University of St. Thomas or UM? (St. Cloud: houses, transfer, private school)

[okiallday098]

I'm currently a high school Senior living in Okinawa, Japan.
Yesterday, I was offered an Army ROTC scholarship for the ROTC program over at UM. I'm actually planning on attending UST, with ROTC once a week at UM. Everything would be paid for, including room & board, if I go to UST, but they don't have a Nursing program. The guy I talked to said I could take my prerequisites at UST and then cross-register for actual Nursing courses later on at UM, OR he could switch my scholarship offer to UM if I decided to go there full-time instead.

I was wondering which would be the better option. Can anyone give me details on the quality of education/things in general at UST? Or UM?
I heard from a couple of people that UM is HUGE.
Other than a few days in Tokyo, I've never exactly had the experience of dealing with really big places before, so the thought of it is a little intimidating.

Plus, I'm paranoid about getting the attention I need from professors, especially in courses like Organic Chemistry where I know I won't exactly be the best student. I'm deadly serious about making it as a nurse, so I want to be able to have access to extra help should I need it.



By the way, I've never been to Minnesota, or anywhere in the States outside of New Jersey/Hawaii, for that matter. Haven't set foot on mainland U.S. soil since the third grade. No matter what, I'm excited about that.

[golfgal]

The U of M is huge. St. Thomas is a smaller private school and is a fairly compact campus. I am really surprised that they don't have a nursing program there. Are you male or female? There are other options, although I don't know if it is too late to apply but if you are female, St. Catherine's has a nursing program as does the College of St. Benedict/St. John's University outside of St. Cloud. Is it possible to transfer your ROTC scholarship to St. Ben's/St. John's-they have their own ROTC program? St. Ben's is an all-female school and St. John's is all male however all the classes/activities are mixed so it isn't any different then any other college. If you are female and can go to St. Cate's you can probably still do the U of M thing (it is just down the road from St. Thomas).

I am pretty sure that St. Thomas and St. Cate's has a cooperative agreement for class sharing too but I don't know if it applies to entire majors like nursing.

[SoDak11]

I would say switch your scholarship to UM. It will just be easier in the long run, rather than having to switch stuff around later on. You never know what pre-reqs will actually transfer (they'll tell you anything they want), and it just sounds like a hassle to go to one school but do ROTC at another school. If you just stick with one college, it'll be easier to find the right place to live.

And I really wouldn't worry about UM being too big. Either way, you are in a pretty large metro area (definitely not Tokyo large, but still pretty big) so whether you are at a small college or a big college, its still a big place to be (and you'll be off campus more often than on-campus every day) so you might as well just throw yourself in the mix, rather than teasing yourself into thinking life won't be busy at a smaller school.

As for needing personal attention in a class like organic chemistry, it won't be much different either way. If its a pretty common pre-req, they'll be several hundred kids in it at either school. Just because they say the average class size at UST is 21, it won't be like that for any chemistry class that a lot of people (freshman) have to take. Personal attention isn't going to be much different between 150 kids or 600 kids. They'll be study sessions, TA's, and tutors available at both colleges.

Furthermore, UM has better name recognition and will just be more fun (better athletics to watch, more events to see on campus), and later on in life, when you say you went to UM, people won't ask where the hell that is, which they will for UST if you end up outside Minnesota.

Also, are you Catholic? Because UST is a Catholic school, and while I know plenty of non-catholics go there, its just one other thing to consider when deciding. You want your school to represent your beliefs somewhat.

Hope that helps

[JenLee]

If you are going for a BSN in Nursing, no matter where you go the first 2 years are all general ed and pre-req. courses and you don't get into any nursing classes until you are in your 3rd year of college. If you do decide to go to UST, just be sure that any classes you do take will fulfill the U of MN nursing reqs. so you have an easy transition from one school to the other.

[JODWA]

I can speak from experience, being a graduate of St. Thomas that was commissioned through the Air Force ROTC program. In general, both options are great, but each is unique.

St. Thomas and the U of M are two totally different types of institutions. St. Thomas was previously a small, Catholic liberal arts college that is quickly growing to become a nationally recognized university. The board of directors includes the long-time president of Notre Dame as well as 10 of the 25 wealthiest people in Minnesota. Based on its progress over the past 10 years and its projections for the future, I would characterize St. Thomas as a smaller, up-and-coming Notre Dame (maybe Boston College since it's an urban university). The U of M, on the other hand, is a huge state school. The U of M is better known because it is so large, has a wide range of faculties, and represents the state of Minnesota in college sports.

As for personal attention, I don’t think that there is really any comparison at the undergraduate level. St. Thomas has a student/staff ration of 14 to 1. I was a political science major, but by far my largest class sat 40 students. My freshmen chemistry course had roughly 20. Most of my junior and senior year courses had fewer than 10 (one actually had only three). The U of M is known for classes of 500+ students, which are mostly taught by TAs. I don’t see how the U of M could provide the same level of attention.

Our detachment regularly collaborated with the detachment at the U of M and, therefore, we were able to compare both ROTC experiences firsthand. I think both programs are great, but consider that St. Thomas currently provides the best stipend package for ROTC students in the country. Beyond the scholarship offered by the Army, the university will pay all of your room and board, plus a monthly allowance. Based on current tuition rates, we’re talking a total value of over $35,000/per year. The U of M has nothing comparable, but in all fairness their tuition is much less. Also, with a smaller campus that houses all ROTC cadets, you’ll have greater opportunity to develop close social communities. You’ll find that Air Force, Army, Navy, and Marine ROTC cadets all sort of come together on campus and in my view, this adds an important element of community. At the U of M, people are spread across the city and are far less apt to seek each other out outside of “ROTC-dedicated” time.

I knew a number of people that went to St. Thomas and then cross-registered for courses at the U of M. Mostly engineers, but all that I spoke with said that they preferred the experience at St. Thomas. If I was in your shoes, I’d go to St. Thomas and then cross-register for nursing courses at the U of M.

If you have any more questions, just PM me. It’s a big decision, and I’d be more than willing to tell you of my experiences.

[okiallday098]

Oops, I meant to reply earlier.
But thank you for all the responses! I pretty much made up my mind that I'm going to St. Thomas. I'm actually trying to get my major switched to Pre-Med due to some issues with the ROTC scholarship (they're not letting the scholarship officer at UM give me the Nursing scholarship at St. Thomas because it doesn't offer Nursing, although I can easily cross-register at other schools. Wtf?), so I guess I'll be slaving away as a Tommie.

Thank you!

P.S. I will definitely P.M. you, JODWA, should I have any questions. I do have one general question, though. Is there a free/inexpensive bus I can take from St. Thomas to UM? Seeing as how I'm going to PT three times a week at UM, I'm going to have to have transportation. The officer I talked to said the cadets do carpooling, but I was wondering if there were official modes of public transportation at 6 in the morning.

[JODWA]

Here are a couple of trip plans that I pulled up on the Metro Transit (city bus) site.

Metro Transit Trip Planner

[K-Luv]

Personally, I would go to St. Thomas, but the U of M TC has one of the best nursing programs in the country. The U of M TC is also the largest college campus in the country.

BTW, I was unaware that you could transfer into a nursing program? I was under the impression that you were required to do all of your undergrad at the same institution?