Lets put some optimisim back in Michigans corner.

[magellan]

Originally Posted by Schaumburger

I would appreciate any citation of sources.

Thanks Schaumburger, you beat me to it. I can find plenty of sources that say exactly the opposite, that light rail systems are at their highest ridership numbers in history. The Minneapolis Hiawatha Line is nearly double the ridership of their initial estimates. Portland's system alone gets over 35 Million riders a year, the most in its history.

Being a "novelty fad" probably explains why there is a 20 year waiting list to get federal funding from the FTA's New Starts program.

Here's at least one source that shows ridership on light rail and commuter rail has just exploded since 2002:

http://www.cfte.org/critics/what.asp

BTW, Grand Rapid's population density is the same as Salt Lake City's and Denver's. There is congestion in Grand Rapids as well. Try coming into downtown on 131 from Northern Kent County in the morning. Just because it's not a 16 lane superhighway does not mean it's not stop-n-go (which is what defines "congestion").

But hey, back to Michigan Optimism.

[randomguymike]

Originally Posted by Cato the Elder

More than the auto industry, in Metro Detroit, I am worried about how insular the suburbs (and especially A2 and UMich) are towards its surrounding area. I know for a fact that UMich looks down its nose at Wayne State like it's their red-headed stepbrother.

I would agree UMich finds no use for Wayne(I kinda feel the same way), but most folks in Ann Arbor are forced to go to Detroit if they want to see professional sporting events or near-world-class arts. I would take the train to Detroit 27 times a year to go to Toger games and another 8 to go to Lions, for sure. It'd be nice to be able to knock back a few beers and not have to worry about the 45 minute drive. Problem with most of the plans I see now is they expect to cater to business folks and not the late night crowd.

[Schaumburger]

Huge optimism in Grand Rapids. GR will add some 3,600 jobs in the SE Side! I'm surprised this didn't get a mention anywhere on this forum...

The first project at the old Steelcase industrial building, located at 36th and 44th streets and Eastern Avenue in Grand Rapids is the larger of the two. City of Grand Rapids Developer Ashley Capital will use a brownfield tax credit of $5,425,368 to redevelop the 206.4-acre site. The complex will be converted to a mixed-use commercial, residential and “light industrial complex.” The project, announced in March will happen in 12 phases and will include demolition of 3 factories, redevelopment of 15 industrial and support structures and will lead to 3,600 jobs.

-- http://www.wzzm13.com/news/news_arti...?storyid=75286

I see two economies in Michigan.

[orchardman2]

Originally Posted by joenc

LRT is the latest urban planning fad and at its core, a novelty. Houston's line has been a ridership failure, Portland's isn't carrying as many people as they projected and ridership is declining. There is NO LRT line that is successful from a ridership standpoint, only a few meet projections.

You cannot claim that new development is only occurring because of the new transit lines. Atlanta has more new intown development than any of the cities you mentioned, aside from Chicago, and it's not happening because of the rail line. There is a rail line, but it is, for all intents and purposes, not possible to use and not used in the growth areas. It's looked down upon as underclass. The shift towards urban living is the reason development is happening.

Grand Rapids is a small city, with little density, and no real congestion problems. There is no possibility of LRT being faster than taking a car, no one will ride it. It is a complete and total waste of money.

If Michigan wants to slit its collective throat further, by all means it should continue.

This is so wrong it's laughable. Portland epitomizes the success of light rail -- it's where people go when they want to study a success story. Ridership has far succeeded expectations, with more new rail lines planned well into the future. Tremendous economic development (commercial and residential) all along the light rail and street car lines IS A DIRECT RESULT of the lines. It's not even debated. Salt Lake City is another success story. Denver. Minneapolis. And on and on. Fad... are you kidding me?
Do some more research.