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Old 08-09-2018, 09:42 AM
 
88 posts, read 123,397 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drinkthekoolaid View Post
It depends what your job field is.

Infantry, special forces, calvary, military police etc have a much higher and more likely chance of "going house to house"
I served as an infantryman with the 1st Air CAVALRY.

This is a common mistake.
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Old 08-09-2018, 10:37 AM
Status: "Living the good retired life." (set 18 days ago)
 
Location: Wasilla, AK
5,818 posts, read 3,106,453 times
Reputation: 11749
Quote:
Originally Posted by drinkthekoolaid View Post
It depends what your job field is.

Infantry, special forces, calvary, military police etc have a much higher and more likely chance of "going house to house"

Any military member can find themselves in the front lines.

I don't think too many chaplains find themselves going door to door in the sandbox. Not even the Mormons.
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Old 08-09-2018, 11:08 AM
 
17,840 posts, read 9,784,518 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlaskaErik View Post
I don't think too many chaplains find themselves going door to door in the sandbox. Not even the Mormons.
I think the 1st Air Calvary were airdropped chaplains.
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Old 08-09-2018, 12:57 PM
 
Location: Forests of Maine
29,682 posts, read 47,391,075 times
Reputation: 17490
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph_Kirk View Post
The draft was primarily for infantrymen. If you wanted to avoid being drafted as infantry, you joined for the field you wanted. But if you played the odds and lost, you were primarily going into the infantry.

Now there is the DoD "Fairy godmother" department in the basement of the Pentagon staffed by a crew of six elderly GS-5 women all nearing retirement. Every now and then, one of them wakes up and smacks the top paper on her desk with her magic wand, then falls back to sleep. But that's not something anyone can count on.
I reported to my first sub in '78 after I completed 2 years of training. Before I reported onboard the crew had been nearly exclusively guys who had tried to avoid the draft.

The common theme among the submarine fleet was during the draft lottery, if you got a low number, you would run to college. To get the college deferment, hoping college would outlast the draft. Four years later when you graduated from college, the draft was still on-going and you still had a low number. At that point you knew a letter from the draft board would be arriving within a few weeks, so you would run to a recruiter and volunteer for sub-duty.

A 6-year enlistment on subs was viewed as 'better' then being drafted into the infantry. It certainly paid much better.

I was among the first 'wave' of enlistees to report to subs who did not already have a college degree.

I had to listen to my chief many times ranting about the low quality of sailors coming out of boot camp because we were lacking degrees.

Even though the draft had ended, they were still on the hook to finish their 6-year contracts.
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Old 08-09-2018, 01:28 PM
 
Location: Eastern Washington
13,357 posts, read 42,602,266 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Submariner View Post
I reported to my first sub in '78 after I completed 2 years of training. Before I reported onboard the crew had been nearly exclusively guys who had tried to avoid the draft.

The common theme among the submarine fleet was during the draft lottery, if you got a low number, you would run to college. To get the college deferment, hoping college would outlast the draft. Four years later when you graduated from college, the draft was still on-going and you still had a low number. At that point you knew a letter from the draft board would be arriving within a few weeks, so you would run to a recruiter and volunteer for sub-duty.

A 6-year enlistment on subs was viewed as 'better' then being drafted into the infantry. It certainly paid much better.

I was among the first 'wave' of enlistees to report to subs who did not already have a college degree.

I had to listen to my chief many times ranting about the low quality of sailors coming out of boot camp because we were lacking degrees.

Even though the draft had ended, they were still on the hook to finish their 6-year contracts.

Still, serving out a 6-year stint on a nuclear sub, at the time, meant you could hire on at your choice of civil nuclear power plants across the country. Particularly guys who qualified ELT (Engineering Lab Technician). If you were ELT and EWS or EOOW qualified, the civilian plants would be all over you like the ugly on an ape, soon as you got out. The nuke biz is not what it was in the early 80's, but it still has some good jobs.



Or, having done 6, they could do like you did, and finish out 20, retire with a decent pension at around 40 years old, at which time they could head for the woods like you did, or they could start a civilian career, in nuke, in other power generation, other processes like oil refining, or just go sell life insurance for that matter.



A smart but broke kid, willing to work for it, could break the cycle of poverty by enlisting and going nuke. Of course a damn good ASVAB is necessary, the nuclear navy does not take in dummies, and the few dummies who make it in, don't last long. As a result of Rickover's obsession with safety and with good radiological control, a kid from the wrong side of town was way safer on that sub, than he was at home in bed.


And while I have been talking subs here, the nuclear surface fleet, (all aircraft carriers now) has the same career benefits, without having to spend a lot of time underwater. I do have some reservations about sub service, they for example keep the oxygen concentration lower than natural air, for fire suppression purposes. When I was at prototype, I could just look at the sea returnees and tell you who served on subs. They looked like they had been artificially aged. I can tell you that even on the big "boomers", there simply is not enough room for an "ideal" crew, so you are always working overtime, there simply ain't enough bodies for everyone to get enough rest.


All that said, though, the sub guys have a fraternal bond amongst them, that the surface guys can't match.


You pays your money, and you takes your choice.

Last edited by M3 Mitch; 08-09-2018 at 01:39 PM.. Reason: Add about surface nuke
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Old 08-09-2018, 02:59 PM
 
8,505 posts, read 2,366,491 times
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Various criteria....

1. Strength and health and fitness in particular ways.....
2. The desire to do so (many people want to be infantry)= may have the "risk" gene, etc.
3. Youth and Gender
4. Scoring low on tests that qualify you for higher-end specialties not on the front line (intelligence, logistics, etc.)
5. Marksmanship
6. Etc.......

Of course, the NCOs and Officers who lead these groups are somewhat different....especially the officers. NCOs may or may not be lifted up out of the general grunt force. Those who want to stay around awhile and show leadership qualities probably rise up the NCO chain.
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Old 08-09-2018, 03:14 PM
 
Location: Honolulu, HI
4,488 posts, read 1,111,064 times
Reputation: 6436
Quote:
Originally Posted by hawk55732 View Post
It is closer to 25% qualify.
Yes, but only of 1% of that 25% wants to join. And then they have to worry about retention, so it's a bit of a balancing act. Strict standards but not too strict. They're actually loosening up alot of Air Force regulations recently with hair, earrings clothing, etc. Men can wearing earrings in civilian clothing on base now, that used to be banned.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ddm2k View Post
Well they haven't drafted since Vietnam, so I wouldn't call the volunteer service and its decidedly picky entrance requirements a failure for addressing staffing needs.
I don't know what this means.
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Old 08-09-2018, 04:37 PM
 
17,840 posts, read 9,784,518 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocko20 View Post
Yes, but only of 1% of that 25% wants to join.
The figure as I understand it, is that only 25% of those who attempt to join are determined to be acceptable.

That's really the only figure the military would be able provide with authority--stats on the people they actually researched enough to determine their acceptability.
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Old 08-09-2018, 08:30 PM
 
Location: Elysium
5,778 posts, read 3,066,959 times
Reputation: 4016
Quote:
Originally Posted by craigiri View Post
Various criteria....

1. Strength and health and fitness in particular ways.....
2. The desire to do so (many people want to be infantry)= may have the "risk" gene, etc.
3. Youth and Gender
4. Scoring low on tests that qualify you for higher-end specialties not on the front line (intelligence, logistics, etc.)
5. Marksmanship
6. Etc.......

Of course, the NCOs and Officers who lead these groups are somewhat different....especially the officers. NCOs may or may not be lifted up out of the general grunt force. Those who want to stay around awhile and show leadership qualities probably rise up the NCO chain.
It would be really odd for a NCO to be in a different branch than he was a junior enlisted soldier. I guess a few of the Special Forces who did not come from Infantry meet that definition.

For officers, 30 years ago 15 years after the draft ended in the US. The Officer Corp was about 20% female and by law they were excluded from combat arms. So the male reserve officer coming out of a ROTC program had that stagger to overcome as females got first shot at the non combat branches. Regular Officers were different in that they were able to choose by class rank at West Point/being an honor graduate from a ROTC scholarship. Like the USAF had a so called Fighter mafia, in the Army you had the Airborne Mafia and getting to Airborne/Ranger and Special Forces as a Captain back then a Major now meant they tried to get Infantry on their race to General's stars.

However the Army was re-configuring from fighting in Vietnam to taking on the Soviets on the German plains in tanks so many of those Infantry Officers found themselves leading tank platoons. So a Reserve Lieutenant spent his time in combat arms and many tired to get into the branch with more immediate crossover to civilian careers if they made it to Field Grade status.

Last edited by Taiko; 08-09-2018 at 08:39 PM..
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Old 08-09-2018, 08:56 PM
 
Location: New Mexico U.S.A.
24,085 posts, read 38,758,901 times
Reputation: 28054
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ralph_Kirk View Post
Are you saying that the preponderance of draftees did not go into the infantry?
From: Vietnam War Facts, Stats and Myths

Quote:
Myth: Common belief is that most Vietnam veterans were drafted.

Fact: 2/3 of the men who served in Vietnam were volunteers. 2/3 of the men who served in World War II were drafted. Approximately 70% of those killed in Vietnam were volunteers.
But I could not find anything reliable about draftees and the infantry
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