Simple things that could save minneapolis from turning into another crime ridden city. (St. Paul: home, neighborhoods)

[northbound74]

First of all, keep up the discussion. Too many places want to say, "well, crime's not that bad for a city this size, plus, it's confined to one or two areas. Stay away from those, and you'll be fine."
That keeps one safe, I guess, but it doesn't solve anything.
Stay true to your Minnesota culture. I don't know what it is about you guys, but you're one of the most civilized places I've seen. Keep your families strong. Keep your relationships strong. If you're spiritually minded, stay true to your religion.
Government can only do so much. It can punish crime, but rarely does it prevent it for any length of time. Programs are okay, but relationships are better.
Do whatever you can to keep drugs far, far away. Missouri is one of the states that's been hit the hardest with meth. Sadly, that state is nothing like it was 25 years ago.
Even if stuff like that were legalized, the people who do it are practically useless to society while they're on it. I have family members who have bean caught up in that, I always loved them, and they are clean now, but it was very hard to watch them go through that.

[pirate_lafitte]

Originally Posted by northbound74

First of all, keep up the discussion. Too many places want to say, "well, crime's not that bad for a city this size, plus, it's confined to one or two areas. Stay away from those, and you'll be fine."
That keeps one safe, I guess, but it doesn't solve anything.
Stay true to your Minnesota culture. I don't know what it is about you guys, but you're one of the most civilized places I've seen. Keep your families strong. Keep your relationships strong. If you're spiritually minded, stay true to your religion. Government can only do so much. It can punish crime, but rarely does it prevent it for any length of time. Programs are okay, but relationships are better.
Do whatever you can to keep drugs far, far away. Missouri is one of the states that's been hit the hardest with meth. Sadly, that state is nothing like it was 25 years ago.
Even if stuff like that were legalized, the people who do it are practically useless to society while they're on it. I have family members who have bean caught up in that, I always loved them, and they are clean now, but it was very hard to watch them go through that.

Strong families and a strong faith life(Minnesota is largely Lutheran and Catholic), and strong relationships can help keep crime rates down. If people help one another out in hard times, things can be kept civilized. Use all of that in combination with the system set up to help someone just in case they get laid off or if the company dissolves, desperation can be kept low.

[K-Luv]

Originally Posted by Anarchy4sale

The "3 Strike law", Institute it now. It will greatly cut down on the undesirables from coming from the surrounding states who have 2 felonies on their records. For this to work, we would need to build more prisons to hold the offenders.

Originally Posted by Clifford63

Many states have the 3 strike rule. I am not opposed to this, but I don't really think it will significantly change behaviors either. Desperate people do desperate things, and hardened criminals are rarely rehibilitated.

I lived in California when they implemented the three strikes law. It solved nothing. It deterred no one. Some people would just leave the state to another state that did not have such a law after they received their second strike. I think that the strikes have to incurred within the state, I do not think that they are transferrable, so it won't keep others out who already have two strikes. In fact, it might bring them in since they can start over with a fresh slate.

I am not sure if this is true for every state that has this law, but the three strikes law is for any felony; including non-violent felonies. It is fairly easy for good people to receive a felony, so yeah, let's lock them up for the rest of their lives.

Originally Posted by Anarchy4sale

Restrict the welfare program greatly for those moving in from other states. Again this will stop people coming from the surrounding states, to leach off of our social services, and will reduce the unwanted elements from filtering into Minneapolis and the surrounding communities.

You only had to be in Minnesota for one day to be considered a resident and eligible for economic assistance, but now it has been bumped up to thirty days (but for some reason you have to live in this state for a full year to qualify for resident tuition ). First of all, only women with children receive welfare. Guys (even if they have kids), and childless women receive general assistance, which is currently doling out a whopping $204 a month. Yeah, that is really going to bring in the scum from other states!

Originally Posted by Anarchy4sale

Crack down on homeless people. These people are a problem, and most of the time have mental illness problems that cause them to sit on the street, and not get a job that they could advance in life. They can become very violent towards people, and make the city look very dumpy. Either lock em up, and treat them for their mental illness, or at the very minimum enforce the no loitering laws, to keep them off the corners.

People become homeless for a variety of reasons, some even want to be homeless. Some do have mental disorders and some were lead there due to alcohol or drugs, but for the majority it was just the luck of the draw. You know, a good amount of the older homeless are Vietnam vets. Yeah, hey, we are going to send you off to fight in a war and then when you come back and can't cope with sh*t and end up living on the street, well then we'll just throw your a*s in jail too.

Originally Posted by Anarchy4sale

Fund the anti-gang programs, and task force. The police could always use more money in the department, to break up gangs, and the illegal activities they do.

Anti-gang task forces have proven time and time again to be ineffective. Look at any major city, gangs still run circles around the police, for the most part.

The real task force begins in the home,with the parents.

Originally Posted by Anarchy4sale

Crack down on illegal Immigrants. Not much need to be said here.

Okay.

Originally Posted by Anarchy4sale

Hire more police, and make the work they do on the street worth while by enforcing longer prison sentences, this starts with the judge's.

Longer prison sentences will not deter crime, it has not in the past, why would it in the future. Look at how many people still commit murder even though the possibility of the death sentence is there for them?

Not sure about hiring more police, maybe, but I can guarantee that beat cops would be more effective.

The key to solving the crime problem begins with the community. When neighbors get together to clean up their neighborhoods, that is when you see results.

[pirate_lafitte]

Originally Posted by K-Luv

I lived in California when they implemented the three strikes law. It solved nothing. It deterred no one. Some people would just leave the state to another state that did not have such a law after they received their second strike. I think that the strikes have to incurred within the state, I do not think that they are transferrable, so it won't keep others out who already have two strikes. In fact, it might bring them in since they can start over with a fresh slate.

I am not sure if this is true for every state that has this law, but the three strikes law is for any felony; including non-violent felonies. It is fairly easy for good people to receive a felony, so yeah, let's lock them up for the rest of their lives.

You only had to be in Minnesota for one day to be considered a resident and eligible for economic assistance, but now it has been bumped up to thirty days (but for some reason you have to live in this state for a full year to qualify for resident tuition ). First of all, only women with children receive welfare. Guys (even if they have kids), and childless women receive general assistance, which is currently doling out a whopping $204 a month. Yeah, that is really going to bring in the scum from other states!


People become homeless for a variety of reasons, some even want to be homeless. Some do have mental disorders and some were lead there due to alcohol or drugs, but for the majority it was just the luck of the draw. You know, a good amount of the older homeless are Vietnam vets. Yeah, hey, we are going to send you off to fight in a war and then when you come back and can't cope with sh*t and end up living on the street, well then we'll just throw your a*s in jail too.

Anti-gang task forces have proven time and time again to be ineffective. Look at any major city, gangs still run circles around the police, for the most part.

The real task force begins in the home,with the parents.

Okay.

Longer prison sentences will not deter crime, it has not in the past, why would it in the future. Look at how many people still commit murder even though the possibility of the death sentence is there for them?

Not sure about hiring more police, maybe, but I can guarantee that beat cops would be more effective.

The key to solving the crime problem begins with the community. When neighbors get together to clean up their neighborhoods, that is when you see results.

So true.

[lalife]

Minneapolis is NOT turning into some crime ridden city. The city is improving itself all of the time. Turn off the news and actually drive around and see for yourself. They are fixing up alot of neighborhoods.

[pirate_lafitte]

Originally Posted by lalife

Minneapolis is NOT turning into some crime ridden city. The city is improving itself all of the time. Turn off the news and actually drive around and see for yourself. They are fixing up alot of neighborhoods.

Who do you think is saying that Mpls is turning into a dump?

[JenLee]

Originally Posted by pirate_lafitte

Who do you think is saying that Mpls is turning into a dump?

The OP seemed to imply this with his first post. If the OP thought that MPLS was improving, that antagonistic first post wouldn't have been written. I *personally* found it to be offensive because it sounds as though the OP thinks that people who are on welfare or are homeless are that way because they choose to be on welfare or homeless.

Even the insinuation that mentally ill people are homeless because they choose not to work and choose homelessness shows how little the OP knows about mental illness.

There are several good responses in other posts here; but I don't think that many of the OP's ideas would be very helpful; and these are my reasons for saying this:

1.) The 3 strike law. Well, it may be helpful; but how many people would be needed to support prisons that will be overcrowded with many people who are put in prison for stupidity when they are young? I know a young woman who was charged with a felony when she was 16: during an angry outburst during an argument with another girl she "made terroristic threats" (she yelled "I'll kill you!" at the other girl) which she said she would never have acted on. She's now 25 and can't get a decent job because of that felony conviction. Or how about a 32 yr old guy who (as a stupid 17 y/o while joy-riding) put a large firecracker in a mailbox to see it blow up? THAT was a Federal felony and he can't find a place to rent because background checks say that. Or another 30 y/o who had a "criminal property damage" felony as a teen also for stupidity? These 3 are now adults, but due to a few minutes of teen-aged stupidity, they are all penalized as to what their jobs are and where they can live.

2.) Restrict the welfare program. Has the OP actually checked on what the MN welfare program is? Does the OP actually *know* anyone on welfare? Maybe the OP should go out and meet some welfare recipients and find out why they are on welfare. I happen to work with a certain population of welfare recipients; I've found that they aren't on welfare because they want to be on it.

3.) I've already said what I wanted to about homeless and mentally ill people.

4.) Gang activity. I agree with those that said that gang activity needs to be curbed at home and by the neighborhoods.

5.) Most of the OP's ideas are about "cracking down" or restricting or other heavy-handed methods to control the riff-raff in MN. SOMEHOW that just doesn't sound at all Minnesotan in my book!

[pirate_lafitte]

Originally Posted by JenLee

The OP seemed to imply this with his first post. If the OP thought that MPLS was improving, that antagonistic first post wouldn't have been written. I *personally* found it to be offensive because it sounds as though the OP thinks that people who are on welfare or are homeless are that way because they choose to be on welfare or homeless.

Even the insinuation that mentally ill people are homeless because they choose not to work and choose homelessness shows how little the OP knows about mental illness.

There are several good responses in other posts here; but I don't think that many of the OP's ideas would be very helpful; and these are my reasons for saying this:

1.) The 3 strike law. Well, it may be helpful; but how many people would be needed to support prisons that will be overcrowded with many people who are put in prison for stupidity when they are young? I know a young woman who was charged with a felony when she was 16: during an angry outburst during an argument with another girl she "made terroristic threats" (she yelled "I'll kill you!" at the other girl) which she said she would never have acted on. She's now 25 and can't get a decent job because of that felony conviction. Or how about a 32 yr old guy who (as a stupid 17 y/o while joy-riding) put a large firecracker in a mailbox to see it blow up? THAT was a Federal felony and he can't find a place to rent because background checks say that. Or another 30 y/o who had a "criminal property damage" felony as a teen also for stupidity? These 3 are now adults, but due to a few minutes of teen-aged stupidity, they are all penalized as to what their jobs are and where they can live.

2.) Restrict the welfare program. Has the OP actually checked on what the MN welfare program is? Does the OP actually *know* anyone on welfare? Maybe the OP should go out and meet some welfare recipients and find out why they are on welfare. I happen to work with a certain population of welfare recipients; I've found that they aren't on welfare because they want to be on it.

3.) I've already said what I wanted to about homeless and mentally ill people.

4.) Gang activity. I agree with those that said that gang activity needs to be curbed at home and by the neighborhoods.

5.) Most of the OP's ideas are about "cracking down" or restricting or other heavy-handed methods to control the riff-raff in MN. SOMEHOW that just doesn't sound at all Minnesotan in my book!

You made alot of good points. The three strikes law isn't a good idea. Those cases you described are part of the reason they don't work. If a person can't get a job, that person will most likely A)use the welfare system for life or B)wind up back in prison for committing another crime. The idea that the three strikes law will curb crime is absurd. I live in Georgia where the TWO srikes law is being used. Does that keep the crime rate low? No way.
I think alot of people just make blanet statements about the homeless. Not all homeless people are homeless by choice. Some people really do have problems or have fallen under hard times.
Restricting welfare, well here is my say: Restricting welfare won't be that helpful. Illinois curbed welfare. Sure, some people went to other states, but the crime problems were still really bad. Chicago went through the crack epidemic. Curbing welfare didn't solve that problem. The problem is the many places are not concerned with rehabilitating criminals or helping people help themselves. Many societies just want an easy fix. The "easy" fix doesn't always work.

[tindo80]

It kinda sounds like a few of you here are 'dancing' around an obvious thought that everyone is staying mum on.

The references to 'welfare' 'crack' 'chicago' 'out of staters' 'gangs'...a lot of those tend to be stereotypes of a select few groups. No one is saying it, so I wont, other than saying I think by fact that your dodging the term and subject you must know the fallacious grounds for which you are making your arguments.

Restricting welfare does nothing but force more people into crime and drugs, because they either cant support themselves by other means (the economy is in the toilet, jobs are far and few inbetween, and actual jobs that can support families are even scarcer, especially in poor neighborhoods), or their depression and lack of ability to move up in life pushes them to drugs.

3 strikes laws do nothing but allow for the imprisoning of more people (statistically, of those same groups mentioned above that no one will say in this thread), so supporters of 'putting all the ___'s (fill in the blank with whatever marginalized, traditionally lower incomed group you feel) are big supporters of 3 strikes laws.

Everyone ends up footing the bill for inmates and jails to be built, whereas if more social programs were expanded to those people giving them an alternative or potential jobs, they would be contributing to society rather than being removed and from and supported by it. 3 strikes laws exist on the fringe of constitutionality, where you can be imprisoned for most or all of your life for making one big mistake and 2 small, potentially unknowing ones. If you want to see the future of MN with that policy, look at California, where they have to direct more money for prisons than education and public works put together every year just to stay afloat.

[nick is rulz]

I think really all the city needs is more police and better enforcement. Our prison system could stand a spit shine as well. Improvements in the city are quite dramatic compared to what they were in 1995.