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Old 11-26-2009, 04:48 AM
 
Location: :~)
1,483 posts, read 1,511,847 times
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Default Balad1 and Earthbound

Your both right, this started years ago, with the sisification of the military. My father (1970-90) started to see the change in my military (1989-09) and now I see it more in your military. We need to revive Reagon to hopefully bring back some old school mentality but its probably too late, we are changed forever.

This is very frustrating for our troops trying to make positive progress in a really crappy environment. I hope he wins but past history is against him. This does not help the cause. Why? What result are they looking for? This does nothing but lower troop morale. The government should be ashamed.
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Old 11-26-2009, 07:30 AM
 
4,629 posts, read 6,099,851 times
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I spent a whole lot of time reading up on this (including your sites). I've read the Uniform Code of Military Justice (some of it; it's ungodly long), the Seal Creed, the treatment protocol for Enemy Prisoners of War, etc. And multiple news sites on the issue.

How do you make this trial out to be "politically correct"? The entire process is the antithesis of anything political.

A complaint was made. The complaint was reported to the Seal leader. The Seal leader reported the complaint up the chain of command as required. The complaint was investigated. The Seals were offered a very minor punishment, when it was determined that they were lying. They refused, and they themselves requested a Court Martial, aka a jury trial. This was their right under the Uniform Code of Military Justice.

I'm not understanding how following protocol is political. Protocol is written in stone. Not much leeway there for interpretation.

They should have just taken the 'light punishment', but they said they weren't lying.

I hope to God they are exonerated. They must believe they will be, or they wouldn't have gambled on a Court Martial.
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Old 11-26-2009, 07:58 AM
 
2,996 posts, read 4,369,769 times
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The thing about court martials is the burden of proof is typically much higher than it is in civilian courts. I've seen it several times through out my career where guilty people requested court martial simply b/c they knew the commands case wasn't air tight and they'd get off.
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Old 11-26-2009, 08:21 AM
 
4,629 posts, read 6,099,851 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by macjr82 View Post
The thing about court martials is the burden of proof is typically much higher than it is in civilian courts. I've seen it several times through out my career where guilty people requested court martial simply b/c they knew the commands case wasn't air tight and they'd get off.
I thought it was curious that they denied any wrong doing, but yet their lawyer admitted they struck the prisoner.

I found a site where there was a discussion by military members. One person was slightly unsympathetic to these Seals. So it makes sense then that they were very well aware of the high burden of proof that's needed.

P.S.: Are the transcripts of Court Martial released or available to the civilian population?

Last edited by Wicked Felina; 11-26-2009 at 08:26 AM.. Reason: ps.
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Old 11-26-2009, 06:32 PM
 
Location: NOVA
1,229 posts, read 2,241,481 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by macjr82 View Post
The thing about court martials is the burden of proof is typically much higher than it is in civilian courts. I've seen it several times through out my career where guilty people requested court martial simply b/c they knew the commands case wasn't air tight and they'd get off.
...and in the upcoming 'civilian' court case in New York is already tainted now that the President has already declared the defendents guilty.
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Old 11-27-2009, 12:43 AM
 
Location: Lafayette, Louisiana
14,097 posts, read 13,920,229 times
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I watched a documentary about a Nazi prison camp. They were talking with the British soldiers who survived the camp after being rescued by the American troops. Upon being rescued, the British troops who thought they had it so rough were shocked to discover what was going on in the nearby concentration camps. They volunteered to help the Americans help the rescued concentration camp prisoners. One man said the American doctor told him to give the people sips of water. The American Doctor ordered a German prisoner to get some water. The German prisoner told him he doesn't get things for Jewish dogs. The American doctor pulled out his service pistol and shot the German prisoner dead and turned to the one next to him and ordered him to get the water. He did so without any back talk or hesitation. That's how you run a war. We would have lost WW2 if we'd had today's press, today's congress, today's president, and today's PC enviroment.
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