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Old 03-07-2018, 04:45 PM
 
Location: Columbia SC
7,986 posts, read 6,739,855 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffdoorgunner View Post
at least in the case of the north Vietnamese... they were willing to sacrifice their entire population.....few societies are willing to do that............
And that is why they won. Granted few are willing to sacrifice that much, but those that are usually win.
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Old 03-07-2018, 09:20 PM
 
Location: Chesapeake Bay
6,044 posts, read 3,642,096 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Babe_Ruth View Post
Not just a superpower, but the superpower.
I'd submit that the British Empire was the most powerful empire in human history. The American Revolution was one of the most significant military upsets/evictions (my opinion)..

I also think Washington is one of the underappreciated revolutionaries of human history. His legacy (as a success) seems to be taken for granted, but he really was leading a David against a Goliath.
Peace.
Washington bet everything that he had, including his life, that he could beat the British.
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Old 08-18-2018, 08:18 AM
 
1,614 posts, read 598,538 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldsoldier1976 View Post
Actually much of the leadership in the Continental army were former officers in the British army. Even a number of the non-com were soldiers for a time as well. We were not the backwoods huckleberries your thinking.
Many of the militia units...such as the Minutemen...were also very well trained.Gage was actually very reluctant to take them on but was pushed into doing so by London.
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Old 08-18-2018, 09:24 AM
 
Location: Great Britain
8,670 posts, read 2,930,592 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slackercruster View Post
No cars, no communications other than Paul Revere. Just a bunch of patriots and their squirrel guns. Unbelievable that we beat a super power like England in our backwards state of being.
LOL - Britain was a Naval Power, and traditionally kept a much larger navy but a much smaller army than it's European rivals, indeed at the time Britain relied on German Hessian mercenaries, who formed a third of British forces in the US. Britain was also fighting over 4,000 miles from home at a time of sailing ships.

The time when the British army was really stretched - BBC News

The British Empire was basically started by trading companies, who made the local leaders such as the Maharajah's (meaning "great ruler", "great king" or "high king)
in India very wealthy through trade. The Maharajah's rulked over different regions and provinces but had their own armies who kept order, and they were more trhan happy with the money generated via trade with the British Empire. Britain tried to emulate this type of relationship wherever possible. Whilst a strong Royal Navy protected the vast sea trade which generated through Empire and which saw London (the largest port in the world at one time) and other British ports massively expand.

The truth being that the British were not really that unfair when it came to the American colonies where standards of living where higher than in Britain and taxes were very low. There was even sympathy by a group of MP's who wanted representation for the states in the British Parliament. It was the landed gentry who didn't want reform at home that overruled the democratic wing of parliament and denied representation. It should also be noted that only the wealthy land owners had the vote at the time in Britain.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PBS

In drawing attention to the role of representation as a spark for revolution, they note that the average British citizen who resided in Britain paid 26 shillings per year in taxes compared to only 1 shilling per year in New England, even though the living standard of the colonists was arguably higher than that of the British.

There were proposals to settle the colonial crisis peacefully, most notably by Thomas Pownall and Adam Smith. Smith, for example, proposed “a system in which the political representation of Great Britain and America would be proportional to the contribution that each polity was making to the public treasury of the empire.

What we get wrong about taxes and the American Revolution | PBS

As for the Ulster Scots or Scotch Irish -

Quote:

Scotch-Irish says Leyburn, "is an Americanism, generally unknown in Scotland and Ireland, and rarely used by British historians."

It is "The more usual term in North America" says the Oxford English Dictionary, which gives it a score of 3/8 in terms of current usage. It became common in the United States after 1850.

The term is somewhat ambiguous because some of the Scotch-Irish have little or no Scottish ancestry at all: numerous dissenter families had also been transplanted to Ulster from northern England, in particular the border counties of Northumberland and Cumberland.

Smaller numbers of migrants also came from Wales and the southeast of England, and others were Protestant religious refugees from Flanders, the German Palatinate, and France (such as the French Huguenot ancestors of Davy Crockett).

What united these different national groups was a base of Calvinist religious beliefs, and their separation from the established church (the Church of England and Church of Ireland in this case).

That said, the large ethnic Scottish element in the Plantation of Ulster gave the settlements a Scottish character.

Upon arrival in North America, these migrants at first usually identified simply as Irish, without the qualifier Scotch.

It was not until a century later, following the surge in Irish immigration after the Great Irish Famine of the 1840s, that the descendants of the earlier arrivals began to commonly call themselves Scotch-Irish to distinguish themselves from the newer, predominantly Catholic and poor immigrants; these largely had no Scottish ancestry.

Scotch-Irish Americans Terminology - Wikipedia

Last edited by Brave New World; 08-18-2018 at 10:00 AM..
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Old 08-18-2018, 11:53 AM
 
11,685 posts, read 13,110,015 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slackercruster View Post
No cars, no communications other than Paul Revere. Just a bunch of patriots and their squirrel guns. Unbelievable that we beat a super power like England in our backwards state of being.

Washington was a cautious military leader for one thing, he did not throw his resources into showpiece big battles that he did not feel sure of winning and weren't going to gain something concrete. A number of good books out there emphasize that his military greatness was in being choosy about engaging the enemy.
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Old 08-18-2018, 12:38 PM
 
644 posts, read 143,567 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johngolf View Post
And that is why they won. Granted few are willing to sacrifice that much, but those that are usually win.
The more modern we get with communication, the less likely the United States could ever persevere and win WWII.

During WWII, no home TV to watch every night coverage of the daily battles and death tolls.

Compare the coverage of WWII to Vietnam and I doubt the United States people would have wanted WWII to continue until the end.

At some point they would have been clamoring for an " armistice/agreement" part way thru well short of a complete victory.
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Old 08-18-2018, 12:56 PM
 
349 posts, read 217,952 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slackercruster View Post
No cars, no communications other than Paul Revere. Just a bunch of patriots and their squirrel guns. Unbelievable that we beat a super power like England in our backwards state of being.
Given the technology of the time there was very little difference between a "military superpower" and a bunch of Joe Averages with muskets.

And we didn't beat them. We did an excellent job of thrust and parry keeping us from getting pinned to the map for a 3-count, but we didn't beat them. There was still an England with everything it was and always had been and implied. We managed to keep the ball in play long enough for outside events to assert themselves in such a manner as they worked to the Colony's's favor.
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Old 08-18-2018, 02:29 PM
 
Location: Honolulu, HI
4,644 posts, read 1,161,790 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joe from dayton View Post
If you think the war was fought by a bunch of patriots with squirrel guns, you have a profound lack of understanding of the soldiers, equipment and drill of the Continental army, nor do you understand the strategy of the British Army, or the significant monetary and military assistance provided by the French army and navy, etc., etc. It is not hard to educate yourself on a topic on which so much has been written.
Bingo and thank you.

"Patriots and squirrel guns?" Did the OP bother doing proper research on the assistance from France and alliances with other countries we had?

This wasn't some drunken backwards militiamen randomly fighting.
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Old 08-18-2018, 06:30 PM
 
Location: The Triad (NC)
26,894 posts, read 58,020,547 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocko20 View Post
This wasn't some drunken backwards militiamen randomly fighting.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9owHQ96Nms4
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Old 08-19-2018, 04:52 AM
 
11,685 posts, read 13,110,015 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocko20 View Post
Bingo and thank you.

"Patriots and squirrel guns?" Did the OP bother doing proper research on the assistance from France and alliances with other countries we had?

This wasn't some drunken backwards militiamen randomly fighting.
More true than not, but if you read what Washington wrote, he lamented over and over again that his militiamen - so many of whom were farmers - would leave suddenly to harvest their crops back home, even when their term of service was not over. (One can hardly blame them.) And this situation moved America toward the idea of a standing army - it is hard to see the Revolution being won with a force that was come-go-come-go. It would have been reduced to a guerilla movement.

The role of foreigner such as Pulaski and Lafayette, etc. is fascinating. I only began reading much about them late in life, long after formal schooling.
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