Milwaukee subways (Madison, Waukesha, Mequon: sales, house, transfer)

[CHIP72]

Washington has 4+ million people in its metro area. Milwaukee has something like 1.5 or 1.6 million people in its metro area. Big difference.

[EnjoyEP]

Originally Posted by arimor

D.C isnt big either!~DC has only 68 square miles of area.

The metro area is approximated at 5.3 million people.

Actually, your argument that D.C. metro's landmass size isn't that big only SOLIDIFIES my point. You have a relatively SMALL landmass area, but with a metro of 5.3 million people crammed in and around it!!

Now THAT...is a perfect remedy for something successful like light rail. There will obviously be a huge demand off of something like that.

Milwaukee metro is 1.7 million. I cannot tell you what an incredible difference driving / getting around is like in a Milwaukee metro versus a DC metro. It isn't even comparable.

DC (note: Milwaukee metro doesn't even make this top 25 list):
United States metropolitan area - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[Drover]

Originally Posted by EnjoyEP

Milwaukee metro is 1.7 million. I cannot tell you what an incredible difference driving / getting around is like in a Milwaukee metro versus a DC metro. It isn't even comparable.

Bingo. The amount of traffic in DC versus the infrastructure's ability to handle it is like trying to move the Mississippi River through a fire hose. If you want a clue of what it's like driving in DC, come down to Chicago and drive around here during rush hour. Then multiply that by another 50%. Traffic in Milwaukee flows like magic in comparison, and mass transit has a hard time competing with that. Population density plays a big part of whether or not mass transit can work efficiently, and the population density of the Milwaukee area, and even the city itself, is pretty low.

[karfar]

I for one would loooove to see some push towards better public transportation. The amount of reliance people put on cars is kind of disgusting. I've taken the 15 bus route for years, lately I hardly ever use it. Why? Because the amount of time it takes to get to downtown from Bayview is ridiculously long....and the wait time in between buses almost doubles the time. I believe this in turn drives people to stay away from buses & instead use their cars. How about putting more buses on the lines, if not the more popular lines, so people aren't waiting as long? Then, more people would take the bus! I don't enjoy contributing to environmental pollution & laziness by using my car. Something has to give & w/these gas prices the way they are, now is the perfect time. What the heck is everyone afraid of???

[EnjoyEP]

Originally Posted by karfar

What the heck is everyone afraid of???

Increased taxes.

[karfar]

Originally Posted by EnjoyEP

Increased taxes.

Right, well there's always going to be something, isn't there?

[wanderlusting]

I took the bus a lot when i was younger, and i can tell you that it's a real drag. It takes forever to get somewhere, stopping at every corner and at every major intersection waiting for the green light to turn red. Also, the bus can't take you everywhere. Nobody wants to walk blocks to get to their destination after getting "dropped off" at the bus stop. I see the route #28 close to where I live and there's usually two or three people on it. To me the whole bus system sounds like a waste.

[arimor]

Originally Posted by wanderlusting

I took the bus a lot when i was younger, and i can tell you that it's a real drag. It takes forever to get somewhere, stopping at every corner and at every major intersection waiting for the green light to turn red. Also, the bus can't take you everywhere. Nobody wants to walk blocks to get to their destination after getting "dropped off" at the bus stop. I see the route #28 close to where I live and there's usually two or three people on it. To me the whole bus system sounds like a waste.

H3LL YELL and at the wrong time and the wrong day it can run every 45 minutes to an hour.

[ffknight918]

Originally Posted by arimor

H3LL YELL and at the wrong time and the wrong day it can run every 45 minutes to an hour.

That's ridiculous.

[EnjoyEP]

Originally Posted by karfar

Right, well there's always going to be something, isn't there?

Right, and that is why I don't need anymore unnecessary "something".

Increased taxes in an already-very-high-taxed area is more than "something"...it is a HUGE DEAL.

I have seen you state that you don't own a home. Well that's cool. But for those of us that do, we are PAYING THROUGH THE NOSE to own that home (in fees that support anything but our home-ownership). And home owners support our citizenries more than anyone else.

I am a father of two young children. My wife stays home because we don't want to follow the common-found Eastern / Midwestern philosophy of having both husband and wife work their respective keisters off to try to "keep up with the joneses" while casting our kids aside to be brought up by a paid source that is anyone other than ourselves.

We do own a home. Unlike the irresponsible fools that bought well above their true means during the ARM-lovefest age in mortgages, we have bought in our means the right way. We have a substantial mortgage, but one in which my salary *can* afford. That is, within reason, budgeting, and responsible government taxation.

We moved here to the Milwaukee County area (back from Albuquerque, NM) for family purposes. We owned a similarly-priced home in Albuquerque with property taxes for $1500 annually (very reasonable). Now, for a similarly-priced home in Milwaukee County, we are paying in excess of $4000. That is a HUGE difference to those lower-middle class folks that the liberals seem to talk about being "so concerned" about but really, just seem to hammer on.

No my friend, that is not just "something" to me. That is a big friggin' deal. That moves me from in Albuquerque being able to do something occasionally with some limited extra cash to having to have me get a 2nd, part time job.

And you know what? I am willing to do so if it makes semi-sense in the community. Extra buses, rapid buses, etc., kind of make sense in some regards for Milwaukee / MKE County. Subways and light rail, etc. DON'T. And you know what? If they try to tack on an additional $500 or $1000 to my taxes for such foolish endeavors, I ain't paying. I am moving the heck out of here, leaving an even bigger tax burden for the remainder of folks here!

So this isn't just "another something"...this is a huge frigging deal. It is why the upper Midwest / rustbelt is dying. Attitudes like that. Sure, you could build your big, fancy, sparkling train that looks nice and is sexy in the CD forums to show off. But the folks like me - the backbone and breadbasket of our society and culture - will move the heck out into a region where one can afford to live reasonably one one middle class income, even if it means without a "sexy" train, and that is pretty much the anti of what this region needs or wants currently.

And I presume that folks like you with that attidue would say "good riddance, if you don't like our nice train, you can live somewhere without it", but honestly, that just cuts your / our own throats. If you care at all about our community / our region, etc., you cannot afford to lose folks like me that are the backbone of the community. You cannot afford to have us flocking out. That is why Milwaukee isn't growing by any means where most communities of a similar size are. Thinking / backbone like this just slits the community's own wrist.