minneapolis vs. chicago (St. Paul, Duluth, Lauderdale: homes, best schools, property taxes)

[Steve-o]

Originally Posted by Robert P Stewart

What a timely question!!!

I am a Twin Cities resident currently having a weekend fling in Chicago (with the wife of course ).

To answer your question: Minneapolis. Chicago smells like a poorly-maintained porta-john. My wife and I just took a stroll by the Navy Pier. I spent most of the time looking around trying to find the guy who must have taken a dump upwind from us. Traffic is HORRIFIC here. 10 blocks in a cab felt like 2 years in a parking lot. Traffic in the Cities is actually quite nice compared to other metropolitan areas.

The Cities actually smell like, well, nothing. Perhaps the smugness of the artsy-fartsy crowd wafts through the air once in a while, but that's it.

My pick - Twin Cities for sure.

Robert

I know Im extremely late to the party, but this is quite possibly the dumbest thing Ive read. Really, it is.

[crbcrbrgv]

Originally Posted by internat

Norwegians are great. Norwegian-American is not the same as Norwegian though.

Gotta agree with you there. My uncle Emert from Finland was a wee bit different than us American born Scandinavians. And yes I do know that Fins aren't Norwegians, Norwegians aren't Swedes, Hansons aren't Hansens etc

[internat]

It really depends how many generations back we're talking about and how much they preserved their culture. I was also thinking of culture and mentality but also that Americans who call themselves Norwegian-American, Italian-American, and so on tend to have ancestors from all over Europe. In parts of USA predominantly European-Americans have native American ancestry too. The latter is probably not common among Scandinavian-Americans whereas it might be among earlier immigrants such as the Scots-Irish in more southern states.

Well, we should also mention Finns are not Scandinavian. Finland is one of the Nordic countries though. Their language is part of the Finno-Ugric group which is very different from Indo-European languages. Hindi is closer to English than Finnish. There's a small ethnic Swedish-speaking minority in Finland. They make up around 6 % of the population. Most of them live in larger cities and towns in western and southern Finland. Finns have different traditions, mentality, cuisine, etc. They are originally a more eastern people and their closest relatives live in northern and central Russia towards the Urals. Population genetic studies and physical anthropology have confirmed this. It's quite easy to pick out ethnic Finns from Swedes. They had of course a lot of Germanic influence in Finland proper. In turn, Denmark is the Scandinavian country with the least Finnish influence. Kvaens live in northern Norway and there are many Finns in Sweden, both from eastern Finland to eastern Norway and central Sweden (forest Finns) and more modern immigrants (mainly from northern Finland) to Uppland and nearby counties in eastern Sweden.

Originally Posted by crbcrbrgv

Gotta agree with you there. My uncle Emert from Finland was a wee bit different than us American born Scandinavians. And yes I do know that Fins aren't Norwegians, Norwegians aren't Swedes, Hansons aren't Hansens etc

[museumshame]

regarding all the posts about chicago being better for a young person in the arts, i really couldn't disagree more. im a young musician, and you couldn't pay me to move to chicago and do the same thing there. the quality isn't nearly as good, and without going per capita, there are more interesting acts here. just an opinion, but im not the only one in either city who holds it. and the theatre scene here is much better as well. the young arts community is extremely active. my one criticism would be that it can be difficult meeting people if you're not connected. maybe it's the same in chicago, i don't know.

[sar-bear]

I've enjoyed reading all the posts on this thread. My husband and I are looking to relocate to one of these cities too...though would most likely be living in the burbs. I'm wondering if there's a stark difference from one city's burbs to the next? We're still in our late 20s with a two year old, so though schools/community are top priority, we'd like to be near museums, the arts, and good eats (primarily asian: thai, vietnamese).

Also: I'm curious about the four seasons in each place. I'm originally from Kansas, but already know to expect a new level of cold, esp. in Minnesota...and, I'm imagining, a need to adapt to lots of snow. And what about summer? I'd guess Chicago's a bit hotter and humid, but is Minnesota a giant mosquito swarm from all those lakes?

Thanks in advance..

[sar-bear]

Originally Posted by M2N

Minneapolis/St Paul (suburbs of) have excellent public schools... loads of parks...and many other families for your kids to find friendships.

I'm sure it's been covered before, but...could someone lend a hand with which suburb schools are best?

[rcsteiner]

Originally Posted by sar-bear

I've enjoyed reading all the posts on this thread. My husband and I are looking to relocate to one of these cities too...though would most likely be living in the burbs. I'm wondering if there's a stark difference from one city's burbs to the next?

I can't speak for Chicago (I've visited friends and relatives in a few places like Barrington, Lisle, etc., but have never lived there), but even in the Twin Cities different suburbs can have a very different feel about them depending on the age of the houses and the specific geography of the area.

Minnetonka is similar to Edina in some ways with many 50's/60's houses and some newer ones, winding roads, hills, and trees, but both are very different from much of Richfield or Hopkins, for example, which are both at least partially laid out in a grid. Even the east half of Bloomington is very different from its western half. Etc.

We're still in our late 20s with a two year old, so though schools/community are top priority, we'd like to be near museums, the arts, and good eats (primarily asian: thai, vietnamese).

Since traffic isn't really a huge issue in Twin Cities as a whole when compared to some other metro areas**, I think you'll find that many of the restaurants, museums, and similar things are probably within workable driving range regardless of where you end up living.

Also: I'm curious about the four seasons in each place. I'm originally from Kansas, but already know to expect a new level of cold, esp. in Minnesota...and, I'm imagining, a need to adapt to lots of snow.

Strangely enough, Minnesota doesn't usually get all that much snow, though it's certainly cold in the wintertime. This year we were up in the Twin Cities and in Duluth for Christmas, and that's the most snow I've seen up there in quite some time (in the Twin Cities, anyway -- northern Minnesota usually gets more snow than southern/central MN does).

And what about summer? I'd guess Chicago's a bit hotter and humid, but is Minnesota a giant mosquito swarm from all those lakes?

Depends on where you live. :-) Some places it can be nasty, and I've found that skeeters in the northern part of the state and Ontario are worse than in the southern part of the state (or the Twin Cities). It's all relative, though.

My guess is that Chicago's proximity to Lake Michigan actually keeps things slightly cooler in the summer and warmer in the winter.

** Note: I'm a former Twin Cities resident living in Atlanta now, and I think Atlanta has a MUCH more serious traffic problem. At certain times and places traffic in the Twin Cities can certainly be a pain, but the problem isn't really system-wide like it is here in Atlanta. I miss Twin Cities traffic.

[BankerChex]

Lived in Chicago for 10 years, now moving to MSP in mid-July. I can definitely say Chicago is my favorite city in the US (grew up in Miami, and have lived in CA and NYC). Starting from the outside-in, definitely an awesome skyline and diverse architecture. Each neighborhood has its own cultural "feel" from Ukranian Village (artsy bars/music) to Roscoe Village (brownstones, single family homes, with more of a neighborhood feel to the bars and restaurants). Singles scene is, surprisingly, more akin to what I've learned about MSP: better to have connections in place. Well, not too different from anywhere really (you generally meet people from friends and family). Chicago is like a big small town, with all the culture, nightlife, and buzz of NYC, combined with the neighborhood feel (depending on your neighborhood) of Grovers Corners.

For a family, however, definitely more of a contrast. The public school system here, well, sucks (period). The slush fund generated from our property taxes as been used by Daley to build a $200M bean and help keep corporate HQs located in the city, rather than spend it on textbooks and development programs for kids. You'll definitely look towards suburbs like Naperville, Downers Grove, or Wilmette for the best schools (and, correspondingly higher home prices).

If you're looking toward private education, however (Latin School, Univ. of Chicago Lab Schools), then living in the city offers a cultural, culinary, and lifestyle option second to none. Season tickets to the Joffrey Ballet is around $200, and tickets to the symphony (CSO) are relatively inexpensive. Lyric opera is pricer, but certainly worth it. Not to mention the countless venues for underground alt rock, punk, jazz, funk, blues, int'l artists, etc. available. Check out Metro (rock, punk), HotHouse (latin), Elbo room (alt rock/punk), Vic (bigger acts), Green Mill (best jazz), Checkerboard Lounge (old school Chicago blues, south side--don't worry, you'll be safe)...just for starters.

Metromix for reviews of any restaurant, venue, club, you name it. Hope this helps.

[Ben Around]

Originally Posted by sar-bear

I've enjoyed reading all the posts on this thread. My husband and I are looking to relocate to one of these cities too...though would most likely be living in the burbs. I'm wondering if there's a stark difference from one city's burbs to the next? We're still in our late 20s with a two year old, so though schools/community are top priority, we'd like to be near museums, the arts, and good eats (primarily asian: thai, vietnamese).

Also: I'm curious about the four seasons in each place. I'm originally from Kansas, but already know to expect a new level of cold, esp. in Minnesota...and, I'm imagining, a need to adapt to lots of snow. And what about summer? I'd guess Chicago's a bit hotter and humid, but is Minnesota a giant mosquito swarm from all those lakes?

Thanks in advance..

The main difference I see between the Chicago burbs and the TC burbs is the variety. TC burbs are mostly sprawly, post WW-II, auto-dependent places. You can find the same thing in Chicago, but you can also find more compact, less auto-dependent burbs (pre-WW-II) where you can easliy commute by train and your kids can walk places.

[sar-bear]

Originally Posted by rcsteiner

Minnetonka is similar to Edina in some ways with many 50's/60's houses and some newer ones, winding roads, hills, and trees, but both are very different from much of Richfield or Hopkins, for example, which are both at least partially laid out in a grid. Even the east half of Bloomington is very different from its western half. Etc.

Strangely enough, Minnesota doesn't usually get all that much snow, though it's certainly cold in the wintertime. This year we were up in the Twin Cities and in Duluth for Christmas, and that's the most snow I've seen up there in quite some time (in the Twin Cities, anyway -- northern Minnesota usually gets more snow than southern/central MN does).

Helpful info; I'll have to search this board for further descriptions of the Twin City burbs.

But not that much snow, eh? I read elsewhere that Chicago city proper gets more snow than the burbs, for good reason. Just want to be fully prepared for what nature throws at us...