U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Military Life and Issues
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 09-15-2017, 08:31 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles
4,540 posts, read 2,163,821 times
Reputation: 3150

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by loves2read View Post
Love "The Last Detail"!!!

There have been series about non-Seal type military before but that is just what is in the news
They let the news advertise for them with similar subject matter--

You had Jag and you have Mark Harmon's NCIS that is one of the longest running series in tv history now
There was recent show about undercover OP's team and their families--didn't watch it --can't remember the name
There used to be a series about a Marine officer I think--can't remember the name but remember the opening where it showed the marine dress blues with a ceremonial sword...

I think a show about cooks or mechanics would be comedy not drama but doesn't mean it couldn't work
You had MASH which was medical corps and Gomer Pyle about general Marine life
Sgt Bilko was early 50s comedy

Personally I think they are missing a bet not to have a Coast Guard show
Those guys are into rescues, drug busting, modern day pirates....they cover it all and it could go serious one show and comedy the next...
I tend to focus upon the veterans as well as the military shows. And on JAG the law office had two special ops type, the JAG himself was a SEAL and the Gunnery Sergeant office manager was a Force Recon Marine. The other lawyers a female Marine, a submariner and the lead character a fighter pilot.

I think the undercover team you are referencing is The Unit which was suppose to be a Delta team.

The first Marine Officer that I can think of is Major Dad.

Quote:
Originally Posted by foundapeanut View Post
Its about the money - we give the consumers what they want.
But of course the question is why focus on special operators. I propose because in real life roughly from 1971 to 2001 regular forces were not in the type of combat that was pleasing to put in a character bio or even show on screen.

I think I remember a character who was a veteran of the Mayaguez Incident which was used so the actor being to young to be a Vietnam veteran fit better. But giving our coming out of Vietnam it was okay that we lost. You had shows like Magnum PI and even Sgt Major Higgins with his endless stories of the British empire going away. While the Marines in Beruit were peacekeeping and not fighting it did spawn Delta Force and Navy SEAL movies which brings us to Heartbreak Ridge,

Grenada served us one movie more about the old Gunny and by extension that generation of Americans who were what the script called 0-1-1 from 1946 onward. But seeing our Rangers, Marines and Airborne Infantry over running a little island does not seem a sporting background for your hero character. Similarly fighting Dignity Battalions in Panama didn't draw movie interest, although the Major Dad cast were pulled from the School of Infantry to serve on a HQ staff in a Panama like nation, but stayed home at a logistics base during the Gulf War.

The Gulf War itself with the image of Iraqis surrendering to war correspondents gave us Jarhead with Marine Scout Snipers having nothing to do, Three Kings as a Special Forces officer with really nothing to do pulling a gold heist. And Courage Under Fire with the first female Medal Of Honor being the hook gave us those dealing with friendly fire.

So when we had a hero character as a combat vet it was normally as a special operator in a mission that didn't happen publicly. Be it the drug war, the Balkans or anywhere. The most recent regular troops that I can recall were the villain from Justified Boyd Crowder being a combat engineer in the Gulf and Detective Bosch from the Amazon series. In the case of Bosch the character was originally a tunnel rat in Vietnam in the series of novels but found himself in a trench during the 100 hours of the ground war in the Gulf.

After 9/11 veteran characters began to show up again but by then just about all male leads or regulars were Rangers or SEALs. On the guest star level like "Army" on The Shield there was a tendency to have relatively bad guys be Iraq veterans and good guys Afghanistan veterans until we pulled out of Iraq and now as with the Mayaguez incident being used to cast younger actors you almost always see Afghanistan vets in the past 5 years which gives the casting director more options age wise
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 09-16-2017, 09:07 AM
 
373 posts, read 104,828 times
Reputation: 664
I have certainly noticed this also. As a former Army Staff Sergeant who served in "regular" Infantry units, I fully understand the military branches are dominated by the more conventional service person, whether it be a rifleman or mortarman, tank crewmen, member of a signal unit, sailor who mans or maintains a weapons system on a ship, airman in an air wing, etc., etc.

But unless they have well written stories about these people, they aren't shown on screen, with a few exceptions.

Saving Private Ryan was a great example. Although CPT Miller's (Tom Hanks) unit was a ranger unit, that was not emphasized in the movie at all, and the mission they were on to find Ryan, they really fought and maneuvered as any regular Infantry squad would have, and they disembarked on Omaha Beach like any other regular Infantry unit did that day such as the Big Red One, so I have no problem with this movie either way, because the movie was very realistic and very well done.

Speaking of The Big Red One, that is an excellent movie from 1980 with Lee Marvin and a post-Star Wars Mark Hamill (left the light sabre home ), and it was directed by Samuel Fuller, who was a member of the 1st Division in WWII. OP, if you have not seen this movie, do so.

As far as the Spec OPs people, in real life I cannot take anything away from them at all, as I couldn't do what they do and the commitment asked of them is tremendous, so I have no jealousy they get much of the screen and print time in books (there are a lot of them). These shows and movies are what make peoiple go "Ooh" and "Ah" to the unknowing average Joe on the street, but those of us who served in conventional roles in the military know the value of what we do or did, so I put in the box of: "It is what it is". That said, they do seem to be overdoing it.

Some of the movies about Spec Ops folk are rather good, as the recent ones (American Sniper, Zero Dark Thirty, Lone Survivor) are based on fact, although it is widely known Hollywood twists certain facts of any story to make it more appealing.

One of the advantages of being older (59) is I know there are tons of great movies from the post-war period up to about the 1970s (certainly a few after that) that focused on the average conventional military person.

There is an excellent series that was on ABC from 1962-1968 called Combat! that focused on a squad in France after D-Day that so greatly shows what regular Infantry soldiers are about, so I'm good with anything else that comes along. But, I really would like to see a remake of Combat! updated to be about a unit in Iraq or Afghanistan (or both as I understand many units and soldiers made it to both).
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-17-2017, 05:02 PM
 
4,672 posts, read 4,646,501 times
Reputation: 2031
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taiko View Post
What is the definition of a main character just Captain Chandler and lead female? Lt Greene has been there from the beginning when USS Nathan James was under silence and did not know of the global pandemic and Chief Wolf has been there for half of the run of the show normally as the big stick combatant of the Captain's supporting force when Vulture team breaks into two.

Just because the rest of the team didn't go to BUDS is kind of irrelevant, the sailors are in beards and undercover clothes just like all the SEALS in fictional programs and have been trained up by the pre pandemic school trained operators in a world where the schools awarding special operator status likely do not exist because the cadre are all dead.

edit to add:
The "special forces bias" is so bad that when Nathan James entered Norfolk Harbor guess who was standing watch in a guard tower in the harbor? He was identified as a Navy SEAL, no doubt using his special skills standing watch.
Neither the SEAL or the Aussie are the main focal points. I wouldnt say The Last Ship is a show about special forces.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-17-2017, 05:09 PM
 
4,672 posts, read 4,646,501 times
Reputation: 2031
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph_Kirk View Post
Sailors today in similar vessels still do.
I mean regular sailors not just the special forces. Like before JFK created Navy Seals during the invasion and occupation of Veracruz in 1914.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United...on_of_Veracruz

There were marines, but also regular sailors had to ashore and fight.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-17-2017, 05:13 PM
 
4,672 posts, read 4,646,501 times
Reputation: 2031
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taiko View Post
I noticed on the promotion for NBC TV The Brave that their special operations team has a female full-time. Not part time like on Taken, the Liam Neeson movie inspired prequel last year. I am reasonably sure one of the females on SEAL Team on CBS TV will be among the first female SEALS.

As far back as Soldier of Fortune in the 90s with Dennis Rodman fictional special operations teams have had females,. In that case Melinda Clarke was playing a CIA ex agent on the team much like Bridget Reagan on the Last Ship who replaced and Israeli female and was joined by a Kenyan female soldier this season.
Does the CIA actually have people that go into combat missions?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-17-2017, 06:22 PM
 
15,132 posts, read 7,555,780 times
Reputation: 14139
Quote:
Originally Posted by NJ Brazen_3133 View Post
I mean regular sailors not just the special forces. Like before JFK created Navy Seals during the invasion and occupation of Veracruz in 1914.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United...on_of_Veracruz

There were marines, but also regular sailors had to ashore and fight.
The sailors on river boats all through the Vietnam war were not special forces. Nor are the sailors and Marines that are in current Navy riverine units.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-17-2017, 06:25 PM
 
10,270 posts, read 10,142,056 times
Reputation: 13608
Quote:
Originally Posted by NJ Brazen_3133 View Post
Does the CIA actually have people that go into combat missions?
Yes.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-17-2017, 11:46 PM
 
4,672 posts, read 4,646,501 times
Reputation: 2031
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph_Kirk View Post
The sailors on river boats all through the Vietnam war were not special forces. Nor are the sailors and Marines that are in current Navy riverine units.
But do the sailors assigned to the river boats actually have to get off the boats when out on mission, and I mean the regular sailors not the SEALs?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-17-2017, 11:48 PM
 
4,672 posts, read 4,646,501 times
Reputation: 2031
Quote:
Originally Posted by boxus View Post
Yes.
But they did not even go and kill or capture Bin Laden. The CIA had a SEAL team do it for them.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-18-2017, 01:31 AM
 
15,132 posts, read 7,555,780 times
Reputation: 14139
Quote:
Originally Posted by NJ Brazen_3133 View Post
But do the sailors assigned to the river boats actually have to get off the boats when out on mission, and I mean the regular sailors not the SEALs?
What difference does that make? The enemy shoots at them, they shoot back. Sometimes they get killed, sometimes they get captured.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Military Life and Issues

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2017, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32 - Top