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Old Yesterday, 12:09 PM
 
16,841 posts, read 14,629,184 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Poncho_NM View Post
Not true. I had "flat feet" when I was drafted...

Here is what the Mayo clinic says:

https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-...s/syc-20372604



Actually my flat feet do not bother me much if I wear Combat Boots (or other supportive footwear)... Sandals, Flip-Flops, Moccasins, bear feet etc are very painful...
Youíre going to say not true to something that actually happened in my family member?? It was during the Vietnam war maybe their standards are different than I do not know. All I know is he didnít have to go into the draft because he had flat feet and cataracts that did not affect his vision at all (and still hasnít now in his 60ís).

The point was, the military is not like an outside employer who will make accommodations to have people with handicaps be able to serve. The poster said it shouldnít be a problem to find a place for a deaf person but that it would just take a lot of ďplanningĒ and ď a whole new way of introducing him to the unitĒ. The military doesnít work like that, they arenít going to do all that so that anyone who wants to serve can. Itís like joining the police, FBI, Fire Department, you have to meet the physical standards
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Old Yesterday, 12:18 PM
 
Location: North Beach, MD on the Chesapeake
31,847 posts, read 38,848,311 times
Reputation: 40267
Quote:
Originally Posted by ocnjgirl View Post
Youíre going to say not true to something that actually happened in my family member?? It was during the Vietnam war maybe their standards are different than I do not know. All I know is he didnít have to go into the draft because he had flat feet and cataracts that did not affect his vision at all (and still hasnít now in his 60ís).

The point was, the military is not like an outside employer who will make accommodations to have people with handicaps be able to serve. The poster said it shouldnít be a problem to find a place for a deaf person but that it would just take a lot of ďplanningĒ and ď a whole new way of introducing him to the unitĒ. The military doesnít work like that, they arenít going to do all that so that anyone who wants to serve can. Itís like joining the police, FBI, Fire Department, you have to meet the physical standards
During periods of high draft needs (or today when recruiting numbers are down) standards tended to slip. My guess, and that's all it is, was that the cataracts played more of a part of the NPQ than the flat feet.
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Old Yesterday, 12:44 PM
 
5,026 posts, read 2,936,598 times
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I worked for the Army during the Vietnam War. We had a couple of guys in the office too lazy to pick up a gun if they were being shot at and too dumb to know which end to point at the enemy so I guess that's true. LOL
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Old Yesterday, 01:22 PM
 
16,841 posts, read 14,629,184 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by North Beach Person View Post
During periods of high draft needs (or today when recruiting numbers are down) standards tended to slip. My guess, and that's all it is, was that the cataracts played more of a part of the NPQ than the flat feet.
Again, my point was they do not go out of their way to accommodate disabilities as schools and private employers do, that in fact you can be denied even for physical issues that are comparatively small.
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Old Yesterday, 03:27 PM
 
8,286 posts, read 7,288,502 times
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In civilian life, there are many jobs that do not hire deaf people. There are jobs that do not hire people who cannot stand up and work, or have other types of physical ailments. They don't hire people in wheel chairs to be firemen as an example. Nor are people that look great, but cannot lift a certain amount of weight hired as firemen. There are many jobs, that require certain physical ability to be hired for the job.

Every person in the military service, must be able to be assigned duties, and must be able to have a physical condition they can do the job they are assigned to, without having to make allowances limiting them to jobs that they physically can handle, or only jobs that do not requiring them to have normal hearing, etc.

Every person has to be able to hear warnings and instructions in time of combat conditions. An office clerk which often could be handled by a deaf person, cannot suddenly be thrust into battle conditions where they need to be able to receive verbal commands and warnings. They would not be able to hear dangerous situations around them, and be able to stay alive in many situations.

The military has a lot of people in nice cushy jobs in offices in this country. However those same people at the end of 1 to 2 years, will rotate to battle conditions in other parts of the world. USA Shore duty as the calls it, is where people from hazardous duty, are rotated to, and will after a time be back into hazardous duty. A deaf person is not qualified to do the hazardous duty rotation, and is ineligible to serve in the service.

I went to the Navy the day my draft notice came in the mailbox. I never went overseas. I spent a year in boot camp then two special schools. I was assigned to a naval air transport squadron in California, then transferred to a higher job with a squadron in Hawaii. Then a few months later, transferred back to my old California squadron to be in full charge of an air terminal handling all cargo and passengers going overseas. None of those jobs, could have been handled by some one that was deaf. Example one night we got a call about a large seaplane that had landed in San Francisco bay, and the waves were so high, it flooded out the engines. We had to take two 16 foot open boats and go out there in a heavy rain with those high waves, find the plane, and get lines tied to it, for one boat in front and one in back and tow it in where we could pull it out of the water with Caterpillar Crawler Tractors. The 4 ranking people including myself, went out to get the plane. We found it, and to hook on to the tail end hook, I had to drive the boat up to where the Chief (highest enlisted rate) could grab the hook with one hand and be lifted up 16 feet or so in the air, while connecting the line to the tail hook, and have that boat in the high waves when the plane came back down again could step into the boat. We got the seaplane in, and hooked into the take out lines. I parked the boat and the Chief took over commanding the crew, and I took the Cat that was on the upwind side, and another of the 4 of us took the other cat, and another took the cat that was the puller on the front, and we pulled that flying boat out of the water. Very dangerous duty all the way around, and a deaf person could not have been able to do the job of any of the 4 of us. We had to be able to hear, and to communicate with the other 3, plus when pulling the flying boat out of the water with 15 other people.

This was the most dangerous job I ever did in the navy, not been in combat, but one I will never forget. Even the people with plush jobs in the Military as I had, some times will have very dangerous jobs to do, and have to have good hearing and ability to speak.

This is why if someone loses their hearing while in the Military, they will be discharged for medical reasons. It is not just for their own safety, but for the good of the people they are serving with.

It is not like private life, where you can have special accommodations made for you. You have to be able to serve and do your job, no matter where you are assigned, and what ever conditions come up.
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Old Yesterday, 03:38 PM
 
Location: Madison, Alabama
1,881 posts, read 847,202 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JBAinTexas View Post
I tried enlisting after I graduated high school. All of the recruiters said I will not be able to serve due to my deafness.

I read about deaf people in the Israeli military, and there are deaf people in the ROTC programs. I was in the JROTC all four years of my high school.

I am wondering what are your opinions regarding deaf people in the military. Will it happen someday? Would you feel comfortable with deaf people serving? Opinions are welcome. I will not be offended if some of you say you won't feel comfortable. Provide reasons why you believe deaf people should or should not serve, and also reasons why you think it may or may not happen with deaf people serving.
There are lots of things you could do in the military where hearing impairment wouldn't be any worse than it would with any other employer. There are many military jobs that are no different from the civilian counterparts. The problem is, you always have the risk of being sent into "jobs" (meaning, the battlefield or similar) where it would be a true impediment. If you could be guaranteed that you'd do things where deafness wouldn't matter, it would be fine. But I don't know if the military will do that or not.
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Old Yesterday, 05:20 PM
 
Location: New Mexico U.S.A.
24,009 posts, read 38,593,103 times
Reputation: 27966
Quote:
Originally Posted by ocnjgirl View Post
You’re going to say not true to something that actually happened in my family member??
No.

No, I did say anything about your family.

And the topic of this thread is Do you think deafness in the U.S. Armed Forces will be accepted ever?
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Old Yesterday, 07:48 PM
 
Location: U.S.A., Earth
4,317 posts, read 2,580,151 times
Reputation: 3794
Quote:
Originally Posted by ocnjgirl View Post
And the military is not like the outside world. They wonít even take someone with flat feet, where that isnít considered a handicap at all. My brother was kept out of the draft because of cataracts, but heís never had a problem with his vision at all. They arenít an employer who will make accommodations, because itís not about allowing people to fill their dream, itís about as the poster said, having warriors at the ready. I donít even know if there are deaf cops, are there?
Amongst other factors for rejection... color blindness, being above a certain age (IIRC, 38 for some branches), being obese... heck, one person said he got kicked out b/c he could no longer do sit ups after an injury.
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Old Yesterday, 08:03 PM
 
Location: TX and NM on the border of the Great Southwest.
11,704 posts, read 15,699,483 times
Reputation: 22183
Quote:
Originally Posted by JBAinTexas View Post
I tried enlisting after I graduated high school. All of the recruiters said I will not be able to serve due to my deafness.
I had heard that some degrees of color blindness will also exclude you from aircraft mechanical work at least in the Air Force. I think this is due to the color-coding of electrical, fuel, hydraulic and pneumatic lines.

I served in the Air Force as a fighter jet crew chief from 1968 to 1972. For your obvious desire to serve, I would have been honored to have had you working alongside me. Best of luck.
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Old Yesterday, 09:11 PM
 
12,402 posts, read 11,949,637 times
Reputation: 16940
It changes like the wind, but people that are color blind can go into the military, they are just restricted from certain jobs.
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