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Old 12-23-2013, 04:50 PM
 
Location: On The Road Full Time RVing
2,342 posts, read 2,788,498 times
Reputation: 2214

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Quote:
Originally Posted by GeorgiaTransplant View Post
"We all know that we need to slow cost growth in military compensation," Hagel told a Pentagon press conference. "We know that many proposals will be controversial and unpopular. ... Tough decisions will have to be made."

What makes that a lie?
Military personal are told how much, and when the will be eligible for pensions,
but now Military personal are going to loose some of that money they were promised.

That is the lie ... because they will not get it all as promised.

Ask those Military personal who will loose part of their money,
and they will tell you how it is a lie.

.
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Old 12-23-2013, 04:57 PM
 
Location: Richmond, VA
2,633 posts, read 4,397,841 times
Reputation: 4213
Quote:
Originally Posted by bumpus7 View Post
Military personal are told how much, and when the will be eligible for pensions,
but now Military personal are going to loose some of that money they were promised.

That is the lie ... because they will not get it all as promised.

Ask those Military personal who will loose part of their money,
and they will tell you how it is a lie.

.
That doesn't make Hagel a liar, which is what was implied in your first post. He may be advocating a very unpopular action, but that doesn't make him a liar. Specifically, the first line of the article is:

"The Pentagon's top civilian says it's time to tame burgeoning military personnel costs, but he's facing a test of wills with the nation's powerful veterans groups, which want no cut in their benefits. "

And you responded with,

Quote:
Originally Posted by bumpus7
What a liar ! ! !


It's okay to be pissed. But be pissed at the right people, and for the right reasons.
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Old 12-23-2013, 05:33 PM
 
Location: On The Road Full Time RVing
2,342 posts, read 2,788,498 times
Reputation: 2214
Quote:
Originally Posted by GeorgiaTransplant View Post
That doesn't make Hagel a liar, which is what was implied in your first post. He may be advocating a very unpopular action, but that doesn't make him a liar. Specifically, the first line of the article is:

"The Pentagon's top civilian says it's time to tame burgeoning military personnel costs, but he's facing a test of wills with the nation's powerful veterans groups, which want no cut in their benefits. "

And you responded with,



It's okay to be pissed. But be pissed at the right people, and for the right reasons.
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I'm not talking about any Hagel

The lie is from the government which are going to break their promise to military personnel.

.
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Old 12-23-2013, 05:33 PM
 
336 posts, read 247,676 times
Reputation: 537
Has Congress ever proposed tying the amount of the military pension to total income?

I think it is reprehensible that we would reduce future compensation (via a cost of living adjustment) to veterans that, forced to retire, are unable to find a job, or a job with a salary sufficient to maintain a comparable quality of life for their families.

On the other hand, we have 50-year old GS15s and SES'rs in government (who were given preference in hiring) receiving $30-40K pensions on top of their $150-180K salaries. We also have military contractors receiving the same pensions on top of $200-300K salaries. As a taxpayer, I find that equally offensive.

IMO, taxpayers should not be paying $30-40K pensions to military retirees (admittedly, forced retirees) whom have found well-paying jobs outside the military. The free pension is intended to provide a social safety net for officers that are forced to retire. It was never intended to pad the pockets of those that have established successful careers outside the military.

All that said, I agree that you cannot take pensions way from existing military retirees, or officers that have remained officers because of the promise of the no-strings-attached pension. Rather, I think such a change makes sense for future officers, or perhaps existing officers with less than 5 years of service.
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Old 12-23-2013, 05:46 PM
 
Location: On The Road Full Time RVing
2,342 posts, read 2,788,498 times
Reputation: 2214
Quote:
Originally Posted by VAGeek View Post
All that said, I agree that you cannot take pensions way from existing military retirees, or officers that have remained officers because of the promise of the no-strings-attached pension. Rather, I think such a change makes sense for future officers, or perhaps existing officers with less than 5 years of service.
I can agree with future pensions who have not yet qualified being stopped.

Most stay in for large pension

But if you do they stop the pensions the soilders will end their time in the military
which will leave few enlisted to fill future posisions.

Now comes the draft.

.
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Old 12-23-2013, 06:07 PM
 
Location: Fayetteville, NC
437 posts, read 576,241 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VAGeek View Post

On the other hand, we have 50-year old GS15s and SES'rs in government (who were given preference in hiring) receiving $30-40K pensions on top of their $150-180K salaries. We also have military contractors receiving the same pensions on top of $200-300K salaries. As a taxpayer, I find that equally offensive.

IMO, taxpayers should not be paying $30-40K pensions to military retirees (admittedly, forced retirees) whom have found well-paying jobs outside the military. The free pension is intended to provide a social safety net for officers that are forced to retire. It was never intended to pad the pockets of those that have established successful careers outside the military.
Maybe a compromise would be to means test the pension for military retirees under a certain age (62?), but add a percentage to their pension for each year that they don't draw it after their military retirement. For example, a 42 year old retiree who works another 20 years but waits on drawing his/her military pension tacks on 1-2% (tax exempt) each year.
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Old 12-23-2013, 06:40 PM
 
Location: On The Road Full Time RVing
2,342 posts, read 2,788,498 times
Reputation: 2214
.
Cutting the amount of military promised pensions to people who qualify
is like stopping Social Security promised payments to people who qualify ! ! !

.
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Old 12-23-2013, 06:46 PM
 
Location: Richmond, VA
2,633 posts, read 4,397,841 times
Reputation: 4213
Quote:
Originally Posted by bumpus7 View Post
I'm not talking about any Hagel

The lie is from the government which are going to break their promise to military personnel.

.
The article is essentially about Hagel making a statement this has to happen.

What you're mad about is that it's happening at all.

I used to hate this phrase until I realized that it does sometimes apply: words matter. Using the phrase 'what a liar' in an article essentially pointed at a single official means you think the official is a liar. And the word liar means 'a person who tells lies'. You meant something different. So, say something different.

Last edited by GeorgiaTransplant; 12-23-2013 at 06:57 PM..
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Old 12-23-2013, 07:11 PM
 
Location: On The Road Full Time RVing
2,342 posts, read 2,788,498 times
Reputation: 2214
Quote:
Originally Posted by GeorgiaTransplant View Post
The article is essentially about Hagel making a statement this has to happen.

What you're mad about is that it's happening at all.

I used to hate this phrase until I realized that it does sometimes apply: words matter. Using the phrase 'what a liar' in an article essentially pointed at a single official means you think the official is a liar. And the word liar means 'a person who tells lies'. You meant something different. So, say something different.
Your mind is set on what you think no matter what I have said or saying,
and You don't get what I am saying and from the way you are
responding you probably never ...

.
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Old 12-23-2013, 08:13 PM
 
Location: NE Mississippi
11,382 posts, read 7,416,523 times
Reputation: 16980
I don't get the uproar:
Quote:
......groups are fighting curbs in annual pension increases for military retirees under age 62 that are part of the new budget deal passed by Congress last week and awaiting President Barack Obama's signature.
Annual pension increases have been cut. Not the pension.
So? My pension from 3M works like that. I never get an increase. Ever. And there are many, many working folks who have not had a pay raise in years.

It'll be fine.
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