Missouri...Southern or Midwestern? (St. Louis, Springfield: restaurant, to eat, places)

[ajf131]

I probably should have included "Missouri...Southern, Midwestern, or both?" in this title.....I guess both is probably closest to the truth when i think about it, especially in the case of the Southern half of Missouri.

[Robinseggblue]

Originally Posted by Plains10

Trust me, I know how cold it gets in NH. I can tolerate cold just fine, and I was there in January of 2004 when it was -30F in some areas. I like the cold and can not stand the very long summers and humidity of the lower Midwest and upper South.

I am glad that you like MO. Ava has a fairly good climate because it is located on the Ozark plateau which is higher in elevation. Temperatures can get cold there quite often in Ava. It can be as cold as -10F in the winter and can have some decent snowstorms depending on the year. Summer is very long and lasts from May until the end of September. Most of the time the temperatures are in the 80s and 90s in the summer.

I like the cold also, but it gets really outta hand when it's in the negative temps for weeks/months on end and you have to shovel snow outta the driveway constantly 'cause the PO won't deliver your mail and you can't get in or out of your garage even with 4-wheel drive. In CT we'd get 4 feet of snow overnight and had to get up at 5am to snow-blow the driveway in order to get to work. It is beautiful, but loads of work for lots of months. Hope you enjoy! Different strokes for different folks.

80s and 90s -- Great, I love those warm temps! I can once again go swimming without freezing my tush off!

[Robinseggblue]

Originally Posted by ajf131

If you love the south, most of Missouri is nothing like Middle Tennessee at the Kentucky border, nor, IMO is Missouri the true South. Most of the state definitely more like downstate Illinois, Central and Southern Indiana, and Central and Southern Ohio...it is not the Upper Midwest...it is, however, the Lower Midwest. However, the house that you have in Ava, Missouri, that part yes is definitely more like the South, around U.S. 60. ...

I agree with you that MO north of Hwy 60 is really more like more northerly states. However, it is definitely south of Wisconsin!

We used the USDA ag zone charts USNA - USDA Plant Hardiness Zone Map: South-Midwest US ( http://www.usna.usda.gov/Hardzone/hzm-sm1.html - broken link) to locate the areas we wanted to live in that are in the same range (Zone 6) as TN at KY border. This provided us with the weather patterns we like: some snow in the winter and a nice long summer. Then we selected the counties and towns that met certain parameters: within 1 hour of airport, had a SuperWalmart, rural, etc. Douglas County met those parameters nicely and falls in Zone 6. Then we searched online for homes that were on acreage and falling within a preset price-range. Our house-hunting trip consisted of staying in Branson and driving with our RE agent to a pre-determined list of 12 homes. The one we selected was in the middle of the pack but we knew right away that it was perfect for us.

[ajf131]

Originally Posted by Robinseggblue

I agree with you that MO north of Hwy 60 is really more like more northerly states. However, it is definitely south of Wisconsin!

We used the USDA ag zone charts USNA - USDA Plant Hardiness Zone Map: South-Midwest US ( http://www.usna.usda.gov/Hardzone/hzm-sm1.html - broken link) to locate the areas we wanted to live in that are in the same range (Zone 6) as TN at KY border. This provided us with the weather patterns we like: some snow in the winter and a nice long summer. Then we selected the counties and towns that met certain parameters: within 1 hour of airport, had a SuperWalmart, rural, etc. Douglas County met those parameters nicely and falls in Zone 6. Then we searched online for homes that were on acreage and falling within a preset price-range. Our house-hunting trip consisted of staying in Branson and driving with our RE agent to a pre-determined list of 12 homes. The one we selected was in the middle of the pack but we knew right away that it was perfect for us.

lol...how can I contest Missouri being south of Wisconsin? lol. Branson, Springfield, and Joplin when i was there have too many "Southernisms" to dismiss...first off, the Great Southern Bank I believe is headquartered in Springfield...lots of sweet tea, fried chicken, etc...the agriculture of southwest missouri had a lot of cornfields and dairy farms and typical midwestern trees, but i also know they have the industry of the Ozarks as well...coal mining, iron, ore, etc....they definitely lean toward the South, even though i didn't hear any accents, but i was only there for a day or two...in any case...I agree with you Robineggsblue It gets less Southern and more Midwestern the further north you go of highway 60. I think the only place where cotton grows is in the Missouri bootheel, which is DEFINITELY the South.

[ajf131]

Originally Posted by Robinseggblue

I agree with you that MO north of Hwy 60 is really more like more northerly states. However, it is definitely south of Wisconsin!

We used the USDA ag zone charts USNA - USDA Plant Hardiness Zone Map: South-Midwest US ( http://www.usna.usda.gov/Hardzone/hzm-sm1.html - broken link) to locate the areas we wanted to live in that are in the same range (Zone 6) as TN at KY border. This provided us with the weather patterns we like: some snow in the winter and a nice long summer. Then we selected the counties and towns that met certain parameters: within 1 hour of airport, had a SuperWalmart, rural, etc. Douglas County met those parameters nicely and falls in Zone 6. Then we searched online for homes that were on acreage and falling within a preset price-range. Our house-hunting trip consisted of staying in Branson and driving with our RE agent to a pre-determined list of 12 homes. The one we selected was in the middle of the pack but we knew right away that it was perfect for us.

That area of Missouri seems to really be the one on the rise right now, Robineggsblue. The population of Southern Missouri in the areas around U.S. 60 seems to be EXPLODING right now. Just by talks in this forum alone it seems that Joplin and Springfield and areas nearby are attracting people from as far away as California....meanwhile in the part of Missouri I'm in right now we're not experiencing that kind of growth. I always knew housing down there was cheap. I only expect the growth to continue into the future. Generally when I hear people talk about Missouri these days, the Ozark region and Southwest Missouri are what people are talking about, not St. Louis, KC, or the rest of the Northern half of Missouri. Apparently the fact has already been well established that Missouri does not = Kansas City and St. Louis. Illinois on the other hand apparently is having a harder time convincing people that Illinois does not = Chicago because it does not have anything interesting like Michigan, Minnesota, or Missouri in its rural areas accept the Shawnee National Forest, which is practically at the very bottom of the state.

[kcmojo]

Originally Posted by ajf131

I probably should have included "Missouri...Southern, Midwestern, or both?" in this title.....I guess both is probably closest to the truth when i think about it, especially in the case of the Southern half of Missouri.

You are right it is both. Depends on where you are standing. And you can not draw a straight line to mark where is what.

KC area definitely has more a plains states leaning. STL mostly Midwest. (They hardly know KC exists. Which is funny as KC has such hard STL envy.)

Ozarks leans more southern. The rest is very divided depending on the town/area and its history etc.

Kansas is deff plains state. High plains in the SW corner has a little South West leanings.

Nebraska all plains. Panhandle out these wants to be CO/WY but they are not.

Iowa mostly plains. Tricities more Midwest. Diff between plains states and Midwest is muddy.

Ok panhandle is high plains like TX panhandle and corner of KS. some is plains. Some wants to be southers, but they just okies.

Texas is more divided than they think they are. Eastern Texans lean southern and think all of Texas does. West Texas including the Panhandle leans South west. They are annoyed by the southern/east Texans. However they would rather be associated with them than the New Mexico crowd. NM is all South west.

CO is split up. Central/North/NW all Rockies. South leans South west. Ever been to Pueblo? Very SW. Far Eastern/NE has some plains states leanings. Very flat gas/cattle/and wheat country. Far SE corner forgotten about high plains w SW leaning. Very sparsely populated. Try Two Buttes on for size. The Who song 'I can see for miles and miles' written about that place. Only place i have been passed while driving over 100. More than once too.

All just my exp growing up and living here. Soooo IMHO

When I was a kid Springfield was like 6,000 ppl? 197?

[Robinseggblue]

Originally Posted by ajf131

...lots of sweet tea, fried chicken, etc...

Bring on the Sweet Tea! YUMMM... It's definitely something I miss here in WI.

[Northwoods Voyager]

I still like to think of my home state as being a Southern Midwestern state. Kinda brings the best of both worlds to this lovely, diverse piece of heaven. There seems to be so many postings on different threads from folks either getting ready, have already, wanting to, and wishing to, move to this enchanting setting in the middle of this country.

On a recent trip through only 12 states, mostly east and south, I will state firmly that we are indeed fortunate to reside here. However, I fell in love with Kentucky and Tennessee while driving through and stopping along the way. I do know that my paternal grandparents came to Missouri from that area. Maybe that is why I like it so much.

Of course I haven't lived there...so cannot say pro nor con regarding living conditions. But perhaps just as those that find their way here somewhere off the beaten path, that would be what I would want to do, also.

Having spent my childhood in the central west end and near there, I am so disheartened to find that the area has changed so much. And not in a good way. Only parts of the CWE are still attractive. The rest has just about turned into a slum district. Store fronts are boarded up. The back yards look as if a bomb had been dropped on them. It just about brought tears to my eyes.

So those of you that are coming to Missouri have evidently found the desirable niches of paradise. Oh, sure, before any St. Louis residents are offended by this post, I will say that I have not intended to offend. Just is the way I have seen my childhood home almost destroyed. Thomas Wolfe may have been right, ya can't go home, again. In my case it is because it does not exist any longer.

But here in the middle of the woods in a lake subdivision, I am lucky in many ways. Only problem, I am in a valley and have to walk or drive 'up the hill' as we call it to ever see one of the beautiful sunsets. The poster that has described his hilltop in southern MO. and his exciting trek to reach it is indeed fortunate. His hard work will pay off. I wish them all the best in the world as I do the many that choose to come here.

Just not too many okay, I AM JUST JOKING, REALLY, I AM.

[ajf131]

Well, I guess this settles it then. Missouri is both Southern and Midwestern....so I guess include it in both regions. The only reservations I have about this is including St. Louis, Columbia, Jeff City, and Kansas City and areas northwards in the South...they are definitely 100% Midwestern, at least STL and KC are...I don't see any way to really contest these cities not being part of the Midwest and being part of the South...there is nothing Southern about them now. They are every bit as Midwestern as Indianapolis, Cincy,and Columbus. Missouri I guess is a different story, because Springfield, Joplin, Cape Girardeau, and Sikeston are all definitely much more Southern than Midwestern. So I guess it's every Missourian for his/herself...kinda like the Civil War Missouri is truly the heart of it all, not Ohio

[lalainps]

Originally Posted by daisymae19

this article will explain JSTOR: Accessing JSTOR (broken link)

The *native* pronounciation is with an uh, the *outsiders ( or those whose parents came from other states)* is with an *ee*... oh and the ss is pronounced as a Z not an S...(btw I am a born and raised Hillbilly from the Ozarks with my Ozark roots going back to the 1830's..my family was original settlers in Osage, Gasconade, Pulaski, Camden and Laclede counties)

DaisyMae - I hate to differ with you but half my family has been in "The Bootheel" since the early 1800's and the other half were there waiting for them. We pronounce it Missoureeeeeeeee.