How will the smoking ban affect the "bar scene?" (Austin: how much, calculating)

[Auntie Bob]

Originally Posted by MidniteBreeze

At the very least, I agree they should give loans to businesses to build patios and the like so they can keep some of their customers. Lord knows the state makes enough money off of Pawlenty's cigarette "fee" to fund it.

Even with that, the problem for a lot of them is, no space to build anything on.
The City Council recently granted Mitch's bar permission to not only put benches out in front of the bar but also, to let people take their drinks out with them.
As soon as that went through, The Kozy Bar asked for the same thing. My guess is, they won't get it.

[Castaway]

Originally Posted by Auntie Bob

In most of the state, I think it's too early to tell what the final results will be.
Most Duluth bars are reporting a 25-50% decline in business. One or two are actually reporting increases though.
I think eventually, the smaller places that were already operating on a shoestring will eventually close because there's nothing they can morph into that isn't cost prohibitive.
In my opinion, The state should be offering low or no interest loans to these businesses to help them figure out a way to remain viable.

Where I went to college in Oswego, NY, the county is allowing exemptions if you can prove that you have lost 15% of your business. I have read that there may be a rebate on equipment ,such as smoke filters. The bar I run was designed to allow smoking at a high price tag. I wonder if the state of NM would consider some sort of rebate.

There are so many things 'grandfathered' in. Couldn't smoking be one of these things? If a bar has allowed smoking for years, allow it to continue. If there is a change of ownership or new bar then make it non-smoking. Phase it in slowly.

However, I still think, this issue should be decided by the free market and private ownership.

[MidniteBreeze]

Yes, it is quite a drastic change, isn't it? No "phase in", no compromise. I remember back when they changed the drinking age in WI back to 21 (they had dropped it to 18 for a while), the people who were still in the 18-20 age range got "grandfathered" in.

One exception the MN law makes is they still allow smoking in cigar/cigarette shops (since these are obviously places frequented only by smokers). Under that logic, you'd think they could allow some "smoking allowed" bars that are clearly signed so non-smokers are duely warned??

Heck, even if they assessed a yearly "fee" (TAX) to bar owners in order have a "smoking" establishment, they'd probably still lose less money that way and be able to stay in business at least. Then the state gets even more "sin" taxes. Everyone wins.

Oh, the other exception in the law is for theatre productions which allow for actors to smoke on stage. Perhaps some of the neighborhood bars should build stages and have "plays" where their customers could smoke, ha ha.

[MidniteBreeze]

Originally Posted by Auntie Bob

Even with that, the problem for a lot of them is, no space to build anything on.
The City Council recently granted Mitch's bar permission to not only put benches out in front of the bar but also, to let people take their drinks out with them.
As soon as that went through, The Kozy Bar asked for the same thing. My guess is, they won't get it.

So Mitch's got their permission? I never heard if they did or not. I'm sure a lot of places are going to be asking for the same thing now. I know some of the controversy over the Mich's was that some of the other businesses didn't want people out drinking/smoking right on the street (which I do understand). Mitch's had said they would have been happy to have a side door out to the parking lot but that they didn't have enough money to cut a hole in the building and put a door in. These are some things I think the state should make some conecessions for since they were the ones who imposed this law on everyone.

[Castaway]

A bar that has 10% of their business derived from cigar sales, is considered a cigar bar in NM. Smoking is permitted. But, if 10% or more of your business is derived from smokers, you cannot be a smoking bar.

[Auntie Bob]

Originally Posted by MidniteBreeze

So Mitch's got their permission?

Yes, they got permission. There is a limit on the number of people that can be out there at one time and I don't remember off hand how many it is but, at least it's something.

[Auntie Bob]

Originally Posted by MidniteBreeze

One exception the MN law makes is they still allow smoking in cigar/cigarette shops (since these are obviously places frequented only by smokers). Under that logic, you'd think they could allow some "smoking allowed" bars that are clearly signed so non-smokers are duely warned??

Oh, the other exception in the law is for theatre productions which allow for actors to smoke on stage. Perhaps some of the neighborhood bars should build stages and have "plays" where their customers could smoke, ha ha.

I wasn't aware of those exceptions. We don't have any cigar shops here but, maybe that's something for them to look into.

I don't see why there can't be 'smoking only' bars where the patrons and employees are well aware of the risks and choose to take them. That to me seems how things should work in a free market economy.

LOL...I loved that stage idea. You could do a 'smoking' set up just like karaoke and video tape it.

[MidniteBreeze]

"What light <puff> through yonder window breaks? <puff>..."

"Romeo, Romeo....Dude! You're on fire! Have another bud, why dotcha!"

[cardcr]

Being the liberal state that Maryland is it's going no smoking January 2008. They banned smoking in your own apartment and on your deck if you live in a townehome in Montgomery County Md. Pretty soon no drinking in bars if you leave it up to the cry babies. I know the bars in my county that do not allow smoking and which ones do. I go to what ever one I choose depending on how I feel. I have never smoked cigarettes but enjoy cigars. I do not mind second hand smoke but do not like the smell on my clothes, small price to pay. Anyway this whole issue stems from the liberal (I get a headache) types wanting to go to the "cool" bars and can't because they get a headache and don't want to go to the "other" non-smoking bar. So they ruin it for all to suit their own self centered needs.

[Auntie Bob]

Originally Posted by cardcr

Anyway this whole issue stems from the liberal (I get a headache) types wanting to go to the "cool" bars and can't because they get a headache and don't want to go to the "other" non-smoking bar. So they ruin it for all to suit their own self centered needs.

Well, I'm not sure "liberals" are really the cause of this one. I'm as liberal as they come, pretty much and I think it sucks.
I think it's the "it's all about me" types more than a political leaning. I'm pretty sure they come from both sides of the aisle.