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Old 11-27-2009, 07:28 AM
 
Location: Corydon, IN
3,413 posts, read 3,702,052 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by macjr82 View Post
This thread is about the Military, and it seems that most of the members experience seems to go down the path of it being falsified more than it being actual rapes.

Skippy!

I know that during 22 years of service, nearly 13 active, the rest NG, across two services (Army and Air Force), I've seen numerous males accused because of Regret Syndrome. I've seen the cases investigated and I've seen some guys win, some guys lose.

One of the most heinous I ever saw was two guys, picked up by the same woman separately at the NCO club on the SAME night, and when someone called the woman on her activity she cried not one but TWO rapes on the same night.

Both men spent their investigation in jail; she worked in the Chief's office. The men ultimately lost their clearances just through being investigated on this and lacking sufficient evidence for an outright conviction. They were moved to other jobs not requiring security clearances.

She re-obtained hers after some time had passed.

She was later busted by her husband for infidelity when he came home and caught her with two airmen, this time losing her clearance and being kicked out.

Real rapes happen and it's a crying shame; I'm of the opinion rapists who are convicted should be dealt with harshly.

But I think any woman who is found to falsely accuse should face penalties just as harsh as those her victims would have faced. It takes a special kind of criminal to commit rape.

It takes a special kind of criminal to actively and callously ruin innocent lives.
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Old 11-27-2009, 09:17 AM
 
6,349 posts, read 17,895,901 times
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I'm with ya, Urban Sasquatch! I think anyone who levels false accusations should be given tha SAME punishment that the accused would've received had they been convicted. That would stop a LOT of false accusations...
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Old 11-27-2009, 10:05 AM
 
Location: Forests of Maine
27,619 posts, read 43,342,914 times
Reputation: 14408
Quote:
Originally Posted by Glitterific View Post
... Maybe if you volunteered or even spoke to anyone who works at your local womens crisis center- your views on this topic would be a bit different.
I honestly do not recall ever seeing a 'Womans Crisis Center' on any base where I have been stationed.

I did once volunteer to help a civilian Womans Center. They were moving office spaces from one building to another, so a bunch of us MPs went in to move funriture and boxes. They had to previously vacate all of the women so they would not be exposed to our cooties as we moved their stuff.

Has anyone seen a 'Womans Center' on any base?
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Old 11-27-2009, 10:10 AM
 
Location: Forests of Maine
27,619 posts, read 43,342,914 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Urban Sasquatch View Post
... Both men spent their investigation in jail; she worked in the Chief's office. The men ultimately lost their clearances just through being investigated on this and lacking sufficient evidence for an outright conviction. They were moved to other jobs not requiring security clearances.
I would expect that if you came back to these men a year later, they would have both been scapegoated out for some other charges.



Quote:
... She re-obtained hers after some time had passed.
I have seen ladies put in for OCS programs during this period of time.



Quote:
... She was later busted by her husband for infidelity when he came home and caught her with two airmen, this time losing her clearance and being kicked out.
That is un-usual.



Quote:
... Real rapes happen and it's a crying shame; I'm of the opinion rapists who are convicted should be dealt with harshly.

But I think any woman who is found to falsely accuse should face penalties just as harsh as those her victims would have faced. It takes a special kind of criminal to commit rape.

It takes a special kind of criminal to actively and callously ruin innocent lives.
I agree.
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Old 11-27-2009, 10:22 AM
 
3,069 posts, read 7,028,132 times
Reputation: 2042
In the Marine Corps we have Uniformed Victim Advocates assigned every unit. It is actually a collateral duty of the one appointed.


MCB Quantico - SAPR - Role of the Uniformed Victim Advocate
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Old 11-27-2009, 11:17 AM
 
3,422 posts, read 8,880,543 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by forest beekeeper View Post
Has anyone seen a 'Womans Center' on any base?
Quote:
Originally Posted by macjr82 View Post
In the Marine Corps we have Uniformed Victim Advocates assigned every unit. It is actually a collateral duty of the one appointed.


MCB Quantico - SAPR - Role of the Uniformed Victim Advocate

Speaking as a woman who uses the restrooms on base, every stall I have been in has a flyer up in it detailing the reporting methods for sexual assault (there are two different paths to take). There is a confidential person assigned that answers a cell phone number that is designated for reporting, and they respond to the assault victim to get the report started and direct them to the hospital, etc... My sil at one time had the duty to answer that phone number.

I don't think there is a center per se, but there is a system in place.

Forest, what I think you were at might have been a battered womens shelter. I donated a crib and baby supplies to a battered women and childrens shelter once and they met me in a public parking lot to pick up the items b/c the location of the shelter was private to keep the estranged husbands/boyfriends from tracking the families/women down and beating them or worse. Its not that you were male, I think.
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Old 11-27-2009, 01:55 PM
 
Location: middle of everywhere
1,786 posts, read 3,442,582 times
Reputation: 1601
Quote:
Originally Posted by forest beekeeper View Post
I honestly do not recall ever seeing a 'Womans Crisis Center' on any base where I have been stationed.

I did once volunteer to help a civilian Womans Center. They were moving office spaces from one building to another, so a bunch of us MPs went in to move funriture and boxes. They had to previously vacate all of the women so they would not be exposed to our cooties as we moved their stuff.

Has anyone seen a 'Womans Center' on any base?
When I wrote local, I meant as in the surrounding town/city. Even if there were crisis centers on base, some victims wouldn't feel comfortable speaking to someone in uniform, especially if their attacker also wears one. A form of PTSD, if you will.

I've worked in an MP unit, so I know a little about some of the more unfortunate crimes that aren't heard about outside of a unit.
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Old 11-27-2009, 02:04 PM
 
Location: middle of everywhere
1,786 posts, read 3,442,582 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Crew Chief View Post
Glitterific, anyone who faces a false rape charge or is accused of rape after the woman changes her mind is just as much a victim as a woman who is actually raped. I certainly don't mean to lessen the horor of a real rape. But there are both male and female victims when it comes to sexual crimes, whether it actually involves the act of rape or not.
I agree with you and Macjr82. I do acknowledge the fact that being a male rape victim can be even more damaging than a female. It must feel hopeless to experience that and have absolutely no where to turn without being ostracized.

Even with female crisis networks in place, some women still don't report their rapes. That is why I bristle when people proclaim that it doesn't happen, or only in the civilian sector, or she was drunk and irresponsible- therefore her fellow servicemembers felt the need to take advantage of her.
Women that make fake claims ruin it for others and makes light of a horrible situation.

We don't know that false accustations are more common than actual rapes. With rape we can never know all the victims, whether male or female.
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Old 11-29-2009, 06:37 PM
 
Location: Greenville, SC
1,184 posts, read 2,367,963 times
Reputation: 1003
Having served in the Marines, and seen both all male (combat) units, and co-ed ones, I'd have to say the combat units had a higher degree of discipline because, well, quite frankly, there was no "trouble", besides the a-holes who would f up, from time to time.

My experience (mid to late 90's), was that female Marines (WM's in the common vernacular), were trouble. My unit at Camp Hansen was Exhibit A as to why female servicemembers thought they should be given a get-out-of-jail-free card, just because they had breasts and a vagina.

Let's face it, in our Oprah society, "women" (and here I do not speak of real women), get away with murder.

One filthy WM, in a quiet, almost unintelligible voice, told me I attempted to "rape" her in her barracks room. Truth be told, and if her "claim" can be taken in to account, here, she baited me into going to her room so she could lecture me on "feminisym" and, I dunno, the Indigo Girls.

Why an American young woman would be interested in joining the Marine Corps is beyond me (most in the the 90's were a waste of money, in fact 50% were pregnant out of wedlock at any given time in those years), but I guess a ***** knows where to find lots of horny young men to, well, you know...

Gang bangs and cheating were de riguer, in those years, so I'd imagine some WM claiming "rape" might be met with a snicker or two, most of the time. Yeah, sure. Rape, LOL.

In 4 years active and honorable service, I never once touched even a WM or a female local national while deployed. "Females" (as they're called in the service), are for the most part trouble.

Statiscally, actual rape is less common amongst those in uniform than the general public, ESPECIALLY when one considers the (rough) age group.

-
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Old 11-30-2009, 07:34 AM
 
Location: San Antonio
2,839 posts, read 8,122,380 times
Reputation: 3856
Quote:
Originally Posted by forest beekeeper View Post
I honestly do not recall ever seeing a 'Womans Crisis Center' on any base where I have been stationed.

I did once volunteer to help a civilian Womans Center. They were moving office spaces from one building to another, so a bunch of us MPs went in to move funriture and boxes. They had to previously vacate all of the women so they would not be exposed to our cooties as we moved their stuff.

Has anyone seen a 'Womans Center' on any base?

I'm not sure about all of the services, but the Air Force has an equivallent to a rape crisis center called the Sexual Assault Response Cordinator (SARC).

This is needed because rapes that happen aren't reported. Women feel that they will stereotyped. It's interested that this thread is expressing more disgust for false reports by women, then it is for actual rapists. Women who are REALLY raped are very unlikely to report it, for fear that everyone will think they are making it up. The SARC allows them to get medical treatment and counseling. without opening up a criminal investigation or notifiying the chain of command. There is 100% confidentiality. This has increased the number of reports, because women don't have to be afraid that they will be stigmitized, ostracized, or accused of a false rape claim if there is not enough evidence.

However, if a woman wants a criminal investigation, they may ask for one.

Also, men who are raped are humiliated, and rarely report it or seek treatment, the SARC allows them to do so in total privacy also.

Many don't agree. Even if I go to the SARC and I'm the 4th person this week to say, "I was raped by Airman XXX," they can't hand that information over to authorities. The treatment of the mental and physical health of victims is more important than prosecution at this time.

I agree that it is horrible if a woman falsly cries rape, but please know that jumping to that conclusion, even if someone is found innocent, it stigmitizes women.

Someone even said that there were people convicted over false rape claims. Excuse me? How do you know they are false? Cuz someone told you that? The judge and jury said they were not false, and they are the ones that saw all the evidence and heard all of the testimony...why and how could you know more about the situation then them?
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