Lake Phalen - a bad choice for a rental? (Minneapolis: middle-class, crime rates)

[megnadam]

We are moving in a week to MSP and are here this weekend to find a place to rent. We're not buying, and we must find a rental in two days.

We saw a ton of places today and some more tomorrow, but one stuck out and impressed us. It was a 4br on Lake Phalen in St. Paul - great house (awesome), lakefront, neighbors with kids (we have one), large lot with playground. After our visit we were sure we'd rent it.

However the housing prices were quite low (lower than St Louis Pk, Linden Hills, etc), and we were wondering why that was. So we looked up the crime rates and found out why. It appears that neighboring areas have high crime in St Paul.

We need some advice on this location. It's on the east side of the lake. Should this area be avoided? In your opinion, would it be better to take a rental house that is not as turnkey but in a nicer area?

Thanks for your advice.

[nick is rulz]

I wouldnt totally write it off, but Lake Phalen is higher crime than many St Paul neighborhoods. Its still not terrible by any means.

[megnadam]

Originally Posted by nick is rulz

I wouldnt totally write it off, but Lake Phalen is higher crime than many St Paul neighborhoods. Its still not terrible by any means.

Thanks Nick. Higher crime like 'my neighbor just got jumped' or 'i heard of a guy down the road who had a rock thrown through his car window'?

It's amazing that such a beatiful area that is lakeside would be dodgy.

Any other opinions out there?

[nick is rulz]

St Paul sadly lacks the handy dandy crime maps that the Minneapolis PD posts on their website. I would honestly call a police officer in the area and ask for more information.

[megnadam]

Originally Posted by nick is rulz

St Paul sadly lacks the handy dandy crime maps that the Minneapolis PD posts on their website. I would honestly call a police officer in the area and ask for more information.

We found St Paul crime maps here which we actually thought were better than the MPls ones. I like how they have the entire area color coded based on crime rates.

BTW, is it because of the proximity to crime areas that Lake Phalen has lower housing costs? It would seem like lakefront housing would cost more than $350-400k, which is the asking price of some of the Lake Phalen homes.

Thanks again for your feedback.

[Cruz Azul Guy]

You can't be serious about those crime maps. They're terrible in comparison to the Minneapolis ones. The grid system is fine but at least they could draw up rivers and lakes, etc. I would have to compare it to another map just to pinpoint exactly where the grid boxes are in comparison to the lake, which I'm too lazy to do right now.

[Camden Northsider]

megnadem - I don't know much at all about this area so am not a good one to be advising on it, but my impression has been that the Lake Phalen area has been somewhat economically depressed in recent years (it was always wierd to me that this would be the case around a decent sized lake in the city also). And I'm such a big fan of the idea of living on a lake that I would have a really hard time turning that down if it's a good deal. But, if you are too worried about the area, the first tier suburb of Robbinsdale (west of Mpls) is another area that has lake (s) and parks, relatively affordable housing prices, and would be a safer area than Lake Phalen - check out homes by Crystal Lake, Ryan Lake, or off of Victory Memorial Parkway. And if you're working in downtown Mpls, it would be a LOT closer.

[StPaulEastSider]

Our family rented a house on the east side of Lake Phalen a little over a year ago - Atlantic and Iowa... The neighborhood is really very good as far as urban neighborhoods are concerned. My daughter played with the little girl two doors down, whose mom was a police officer with the St. Paul police.

There were some break-ins that summer [2007] but it seemed to be teenagers from the type of things they were taking [game stations]...

We only moved because our landlords were less than desirable. [Run like hell if the landlord's names are "Susie and Bill" !!]

We've lived near the lakes in Minneapolis, and I think the east side of Lake Phalen is safer, and more affordable, than any neighborhood with a view of any of the Minneapolis chain of lakes.

The East Side of St. Paul is more economically depressed than some other areas of the Twin Cities... it's always been predominately a "working class" part of town, with the manufacturing jobs of generations past now long gone... the east side is being repopulated by the Hmong community, the Hmong keep to themselves but are very good neighbors and hard workers for the most part...

north of Maryland Avenue is generally pretty good, the area which is dicey is predominately south of Maryland Ave.

Cub Foods just opened a brand-new store on Maryland Ave, it's very nice and eco-friendly... proximity to a decent grocery store for quick runs was my one big complaint when we lived near Lake Phalen on Atlantic - but the new Cub Foods solves that problem.

A hidden gem of the East Side of St. Paul is the Battle Creek Park Area, just south of Hwy 94 and East of White Bear Avenue... it's a beautiful nature area.

So, if you are okay with living in a moreso "middle-class" than "upper-class" neighborhood, and bordering a fairly dicey area [but you are mostly separated from the dicey areas by johnson parkway and maryland avenue] then you'll like the East Lake Phalen area...

If you want to be in a very family-friendly St. Paul neighborhood, perhaps Highland Park or Saint Anthony Park would be more desirable... although I like much of Battle Creek's Housing stock - lots of high-end, custom-built, mid-century homes ["Brady Bunch" style]

There are also many suburban areas with lake view properties, Lake Josephine in Roseville is one example... in Shoreview, where we also lived at one time, there are 3-4 different lakes offering lake views... Minnesota is the land of 10,000 lakes, so homes with lake views are probably more abundant here than in other areas of the country... :-)



If you can afford private schools, you may want to look at the catholic school on the maplewood side of larpenteur avenue [between the lake and white bear avenue]... or Mounds Park Academy... moundsparkacademy.org... they are both in very close proximity to Lake Phalen.

[jeannesandra]

We moved to the Lake Phalen area five years ago and love it. Access to the park is great, and the East Side has a nice vibe--lots of families, good community spirit, good transportation. Crime has not been a problem from our point of view--never had an issue and we are avid walkers.

[MN55]

^^The Catholic school mentioned two post up is Presentation where I attended when growing up and where my kids attend. Many of the kids then move on to Hill-Murray HS also on Larpenteur where I graduated. The east side is definitely more working class than most of the metro, but atleast right on phalen, shouldn't be too bad. There will be some crime but something significant is generally rare and is usually something to do with competing gang members. I wouldn't recommend it to someone wanting a laid back, relaxing, clean as can be neighborhood, but as far as value goes in urban neighborhoods, the east side is hard to be beat. Just use your judgement.