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Old 12-21-2013, 02:31 AM
 
Location: Hawaii/Alabama
1,595 posts, read 2,968,048 times
Reputation: 3983

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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnnieA View Post
Oh great. You might as well be speaking spanish as far as the non military on here are concerned. I hate when my son does this, as well.
Sorry, but this is a Military forum and the vast majority of us here are either AD, former Military or spouses and we understand the acronyms. Perhaps you might take a few moments to familiarize yourself with them as it would make the forum more accessible to you.

I am NOT trying to make you uncomfortable, but this is the way we communicate and it would be a pita to have to fully write out every acronym that civilians might not be comfortable with.

Please do not take offense as my response to your post is only meant to explain where are coming from.

Have a wonderful holiday season.
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Old 12-21-2013, 06:13 AM
 
Location: Richmond, VA
2,633 posts, read 4,393,337 times
Reputation: 4213
Quote:
Originally Posted by PFM View Post
O-6 level, happens all the time. I personally know 3 that retired in the last 2 years and stepped into nice setups - one at the Pentagon, the other two as contractors for the state. I don't see it as much different than the multitude of former Congress critters that are now "Consultants" or "Lobbyists". Is their retirement affected in the same manner?
You see a pretty fair bit of O-5 to GS-13 or 14, also.
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Old 12-23-2013, 04:52 AM
 
Location: :~)
1,483 posts, read 2,823,516 times
Reputation: 1519
During my career, I worked my butt off, so like many others, I earned my keep. I wish someone would have told me that as SSgt with children that I was making big bucks...maybe that would have stopped me from using WIC or heading to the food stamp line. So now, I am retired now and living the high life...not! I will agree the retirement check does provide me the comfort in the fact that if I get fired from my current job that I can still make a house payment. Is that raking in the big bucks!?!

For those who complain about officer retirement checks should really investigate the situation before making silly statements. Personally speaking, I butted heads many officers, many!!, but even I can confirm that they humped it. I know they are not normally on the front lines but they are making decisions that impact lives and trust me they are held accountable for those good and bad decisions.

I understand the need to make changes to improve the economy. I have better ideas:
- cut all stateside AAFES;
- charge contractors gym membership, charge air show entry fee, charge BX entry fees;
- cut/minimize stateside military housing; cut/minimize dorms;
- actually merge "all" bases making them joint(what is taking sooo long for this to happen); why have guard and active bases regionally...merge them; merge European bases;
- need a large inventory of tanks/aircraft/ships/missiles/etc...we need to reduce the base footprint;
- Cut welfare (make people work)

Our country's leadership must brainstorm for more options and leave the military alone. Military benefits should not be one of the proposed changes.
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Old 12-23-2013, 07:06 AM
 
1,162 posts, read 1,266,619 times
Reputation: 1629
Tricare for life, actually the whole military healthcare system is in place to keep military doctors skill sets up so they are fighting fit for deployment. So that is not a waste in the least.

Speaking of Doctors in the military, quite a few of my friends are military Doctors and they make peanuts compared to civilian doctors who never have to move or deploy, even with the bonuses the military pays them to supplement their income.

In retirement they will make less than 25% of their Active Duty wages, since bonuses aren't considered in retirement pay, so a Doctor who did 20 and a supply officer that did 20 will get the same retirement pay despite vastly different contributions to the military system.

And unlike those supply officers, military Doctors actually get recalled while drawing their "retirement" pay (it's actually more of a retainer, but few get called back).

And you are saying their pension is unfair? Ok that's a bit much.
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Old 12-23-2013, 07:52 AM
 
Location: New Mexico U.S.A.
24,130 posts, read 38,871,775 times
Reputation: 28092
Quote:
Originally Posted by MDrenter223 View Post
And unlike those supply officers, military Doctors actually get recalled while drawing their "retirement" pay (it's actually more of a retainer, but few get called back).
I have about 30+ years experience being treated by military doctors (22 years active duty and about 10 after I retired), Of course my family also saw a lot of military doctors, so my opinion is a bit different than what you claimed.

All retirees who spent at least 20 years in the military and who draw a retired pay can be recalled to active duty for life. However, Department of Defense Directive 1352.1 Management and Mobilization of Regular and Reserve Retired Military Members (The URL is to the Directive in PDF) make recall to active duty unlikely for those who have been retired for more than five years, and those over the age of 60.

Quote:
4. POLICY

4.1. It is DoD policy that military retirees be ordered to active duty as needed to perform such duties as the Secretary concerned considers necessary in the interests of national defense as described in Sections 12301 and 688 of reference (b).

4.2. The DoD Components and the Commandant of the U.S. Coast Guard shall plan to use as many retirees as necessary to meet national security needs.

4.3. The military retirees or dered to active duty may be used according to guidance prescribed by the Secretary concerned as follows:
....
Etc, etc, etc....
I have two close friends who have passed on who were Commissioned and served in WWII and were called back to active duty for the Korean police action as well as Vietnam. I have met others over the years.I would like to see some verifiable numbers from your claims...
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Old 12-23-2013, 08:36 AM
 
1,162 posts, read 1,266,619 times
Reputation: 1629
Quote:
Originally Posted by Poncho_NM View Post
I have about 30+ years experience being treated by military doctors (22 years active duty and about 10 after I retired), Of course my family also saw a lot of military doctors, so my opinion is a bit different than what you claimed.

All retirees who spent at least 20 years in the military and who draw a retired pay can be recalled to active duty for life. However, Department of Defense Directive 1352.1 Management and Mobilization of Regular and Reserve Retired Military Members (The URL is to the Directive in PDF) make recall to active duty unlikely for those who have been retired for more than five years, and those over the age of 60.
Etc, etc, etc....
I have two close friends who have passed on who were Commissioned and served in WWII and were called back to active duty for the Korean police action as well as Vietnam. I have met others over the years.I would like to see some verifiable numbers from your claims...
Of course my info comes from medical officers who are wary of doing long careers lest they get recalled as many of them saw doctors well in excess of 5 years post retirement get called back to practice military medicine at a great cost to their families.

It's pretty easy to see that this is more likely to happen to a professional, it takes a whole to train them. Where you can train up a ground pounder out of high school in 6 months, or a Logistics Officer fresh outta college in a few weeks, it would take a minimum of 5 years (once internship year is complete they can practice solo) to train up a Doc, and up to 11 years for some specialities, and it's not so easy to buy these assets as they graduate like you can the MBA graduate, that's why the military pays for their medical school. But if we ever were to get into a troop surge situation again, they wouldn't be able to grow the medical corps as fast as the combat corps and they would have to recall those guys in masse, just as they did 5 years ago.
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Old 12-23-2013, 08:42 AM
 
1,162 posts, read 1,266,619 times
Reputation: 1629
But my point wasn't poor doctors, it was that the military retirement system is actually pretty cheap for what it gets the military in return. It has a large pool of people it can call on as it needs, and the reserve cost is always lower than the active duty cost, and depending on the career field it can be dimes on the dollar. This keeps that dreaded draft at bay (I for one refused to fill out a selective service card (ok, before I get flamed,I was in the military before I was 18 so I didn't have to fill out the card)).

So that cost of living adjustment is a big deal, and people complaining about the military collecting retirement at 38 or 42 need to realize that there are very thick strings attached.
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Old 12-23-2013, 08:55 AM
 
Location: New Mexico U.S.A.
24,130 posts, read 38,871,775 times
Reputation: 28092
Quote:
Originally Posted by MDrenter223 View Post
Of course my info comes from medical officers who are wary of doing long careers lest they get recalled as many of them saw doctors well in excess of 5 years post retirement get called back to practice military medicine at a great cost to their families.
We no longer have the draft....

They volunteered and took an oath. Their military service was because one of a variety of events. They became medical doctors because they wanted to serve their country. They had a legal debt payment which they incurred after having their medical education paid for. Or a combination...

So you are telling me the DoD directive is not true?

Then, never mind...
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Old 12-23-2013, 09:13 AM
 
1,162 posts, read 1,266,619 times
Reputation: 1629
Quote:
Originally Posted by Poncho_NM View Post
We no longer have the draft....

They volunteered and took an oath. Their military service was because one of a variety of events. They became medical doctors because they wanted to serve their country. They had a legal debt payment which they incurred after having their medical education paid for. Or a combination...

So you are telling me the DoD directive is not true?

Then, never mind...
Sure we aren't using a draft, but it is still an option that could be used, but the retirement system is a step in keeping it at bay.

Please show me where I disagreed with that directive? It only serves to say they can call back retirees in different categories if they need them. And I stated that they are more likely to need a medical professional due to their unique skill set and the long dwell time between the military awarding a medical school scholarship and getting a doctor it can use.

Really not sure what you are trying to say.
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Old 12-23-2013, 12:14 PM
 
17,895 posts, read 9,836,596 times
Reputation: 17371
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbub22 View Post
- cut all stateside AAFES;
AEFES pays for MWR.

Quote:
- charge contractors gym membership,
That's small change

Quote:
charge air show entry fee,
Thagt's one of those unquantifiable "keeps the country willing to vote for the military budget" factos.

Quote:
charge BX entry fees;
What do you mean by that? A cover charge for going through the door?

Quote:
- cut/minimize stateside military housing; cut/minimize dorms;
That will cost more, not less. BAH is based on 75% of what it actually costs to live off base, which means that living off base is actually more of a strain on the budget than living on base. There is an cost factor involved for dealing with personal problems. Speaking as a senior NCO, I'd much rather keep as many people on base as possible, especially junior enlisted (both married and unmarried). Prior to the 90s, senior enlisted got priority for Air Force family housing--in the late 90s, they changed that system to give junior enlisted priority. I was totally in favor of that change.


Quote:
- actually merge "all" bases making them joint(what is taking sooo long for this to happen); why have guard and active bases regionally...merge them; merge European bases;
Mm, well, Ft Sill is 40 miles from Altus AFB. How do you make that merger work?

Quote:
need a large inventory of tanks/aircraft/ships/missiles/etc...we need to reduce the base footprint;
You can't just stockpile weapons. Weapons actually "go bad" over time. And you have to keep training troops effectively in using them. That takes "base."

Quote:
- Cut welfare (make people work)
Find out what jobs are lying open, move people to where they are, train the people...then let's see how that works.

Quote:
Our country's leadership must brainstorm for more options and leave the military alone. Military benefits should not be one of the proposed changes.
Agree with that. Actually, reducing the mission--politicians not signing up for as many potential wars--would enable a significant reduction in the cost of the military.

What if...the nation had taken President Carter seriously in the 70s when he said we needed to take on oil independence from the Middle East as the "moral equivalent of war?" Dependence on Arab oil would not be a factor of American foreign policy today. The US response to the Iraqi invasion of Kuwait would have been the same as the US response to the Libyan invasion of Chad.
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