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Old 03-19-2017, 04:55 PM
 
2,787 posts, read 790,628 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Unsettomati View Post
That's precisely it.

USAF BMT is mission-oriented. The fact that it was tougher when some poster enlisted in 1965 is completely and utterly irrelevant. The fact that some people think it should be tougher because they dislike society in 2017 is irrelevant. The fact that some people just can't understand that times change and that the needs of the military change with them is irrelevant.

All that matters is that the Air Force is taking recruits and efficiently creating USAF personnel. Period.
I thought the AF Basic Training would be quite physical because those 4 "techs" who turn the ladder for the one "specialist" who holds the light bulb have to have upper body strength.


( a common joke passed around by us sailors in Aviation )

 
Old 03-19-2017, 08:21 PM
 
Location: Wasilla, AK
2,367 posts, read 1,101,063 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frogburn View Post
Ground troops take cities and hills. In the recent Iraq war Marines with help from the Army took the City of Fulujah (spelling?) in what I suspect will be studied for centuries in military history right up their with what was it
.. Stalingrad. Marines took the city battling building to building, floor to floor, room to room.




That said... "The hardest thing" can be overrated to some extent. It's not overrated in terms of the individual's accomplishment to survive or excecl in that challenge of course, the phase or school one must pass through.

But it can be overated in terms of perceptions of "need." You don't need to go the Ranger school, pass through Marine boot camp, become a member of the British SAS to learn how to shoot someone in the chest or cut their throat. And rebel outfits be they called terrorists or freedom fighters can be effective in fighting regular military organizations with tough boot camps.

As for post number 1: I think the objective and cultural objectives of each military branch might be considered. I was in the Marines but the US Marines want brainwashed people that will run very obdiently towards gun fire. Like Joe Pesci's character in the movie Casino when he threatens the Irish business guy about returning his money back, Joe Pesci's tells the guy that he (Joe) is "stupid." He's stupid enough to crack the guy's head open and go to prison for it he's telling him. So, the mafia needed "stupid" men that risk their own safety and prosperity, throwing all to the wind. Likewise, the US Marine Corps likes stupid men. They take pride in the deragatory term "jarhead."

But so far as I can tell from video documentary, in terms of yelling at recruits, the US Air Force is faaaaaaar tougher than the boot camp of the British Royal Marines. They're all nice and soft spoken, concerned and caring for the recruits emotional and mental state. Some of those dudes would not have survived the black North Side of Milwaukee. But yet... the British Royal Marines seem to still make up a pretty effective fighting force.
Nothing like trash talking about the Marine Corps. I spent six years in the Corps and was honorably discharged. The Marine Corps provided me with a foundation on which to build a successful military career. I never felt that the Marine Corps wanted stupid people. There is no place in any branch for stupid people. The Marine Corps wants disciplined and motivated people. Not all people are a good fit for the Corps. Maybe you're one of those. I consider it an honor to have been a Marine and one thing I won't ever do is trash talk the Marine Corps.

That aside, I've swapped war stories about boot camp with a lot of Air Force and Air Guard guys and none had any stories that compared to my experience in Marine Corps boot camp.
 
Old 03-20-2017, 10:55 AM
 
Location: East Helena, MT
424 posts, read 189,449 times
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Granted, DI's can't physically abuse recruits any longer, but they can still punish you in ways that will get under your skin. They can still strip you down to your skivvies, have you roll in sand, and then put your clothes back on you. They also can make you walk like a duck all day, or clean the grout in the head with a toothbrush. I observed all of these in Navy boot camp.


As was said, some recruits aren't cut out to be in the military, so they have to "motivate" them to leave anyway they can.
 
Old 03-20-2017, 11:03 AM
 
13,076 posts, read 6,281,466 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlaskaErik View Post
Nothing like trash talking about the Marine Corps. I spent six years in the Corps and was honorably discharged. The Marine Corps provided me with a foundation on which to build a successful military career. I never felt that the Marine Corps wanted stupid people. There is no place in any branch for stupid people. The Marine Corps wants disciplined and motivated people. Not all people are a good fit for the Corps. Maybe you're one of those. I consider it an honor to have been a Marine and one thing I won't ever do is trash talk the Marine Corps.

That aside, I've swapped war stories about boot camp with a lot of Air Force and Air Guard guys and none had any stories that compared to my experience in Marine Corps boot camp.
As noted in post #30, it doesn't have to and in fact, shouldn't.


Basic training isn't about who comes out with the best stories.


Nor am I ashamed that Air Force had air conditioned tents in Saudi during the Gulf War. Not ashamed at all.
 
Old 03-20-2017, 11:15 AM
 
2,787 posts, read 790,628 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph_Kirk View Post
As noted in post #30, it doesn't have to and in fact, shouldn't.


Basic training isn't about who comes out with the best stories.


Nor am I ashamed that Air Force had air conditioned tents in Saudi during the Gulf War. Not ashamed at all.
However, when posters proclaim ......"there is no difference"......I have to question their sanity.
 
Old 03-20-2017, 02:36 PM
 
13,076 posts, read 6,281,466 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David A Stone View Post
However, when posters proclaim ......"there is no difference"......I have to question their sanity.
This is what someone said earlier in the thread:


Quote:
Basic training is pretty much the same across all services. There's differences that focus on each branch, but by and large it's all the same thing. It's just a course intended to teach you the military lifestyle and the basics of how to function in a new environment.

This is what I said at greater length, and what that earlier poster intended:


Quote:
The most important thing the military does in basic training is to indoctrinate and re-socialize the average indolent, self-indulgent, self-centered American kid into someone with a devotion to corps, a focus on mission, an ethic of obedience to command, and the will to prevail.


Besides that, they need to teach recruits how to closely follow explicit instructions, because that's another thing young Americans generally don't know how to do...even when they're trying.

Nobody here has said that the physical components of the various service basic training experiences are the same, nor has anyone meant that.
 
Old 03-20-2017, 06:15 PM
 
2,787 posts, read 790,628 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph_Kirk View Post
This is what someone said earlier in the thread:





This is what I said at greater length, and what that earlier poster intended:





Nobody here has said that the physical components of the various service basic training experiences are the same, nor has anyone meant that.


........" but by and large it's all the same thing "..

I was Navy and don't believe it for a minute and I believe an Air Force vet would get laughed at if he tried to convince a Marine of that.
 
Old 03-20-2017, 06:21 PM
 
13,076 posts, read 6,281,466 times
Reputation: 11923
Quote:
Originally Posted by David A Stone View Post
........" but by and large it's all the same thing "..

I was Navy and don't believe it for a minute and I believe an Air Force vet would get laughed at if he tried to convince a Marine of that.
Well, okay, David, if walking around with your panties in a bunch feels good, continue doing it for as long as it feels good.
 
Old 03-20-2017, 06:59 PM
 
2,787 posts, read 790,628 times
Reputation: 4996
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph_Kirk View Post
Well, okay, David, if walking around with your panties in a bunch feels good, continue doing it for as long as it feels good.
One should not post comments they are not willing to back up and instead resort to degrading anyone who questions you.


I hope you did not learn ...that...in Air Force boot camp.
 
Old 03-24-2017, 10:01 AM
 
207 posts, read 49,325 times
Reputation: 423
This thread is starting to go off the rails with a "measuring contest".

No one is saying air force boot camp is the same or equally difficult to marine boot camp.

What I had tried to explain earlier was that IMO 75% of all the branches boot camps are very similar in design, operation, goals, techniques etc... They are all designed using extensive amounts of psychologists input and learned experience how to transform a random lazy undisciplined inattentive individual civilian into being a member of the military. The techniques of all branches are similar in how they accomplish this.

Where each individual branch differs is the other 25-50% of their program.

A perfect example in similarities and differences is the gas chamber. In the air force they only made me stand in there exposed without my mask on breathing in for maybe 10 seconds. My friends in the marines told stories they had the door locked on them and forced to do jumping Jack's or something similar for like 30 seconds. Both have a similar event but differ in how it's executed.

No one is on here saying the air force boot camp is as physically hard as army or marines because it isnt, and everyone knows it isn't. However mentally there are many of the same stressful experiences that are shared by all. That is the point people are making when they say a lot of it is the same. Believe me air force TIs are very good at screwing with you and can make your life hell if they want. I'm certain navy, army marine drill instructors all share the same love and ability of screwing with and breaking down trainees. Air force boot camp isn't easy. I personally saw trainees in my squadron threaten/attempt either escape going AWOL or suicide. If it was so easy they wouldn't have lost it.

Here's an example of a typical significant difference. The air force isn't marching 30 miles with packs or spending endless days at the shooting range. Instead of those activities they were probably in a classroom watching an anti sexual harrassment power point or something similar.

Another example
When the marines or army were running 5 miles in combat gear, the air force is running 3 miles in PT gear. Both groups are getting yelled at by drill instructors along the way.

Close order drill and marching. Probably a very similar experience. My God did we screw up and have lots of "encouragement" to stop screwing up drill commands. This is probably a very similar experience to all branches boot camps.

As with anything your mileage may vary.
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