Missouri...Southern or Midwestern? (Columbia, Union: fence, permit, location)

[kshe95girl]

Originally Posted by jps

I thought it was first settled by the French.

The Kingdom of Callaway was an anomoly, there was some southern influence in the far Bootheel section of the state, but, by and large, its midwestern.
My family arrived in Mo in 1699, we have been there ever since. If they were from southern anywhere, it was from the south of France.

[jps]

Originally Posted by ajf131

It doesn't just lack accents, it lacks the culture, climate, and lifestyle as well. It doesn't strike me as being laid back and the cuisine is hardly what I would call Southern either. No sweet tea, no grits, nothing...and while there is barbeque and fried chicken, that cuisine is also pretty much present all across the nation. The cuisine isn't Southern, the climate isn't Southern. Today it's hardly any different from most of Illinois, Indiana, or Ohio. So if you can say it can be the South while lacking many of these characteristics, I guess I'm wasting my time even trying to present this to you. If I have to go more specific, I will, but I've got a life outside of this forum, so we may have to continue this debate later.

But...we drank sweet tea growing up. And we ate hominy, for chrissakes.


But really, I believe you are the only one that's debating anything. You started this thread, then made 130 odd posts repeating yourself, with a few backhands thrown in for good measure at anyone who dared to suggest Missouri may be southern. Whatever, it just seems to me that you're arguing minutiae and not even having a good time doing it. To each his own.


Are you related to a guy named Razzy?

[kshe95girl]

Originally Posted by jps

But...we drank sweet tea growing up. And we ate hominy, for chrissakes.

Sweetie, so did I, my mama was from Poplar Bluff. I grew up in Sainte Genevieve, daddy was from STL.
It takes a lot more than food, ya know? Sometimes we eat the foods of our forebears because thats all we have of them.
I still love cheese grits with all my heart, but that dont make me a Southerner, get my drift?
DH is a Florida native, he is simply apallled that anything Mo is consided Southern, its all in the perception.

[ajf131]

Originally Posted by jps

But...we drank sweet tea growing up. And we ate hominy, for chrissakes.


But really, I believe you are the only one that's debating anything. You started this thread, then made 130 odd posts repeating yourself, with a few backhands thrown in for good measure at anyone who dared to suggest Missouri may be southern. Whatever, it just seems to me that you're arguing minutiae and not even having a good time doing it. To each his own.


Are you related to a guy named Razzy?

Is that supposed to be an insult? Whatever. I honestly am not going to make it my mission to change your thinking. Just because one drinks sweet tea doesn't make you a Southerner. I drink it and brew it because I liked it so much the first time I tried it down in Arkansas. To be honest, people drink sweet tea in Terre Haute, Indiana. So call it Southern if you want, but it really doesn't meet the definition of it today. And that is a fact, not opinion. Besides, I've been to "Little Dixie" many times, plus I have also had relatives grow up there. Sweet tea is not a way of life there, it depends on the person, just like anywhere else.

[jps]

Originally Posted by ajf131

Is that supposed to be an insult? Whatever. I honestly am not going to make it my mission to change your thinking. Just because one drinks sweet tea doesn't make you a Southerner. I drink it and brew it because I liked it so much the first time I tried it down in Arkansas. To be honest, people drink sweet tea in Terre Haute, Indiana. So call it Southern if you want, but it really doesn't meet the definition of it today. And that is a fact, not opinion. Besides, I've been to "Little Dixie" many times, plus I have also had relatives grow up there. Sweet tea is not a way of life there, it depends on the person, just like anywhere else.

The sweet tea/hominy reference was subtle ridicule. Thanks for confirming my opinion of you by not catching it. Bonus points for letting it bother you enough to write another paragraph on it, even though you didn't get it.

If you didn't take yourself so seriously, other people might.

[jps]

Originally Posted by kshe95girl

Sweetie, so did I, my mama was from Poplar Bluff. I grew up in Sainte Genevieve, daddy was from STL.
It takes a lot more than food, ya know? Sometimes we eat the foods of our forebears because thats all we have of them.
I still love cheese grits with all my heart, but that dont make me a Southerner, get my drift?
DH is a Florida native, he is simply apallled that anything Mo is consided Southern, its all in the perception.

When I wrote:But...we drank sweet tea growing up. And we ate hominy, for chrissakes.

Followed by: But really, ...

As a reply to AFJ131, given the previous few posts between us, I thought it was obvious that I was: a) joking, and b) addressing afj131

I've lived in Florida for over twenty years, so I understand your hubby's provincialism.

For the record, I wouldn't eat cheese grits if I were starving. Don't like hominy either. Grew up on sweet tea but got over that decades ago. Coffee with splenda is about as close as I get.

And, yes, I know you're from Ste. Genevieve and all that other stuff you said, in case you thought I didn't read it the first few dozen times you said it....Sweetie.

[ajf131]

Originally Posted by jps

When I wrote:But...we drank sweet tea growing up. And we ate hominy, for chrissakes.

Followed by: But really, ...

As a reply to AFJ131, given the previous few posts between us, I thought it was obvious that I was: a) joking, and b) addressing afj131

I've lived in Florida for over twenty years, so I understand your hubby's provincialism.

For the record, I wouldn't eat cheese grits if I were starving. Don't like hominy either. Grew up on sweet tea but got over that decades ago. Coffee with splenda is about as close as I get.

And, yes, I know you're from Ste. Genevieve and all that other stuff you said, in case you thought I didn't read it the first few dozen times you said it....Sweetie.

Sorry jps, it's hard for me to pick up on jokes over the internet. In any case, I have reversed my position. It makes perfect sense I guess to grow up on sweet tea since your ancestors were Southern and Little Dixie had many Southern settlers. I guess the slight trouble I have with it is that my paternal grandfather's side of the family originally hailed from Georgia, and while he died well before I was born, my father said he was never raised on any type of Southern type of ways. But I guess everyone is different. Looking at Little Dixie today there is nothing Southern about it that I have seen, and I have been to the area many times given St. Louis isn't too far away. In addition, I guess it just sort of contradicts everything my father told me about Mexico, Missouri, which is part of Little Dixie, and a place where he lived in for four years...my grandmother grew up there, and while her parents were German immigrants, she always said that everyone she grew up with was Midwestern, although she herself always struck me as being much more of a Southerner, but that was mainly because she had been living in Louisiana for almost 30 years by the time she died about six years ago. Neither my father nor my grandmother ever really talked about Southern culture in Little Dixie. I hope this clears things up and allows me to be taken more seriously.

[breeze823]

Originally Posted by ajf131

It doesn't just lack accents, it lacks the culture, climate, and lifestyle as well. It doesn't strike me as being laid back and the cuisine is hardly what I would call Southern either. No sweet tea, no grits, nothing...and while there is barbeque and fried chicken, that cuisine is also pretty much present all across the nation. The cuisine isn't Southern, the climate isn't Southern. Today it's hardly any different from most of Illinois, Indiana, or Ohio. So if you can say it can be the South while lacking many of these characteristics, I guess I'm wasting my time even trying to present this to you. If I have to go more specific, I will, but I've got a life outside of this forum, so we may have to continue this debate later.

What exactly is a "southern climate"? The climate is different all across the south and while living in Missouri, the climate was much like here, although a tiny bit colder in the winter (sw Mo).

[ajf131]

Originally Posted by breeze823

What exactly is a "southern climate"? The climate is different all across the south and while living in Missouri, the climate was much like here, although a tiny bit colder in the winter (sw Mo).

A Southern climate I would classify as the following....mild winters, extremely hot summers, and an early spring and a late fall. Missouri's differs from the South in the sense that its winters can be quite cold and also most of the state sees significant snowfall. Missouri has a humid continental climate. Southern climates are more humid subtropical. Kentucky, while it is a Southern state, actually fits into the humid continental climate criteria better because its winters are cold and snow is not uncommon there. Southwest Missouri's climate is more like the South, I will agree on that although ice and snow are not uncommon there and monitoring it on a yearly basis it does get pretty cold there, although not nearly to the same degree as here.

[breeze823]

Originally Posted by ajf131

A Southern climate I would classify as the following....mild winters, extremely hot summers, and an early spring and a late fall. Missouri's differs from the South in the sense that its winters can be quite cold and also most of the state sees significant snowfall. Missouri has a humid continental climate. Southern climates are more humid subtropical. Kentucky, while it is a Southern state, actually fits into the humid continental climate criteria better because its winters are cold and snow is not uncommon there. Southwest Missouri's climate is more like the South, I will agree on that although ice and snow are not uncommon there and monitoring it on a yearly basis it does get pretty cold there, although not nearly to the same degree as here.

You are such a stickler on our nations borders that they should put you on border security