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Old 08-20-2017, 11:06 AM
 
Location: Central Massachusetts
3,883 posts, read 3,542,313 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M3 Mitch View Post
While enlisted people do sometimes go on to be commissioned officers, it's rare for them to rise to "flag rank" (general, admiral).

It takes some luck along with willingness to learn to do the "next job up the line" for a long time to get to flag rank. And senior management skills, which you can learn if you want, but come to some more readily than others.

For most enlisted people, making it to E-9 is probably a more realistic "stretch goal" - and this is not an easy goal, only the top 1% of enlisted people can be E-9.
That is exactly point on. A lot of my peers either made senior NCO meaning E7-E9. About a third of them slipped on over to the warrant officer program. That line a good career end is CW4 with a very select few CW5. I made 1SG/E8 and finally retired.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Remington Steel View Post
Only if you plan on making it a career and beyond. I'm glad I made it to retirement and RETIRED! I got fed up with all of it and refused to play the azz-kissing games also. I made it to a Senior Enlisted rank, but I know some who made it all the way to E-9 by doing 25% of their actual job and 75% networking, working special duties, back stabbing their peers, kissing the right azz, volunteering for as many deployments as possible thus not making their families priority, etc. But hey, if those are their priorities to get to the top and not during any of their time reaching their "goal" they thought to at least get a 2 year college degree (because there is life after the military), hey... to each his own....smh

Officers are a little different because most are groomed from an early career to get the "right" assignments.

Know a few of those a$$ kissers too. Usually the E9's had to be aggressive enough to push one or two people to the weigh side. For me it was timing and being able to wait for just the right opening. Take the spot and take care of the soldiers beneath me.
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Old 08-23-2017, 05:32 AM
 
Location: Tampa, FL
24,680 posts, read 20,850,323 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Debnor View Post
I get that the vast majority are enlisted and stay in either long enough just for benefits and the like, but what kind of people actually manage to do all that's required to become a General/Admiral etc.?
Most have to start off by going to one of the Service Academies.

I recently stayed at the Air Force Academy for a week and saw what's required. These cadets are truly among our finest young adults. It really re-energized me as an American as I've been depressed for our country since Friday, 20th January 2017. Very proud to see what the academy is producing. I recommend every American stop by the academy visitor's center if you have just an hour or two and you're passing through Colorado Springs, just south of Denver. Worth the visit.
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Old 08-25-2017, 05:37 PM
 
362 posts, read 1,197,383 times
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While the old service promotion were frequently based on "guts and glory" today's flag officer promotion is based more on politics. Frequently it is who you know or are married (or related) to or your ability to be politically correct and maintain your "image".
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Old 08-25-2017, 07:23 PM
 
Location: New Mexico U.S.A.
22,864 posts, read 34,658,239 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nightnurse613 View Post
While the old service promotion were frequently based on "guts and glory" today's flag officer promotion is based more on politics. Frequently it is who you know or are married (or related) to or your ability to be politically correct and maintain your "image".
In the United States military, all flag and general officers must be nominated by the President and confirmed by the Senate. Each subsequent promotion requires renomination and re-approval. I do not know how long it has been that way...

So, it appears that currently politics has a role in it.
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Old 08-26-2017, 09:12 AM
 
1,303 posts, read 1,843,609 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Poncho_NM View Post
In the United States military, all flag and general officers must be nominated by the President and confirmed by the Senate. Each subsequent promotion requires renomination and re-approval. I do not know how long it has been that way...

So, it appears that currently politics has a role in it.
They actually do that for all Officers. A person's commissioning doc will have the president's signature on it. The senate doesn't usually care and won't have hearings until it's for a high profile position.

The exception is 3 and 4 star picks are nominative and chosen by the president and not a promotion board. This usually means he takes the recommendation from the services chairmen and secretaries and submits it to the senate.

The president does not actually pick the person for promotion below 3 star. That is handled by a service promotion board in much the same way all other officer promotions are done.
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Old 08-26-2017, 02:44 PM
 
Location: New Mexico U.S.A.
22,864 posts, read 34,658,239 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pyramidsurf View Post
They actually do that for all Officers. A person's commissioning doc will have the president's signature on it. The senate doesn't usually care and won't have hearings until it's for a high profile position.

The exception is 3 and 4 star picks are nominative and chosen by the president and not a promotion board. This usually means he takes the recommendation from the services chairmen and secretaries and submits it to the senate.

The president does not actually pick the person for promotion below 3 star. That is handled by a service promotion board in much the same way all other officer promotions are done.
But there are some differences... My Draft notice is also from the President of the United States..

"officers at and below the rank of Captain (Lieutenant in the Navy and Coast Guard) are actually appointed by the Secretary of Defense or, for the Coast Guard, the Secretary of Homeland Security."

Quote:
Commissions of officers in the U.S. Armed Forces are issued in the name of the President, although officers at and below the rank of Captain (Lieutenant in the Navy and Coast Guard) are actually appointed by the Secretary of Defense or, for the Coast Guard, the Secretary of Homeland Security. The commission of a newly commissioned officer would read:

The President of the United States of America

To all who shall see these presents, greeting:
Know Ye that, reposing special trust and confidence in the patriotism, valor, fidelity and abilities of .................., I do appoint ["him" or "her"] a ["Second Lieutenant" or "Ensign"] in the [name of service] to rank as such from the .... day of ........ ...... This Officer will therefore carefully and diligently discharge the duties of the office to which appointed by doing and performing all manner of things thereunto belonging.
And I do strictly charge and require those Officers and other personnel of lesser rank to render such obedience as is due an officer of this grade and position. And this Officer is to observe and follow such orders and directives, from time to time, as may be given by me, or the future President of the United States of America, or other Superior Officers acting in accordance with the laws of the United States of America.
This commission is to continue in force during the pleasure of the President of the United States of America for the time being, under the provisions of those Public Laws relating to Officers of the Armed Forces of the United States of America and the component thereof in which this appointment is made.
Done at the City of Washington, this .... day of ........ in the year of our Lord ................ and of the Independence of the United States of America the ..........
By the President:


Reference: http://military.wikia.com/wiki/Commission_(document)
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Last edited by Poncho_NM; 08-27-2017 at 07:54 AM..
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Old 08-26-2017, 06:06 PM
 
1,303 posts, read 1,843,609 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Poncho_NM View Post
But there are some differences..

"officers at and below the rank of Captain (Lieutenant in the Navy and Coast Guard) are actually appointed by the Secretary of Defense or, for the Coast Guard, the Secretary of Homeland Security."
https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/10/531

Not sure where your source determined that because title 10 is pretty clear. Maybe it's for the reserve component. I can't get your links to open.

Quote:
Original appointments in the grades of second lieutenant, first lieutenant, and captain in the Regular Army, Regular Air Force, and Regular Marine Corps and in the grades of ensign, lieutenant (junior grade), and lieutenant in the Regular Navy shall be made by the President alone
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Old 08-27-2017, 07:58 AM
 
Location: New Mexico U.S.A.
22,864 posts, read 34,658,239 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pyramidsurf View Post
https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/10/531

Not sure where your source determined that because title 10 is pretty clear. Maybe it's for the reserve component. I can't get your links to open.
Repaired.. Windows 10 is giving me heartburn.. URL's do not like parentheses...
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Old 08-31-2017, 10:04 AM
 
Location: Silicon Valley, CA
6,366 posts, read 4,537,143 times
Reputation: 3470
Quote:
Originally Posted by BucFan View Post
Most have to start off by going to one of the Service Academies.

I recently stayed at the Air Force Academy for a week and saw what's required. These cadets are truly among our finest young adults. It really re-energized me as an American as I've been depressed for our country since Friday, 20th January 2017. Very proud to see what the academy is producing. I recommend every American stop by the academy visitor's center if you have just an hour or two and you're passing through Colorado Springs, just south of Denver. Worth the visit.
Today, the service academies don't produce the majority of commissioned officers any more (more of them come out of ROTC programs now), and while it's a good start to a military career, it's not necessarily a sina qua non to eventually becoming a flag officer.
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Old 09-06-2017, 09:18 AM
 
7,134 posts, read 7,422,193 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Debnor View Post
I get that the vast majority are enlisted and stay in either long enough just for benefits and the like, but what kind of people actually manage to do all that's required to become a General/Admiral etc.?
I imagine it starts with education at West Point, the Air Force Academy, or Annapolis and a commission as an officer.

The military has very strict "up or out" policies and the people who rise in rank are probably selected as high achievers early on. I'm sure it helps to have friends in high places. Its probably even more helpful for developing a reputation as someone who can solve problems and lead others. If your entire approach to leadership is to order people around and demand they never question you, you probably aren't going to succeed. The best leaders lead through a combination of skills including charisma, empathizing with others, understanding the limits that people can be pushed too, competence, and showing personal courage. Leaders aren't stagnant. They acquire new skills. They grow in their job. They ask questions. They put in extra hours even when they don't have too. They are ambitious and not looking for a free ride.

I'm sure it helps to be in a field where your skills are needed. After World War II, the military made a transition from being an ultra-large force to being a much smaller force that depended more on sophisticated weapons and technology. Having a degree in a field like engineering would have been an important qualification. The military of the future will require more of the same. Its going to be a place for people at the top of their game.
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