Should gangbangers be pushed toward military? (recruit, service, good, jail)

[Venom]

You can't kill here, but you can kill elsewhere.

Very hypocritical.

[Gerania]

Originally Posted by Venom

You can't kill here, but you can kill elsewhere.

Very hypocritical.

and who would you want watching your back?

[Boompa]

Originally Posted by Gerania

and who would you want watching your back?

Someone who is depending on me watching theirs. I grew up in North Philly, where Edison High took the heaviest casualties of any High Scool in the country in Vietnam. The Army got me out of North Philly and made me what I am. I would sooner be in combat with some inner city toughs than some son's of priviledge who think my life isn't as worthy as theirs.

I believe, given the economy, everyone who passes the test and wants to go, should be enlisted. The Army be enlarged and troops deployed to the border.

[marmac]

-----should gangbangers be pushed towards military---

in an all volunteer military, no one should be ---"pushed"

( especially not by giving gangbangers an ultimatum.)

[elamigo]

Originally Posted by d-iron

At least they would be doing something more positive.

I enlisted in '78 when many of my peers at the time said they were told by the judge "you have a choice, jail or join the Army". There still many great Sergeants Major that joined under those circumstances. They admit the Army was the best thing that happened in their lives.

Now, my generation in many ways is different than today's generation for it to apply the same way. Many of those in my generation were simply lost souls out there with no direction. It is my impression that many young man and women today simply are malicious and have no respect for life and norms whatsoever. They have no moral compass at all. This generation is very narcissistic and that is a problem.

In my generation many of us misbehaved and even had an encounter with the law here and then but we still a higher sense of respect to certain norms and we would not cross the line, not so in today's society as far as I am concerned.

I still believe that there are many young men and women that despite the life they are living do have a good chance in life when they join the Army.

I think we as a society have gone at least somewhat too far on the extreme with zero tolerance with people that have misbehaved in life.

I am involved with some community activities wherever I have been. In yesteryears young men and women misbehaved but once they reached legal adulthood, pretty much they had a fresh start in life. Not so in many areas. When I was 16 I went to the Job Corps. The Job Corps was created by Kennedy to give a chance to young men and women to get a trade. Most were high school drop outs. I live among many that were really hardened criminals. However, some took advantage of the program, others did not and got kicked out. Not long ago I went to a Job Corps recruiting brief and theynow have this zero mentality in recruiting and do extensive background checks. I have no problem with that but their criteria has changed so much now. The original intent of the program has shifted to block many kids that do need a program like the Job Corps to have a better chance in life.

It is not only the Job Corps though. Many people do not realize that by totally closing the door on many of these people we simply will perpetuate crime in their ranks because they do not see any escape door towards a better life with hope in the future. In today's Army standards of recruiting I would not be allowed to enlist.

You have a great day.
El Amigo

[d-iron]

Originally Posted by Venom

You can't kill here, but you can kill elsewhere.

Very hypocritical.

I don't know about you but I would kill for America. Especially against those wacko nations like China/Russia/Iran. I mean who in their right mind would want to live under those crazy regimes???

[OC Investor2]

Originally Posted by Boompa

Having left North Philly a month after I turned 17 for the Army, I believe it is a great idea. I retired from the Army.

Boompa -
Thank you for your service.

I to would agree that it is possible for the military to provide a vehicle for someone who's had scrapes with the law to straighten out and lead an admirable life.

Just as an aside - I almost got written up when I got into it with a BN XO over one of my soldiers who was gettting mustered out for an undisclosed drug issue his recruitter had swept under the rug. This SPC had turned into an excellent soldier, was on the verge of becoming an NCO and considering a career in the Army. Our team SSG had taken him under his wing and really gotten him pointed in the right direction. Probably the finest examples I ever saw of NCO mentorship. When the Army decided to push this kid overboard I was furious. Of all the dumb decisions I saw in my few years in the army, this was probably the dumbest. So I really believe in the redemptive power of the service.

Having said that, Gangbangers are different. Some, maybe even many, don't cut their ties back to the gang. They may have siblings - heck, even parents - who are in the gang. Gang's get ther hooks in these kids and they are in alot deeper then some troubled kid who makes a few dumb decisions. They are a different breed of trouble. That's why I believe they are unsuited for military service.

[EarthBound?]

Originally Posted by d-iron

I don't know about you but I would kill for America. Especially against those wacko nations like China/Russia/Iran. I mean who in their right mind would want to live under those crazy regimes???

They would and they've been doing it for over a thousand years and more. Thats all they know and all that they have know.

But as for the question at hand. Yes, its good idea, most of these kids (but not all) are looking for somekind of structure and purposoe in their lives. WWII, Korea and Vietnam all had some men that were given the choice, Militery or prison. And I'm sure that there are alot of them here today (alive) because the service helped them to change their lives around.

[texdav]

No I saw the results of taking people not suited to live with in the 60's, It caused alot of problems . I would thnik that no military wants societies problems th=rust on them. It might help a few but many would not change from what I saw.I guess no one remmebre the green line in vitnam or the drug scandal on militray palnes in vietnam. Beleieve mne there were alot of problems v=created by the change in drafting people with problems. AT one their was a frist offenders rpogram for minor offenses but minor was like stealing hub caps ;nothing like what many have as a juvenile record alone.

[allgoodnamestaken]

Yeah, that's exactly what we need: give gang members free training in latest weaponry and combat techniques... More "happy" ideas, anyone?

Originally Posted by texdav

No I saw the results of taking people not suited to live with in the 60's, It caused alot of problems . I would thnik that no military wants societies problems th=rust on them. It might help a few but many would not change from what I saw.I guess no one remmebre the green line in vitnam or the drug scandal on militray palnes in vietnam. Beleieve mne there were alot of problems v=created by the change in drafting people with problems. AT one their was a frist offenders rpogram for minor offenses but minor was like stealing hub caps ;nothing like what many have as a juvenile record alone.