, burgundy Chrysler Caravan careens behind my Honda, tailgating so closely I couldn't even see the guy's grille in my rear-view mirror. This jerk was aggressively accelerating and weaving all over my bumper, and after he finally decided to pass us and pick on some other unwitting foreign-car driver, you could see him snarling over his steering wheel - scary stuff...

...I incredulously looked at my boyfriend, and asked "Any chance that guy works for the UAW?.." My boyfriend glances over, points to the small "D" on the Chrysler's license plate and says, "Nope, he's probably a pissed-off dealer for one of the marked-for-closing Chrysler dealerships."