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Old 03-29-2017, 06:52 PM
 
Location: Silicon Valley, CA
5,873 posts, read 4,182,408 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dmarie123 View Post
Actually once an officer is within 5 years of retirement they can not be "let go." Those people in the article were no on the "eve" of the their retirement, they were SIX YEARS from retirement.

This absolutely can happen to officers, as officers aren't always under contract the way enlisted are. This is why I've decided to stay enlisted even with my degree... job security. The Air Force has a long history of doing this to officers, although usually earlier in their career. It's a risk every officer is aware of, and really no different than corporate America.
Isn't there an "up or out" policy for officers in a rank - they have to get promoted to the next rank within, say, 6 years, or be obliged to leave the service?
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Old 03-29-2017, 07:10 PM
 
Location: New Mexico U.S.A.
22,340 posts, read 33,246,824 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by silverkris View Post
Isn't there an "up or out" policy for officers in a rank - they have to get promoted to the next rank within, say, 6 years, or be obliged to leave the service?
The 1980 Defense Officer Personnel Management Act mandates that officers passed over twice for promotion are required to be discharged from the military. There may be other reasons also...
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Old 03-30-2017, 04:29 AM
 
Location: Richmond, VA
2,346 posts, read 3,699,464 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Poncho_NM View Post
The 1980 Defense Officer Personnel Management Act mandates that officers passed over twice for promotion are required to be discharged from the military. There may be other reasons also...
In a practical sense, that means that historically, a brand-new officer would have had to make Lieutenant Colonel to make it to 20 years. If that brand-new officer had about 4 years of enlisted service, they would have to make Major:

2LT on entry
1LT ~2 years
CPT ~4 years
MAJ ~10-11 years
LTC ~16 years
COL ~21 years

Anybody who's sat a board will realize that the top 50% are very easy to pick out. It's at the margins (the top 20% and the bottom 20%) it becomes a whole lot more of a crapshoot.

Someone who fails promotion or is promoted above zone shouldn't think they are worthless, as some of it is chance on board character of both the year they were passed over and the year they were promoted. But the cut has to be made somewhere. Eventually, you'll stop getting promoted and that's a clue you've reached your maximum effectiveness.

A lot will change with the new retirement system. You still have to make 20 to get a pension, but the pension is smaller and it's not all or nothing-the Thrift Savings Plan will now have matching and becomes a lot more critical. A new officer who had been saving a lot along the way may be a lot more tempted to jump off at the 8 to 12 year mark under this system.
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Old 05-29-2017, 06:54 PM
 
Location: SW Missouri
681 posts, read 956,542 times
Reputation: 906
If anyone is curious on what happened on this

Air Force: Firing For Effect? | TIME.com

According to his Linkedin page, Kale did not go back to the USAF

http://www.linkedin.com/in/kale-mosley-55a2b73b
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Old 06-05-2017, 03:29 PM
 
Location: Metropolis IL
1,204 posts, read 1,447,233 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by silverkris View Post
Isn't there an "up or out" policy for officers in a rank - they have to get promoted to the next rank within, say, 6 years, or be obliged to leave the service?
I've been out of the loop for awhile, but in the Navy an O-4 had to make O-5 by 20 years, or retire. Same way with E-6 to E-7. It would vary from time to time, but most often those were the ranks and years. It was called High Year Tenure.

O-4 and E-6 were not that hard to make. Above those ranks it got fairly competitive. I believe there was another "up or out" at around 25 years. Usually one had to be an O-6 or E-9 to stay for 30.
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Old 06-06-2017, 07:49 PM
 
Location: Forests of Maine
27,163 posts, read 42,291,822 times
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A good friend of mine, was an E7 with a contract that went out to his 18th year. He assumed that he would be able to re-enlist at 18, for another 4 year contract. When his contract expired, they refused him another contract. This was during the Clinton era draw-down, so they were pushing to shrink the size on the Navy. After serving 18 years he was booted out.

I signed a 4 year contract at my 16th year, so I knew I was fully under contract out to my 20th anniversary. As an E6 20 years is my High-Year-Tenure date, so I could not stay in any longer anyway.
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Old 06-06-2017, 10:57 PM
 
Location: Metropolis IL
1,204 posts, read 1,447,233 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Submariner View Post
A good friend of mine, was an E7 with a contract that went out to his 18th year. He assumed that he would be able to re-enlist at 18, for another 4 year contract. When his contract expired, they refused him another contract. This was during the Clinton era draw-down, so they were pushing to shrink the size on the Navy. After serving 18 years he was booted out.

I signed a 4 year contract at my 16th year, so I knew I was fully under contract out to my 20th anniversary. As an E6 20 years is my High-Year-Tenure date, so I could not stay in any longer anyway.
During the Cold War draw down, there was what was known as the Temporary Early Retirement Authority (TERA). Those with between 15 and 20 years, that were in overmanned rates or officer designators, could apply for retirement. It was treated as a regular 20 year retirement, except the retainer pay was reduced a certain percentage for each month shy of 20 years. Unless there was a matter of misconduct, your friend should've qualified for this.

The BRAC rounds of this era, closed a bunch of NAS's. It wasn't uncommon for everyone on board these Air Stations, with 15-20 years in, to get offered early retirement.

There was also a separation bonus paid to some who didn't have 15 years in. I think it started at 8 years service, and also had certain pay grade restrictions.

It's been a long time ago now, so some of my recollection may be off a little.
'
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Old 06-07-2017, 12:26 AM
 
Location: Southwest
1,092 posts, read 590,758 times
Reputation: 735
Quote:
Originally Posted by Submariner View Post
A good friend of mine, was an E7 with a contract that went out to his 18th year. He assumed that he would be able to re-enlist at 18, for another 4 year contract. When his contract expired, they refused him another contract. This was during the Clinton era draw-down, so they were pushing to shrink the size on the Navy. After serving 18 years he was booted out.

Was he precluded from receiving a pension and retirement healthcare benefits?
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Old 06-07-2017, 05:26 AM
 
Location: Forests of Maine
27,163 posts, read 42,291,822 times
Reputation: 13903
Quote:
Originally Posted by BLS2753 View Post
During the Cold War draw down, there was what was known as the Temporary Early Retirement Authority (TERA). Those with between 15 and 20 years, that were in overmanned rates or officer designators, could apply for retirement. It was treated as a regular 20 year retirement, except the retainer pay was reduced a certain percentage for each month shy of 20 years. Unless there was a matter of misconduct, your friend should've qualified for this.

The BRAC rounds of this era, closed a bunch of NAS's. It wasn't uncommon for everyone on board these Air Stations, with 15-20 years in, to get offered early retirement.

There was also a separation bonus paid to some who didn't have 15 years in. I think it started at 8 years service, and also had certain pay grade restrictions.

It's been a long time ago now, so some of my recollection may be off a little.
'
In about 1991, they were offering cash bonuses to some NECs to leave the Navy. I went to a session where they explained it, but my NEC was not offered anything.

What the Navy was paying for SRB was far more than the money to get out.



Quote:
Originally Posted by curiousgeorge5 View Post
Was he precluded from receiving a pension and retirement healthcare benefits?
Yes, he did not get a pension, nor healthcare benefits [beyond the VA].
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Old 06-07-2017, 06:02 AM
 
Location: Metropolis IL
1,204 posts, read 1,447,233 times
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It's unlikely the Navy would be offering an option of either SRB or a separation bonus to the same group of sailors. Kind of counter productive. But Navy personnel policies didn't always follow logic.
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