Missouri...Southern or Midwestern? (St. Louis, Springfield: station, radio, courses)

[ajf131]

Originally Posted by GetmeoutofAR

Im firmly beleive that anything north of I-44 is in the midwest and anything south is in the south. This is due to the way the weather systems run

I have to disagree. Yes, the weather systems tend to follow I-44, but the storms spread out in a radius that can extend up to 150 miles to the east and to the west. Most of Southern Missouri sees several snowstorms during the winter.

[OA 5599]

Originally Posted by ajf131

I have to disagree. Yes, the weather systems tend to follow I-44, but the storms spread out in a radius that can extend up to 150 miles to the east and to the west. Most of Southern Missouri sees several snowstorms during the winter.

Winter weather gets colder quick as you go north in Missouri. I went to college in Rolla, and it was noticeably colder and snowier in the winter compared to where I grew up, only 70 miles south in Howell County. I thought it may have just been my own perception, but after checking the averages, the average high and low temps in January and December are about 4 degrees lower for Rolla. Average high/low temps in the summer are within one degree. In Rolla, we nearly always got more snow than places not that much farther to the south, but the ice storms were never as bad.

[ajf131]

Originally Posted by OA 5599

Winter weather gets colder quick as you go north in Missouri. I went to college in Rolla, and it was noticeably colder and snowier in the winter compared to where I grew up, only 70 miles south in Howell County. I thought it may have just been my own perception, but after checking the averages, the average high and low temps in January and December are about 4 degrees lower for Rolla. Average high/low temps in the summer are within one degree. In Rolla, we nearly always got more snow than places not that much farther to the south, but the ice storms were never as bad.

That's still not a sufficient explanation for the north/south climatological boundary. Cape Girardeau and pretty much all of Southern Missouri sees a reasonable amount of snow. It doesn't matter if winter weather gets colder quick or not...this is still not a good description of the difference between midwestern and southern weather. Most of Southern Missouri has more severe winters than the Upper South.

[GetmeoutofAR]

I-44 is the great climate boundary. It marks the southernmost penetration of deep cold air in the midwest. It separates the humid subtropical climate from the continental climate.

Originally Posted by ajf131

That's still not a sufficient explanation for the north/south climatological boundary. Cape Girardeau and pretty much all of Southern Missouri sees a reasonable amount of snow. It doesn't matter if winter weather gets colder quick or not...this is still not a good description of the difference between midwestern and southern weather. Most of Southern Missouri has more severe winters than the Upper South.

[ajf131]

Originally Posted by GetmeoutofAR

I-44 is the great climate boundary. It marks the southernmost penetration of deep cold air in the midwest. It separates the humid subtropical climate from the continental climate.

Oh really? Explain to me how Cape Girardeau is capable of getting as low as 10 in the wintertime then. Or how it gets up to 10 inches of snow per year. Climates are not the definition of the north and south, nor is a simple road. The winter storms have a tendency to follow the path of interstate 44, but virtually all of Missouri has real winters and real summers. Give me evidence that I-44 is the great climatalogical boundary and I'll believe you. Plains10 has great knowledge of meteorology as do I...he puts 3/4 of Missouri in the humid continental climate category. If anything south of I-44 is humid subtropical, I can say that it certainly is not the cultural south.

[GetmeoutofAR]

Ive many times watched arctic fronts decend out of the plains and stall at I-44. It is very difficult to push out that warn humid air south of that boundary. Also how does Springfield average around 20 inches of snow a year and Cape G only 10? They are at the very same lattitude are they not? Any thing south of the Ohio River is also in the south, untill you get to Lexington then go straight east and anything south of there is in the south. Southern Illinois is mostly in the south mainly because of it's elevation. South of St. Louis (places like Farmington) are right on the boundary. Basically. If you are north of I-44 from Joplin to Lebanon and then south of areas East from Lebanon to Edgar Springs,MO to Farmington, MO over to Shaneetown, IL you are in the south. Springfield is technically in the south as I consider most of the Ozarks to be in the south. Missouri's Osage plains are NOT in the south, those start north and west of Springfield. Tulsa is not in the south. STL is not in the south. Louisville KY is in the south, Lexington is not but sits right on the boundary.

Originally Posted by ajf131

Oh really? Explain to me how Cape Girardeau is capable of getting as low as 10 in the wintertime then. Or how it gets up to 10 inches of snow per year. Climates are not the definition of the north and south, nor is a simple road. The winter storms have a tendency to follow the path of interstate 44, but virtually all of Missouri has real winters and real summers. Give me evidence that I-44 is the great climatalogical boundary and I'll believe you. Plains10 has great knowledge of meteorology as do I...he puts 3/4 of Missouri in the humid continental climate category. If anything south of I-44 is humid subtropical, I can say that it certainly is not the cultural south.

[GraniteStater]

Most of Missouri has a Humid Continental climate. The NW 1/4 of MO is solidly in the Plains category IMO. The southeast 1/3 of MO has more of a humid subtropical climate and does not get very cold in the winter at all. A good judge of climate is the total number of days per winter that a location records a temperature below zero in the middle part of the country. Southeast MO rarely sees subzero temperatures while the rest of the state sees temperatures that low more often.
On a different note, I can really tell the difference in the sun angle when I visit family in the Kansas City metro area. The latitude is quite low (below 39N) and the sun is far higher in the sky for a much longer period of time. The seasons at THAT LATITUDE are also much more muted compared with where I now live at over 43N. An example... the sunrise was before 5AM in July and now the sunset is around 5:45 in mid-October.

[ajf131]

Originally Posted by GraniteStater

Most of Missouri has a Humid Continental climate. The NW 1/4 of MO is solidly in the Plains category IMO. The southeast 1/3 of MO has more of a humid subtropical climate and does not get very cold in the winter at all. A good judge of climate is the total number of days per winter that a location records a temperature below zero in the middle part of the country. Southeast MO rarely sees subzero temperatures while the rest of the state sees temperatures that low more often.
On a different note, I can really tell the difference in the sun angle when I visit family in the Kansas City metro area. The latitude is quite low (below 39N) and the sun is far higher in the sky for a much longer period of time. The seasons at THAT LATITUDE are also much more muted compared with where I now live at over 43N. An example... the sunrise was before 5AM in July and now the sunset is around 5:45 in mid-October.

Plains, is that you????

[ajf131]

Originally Posted by GetmeoutofAR

Ive many times watched arctic fronts decend out of the plains and stall at I-44. It is very difficult to push out that warn humid air south of that boundary. Also how does Springfield average around 20 inches of snow a year and Cape G only 10? They are at the very same lattitude are they not? Any thing south of the Ohio River is also in the south, untill you get to Lexington then go straight east and anything south of there is in the south. Southern Illinois is mostly in the south mainly because of it's elevation. South of St. Louis (places like Farmington) are right on the boundary. Basically. If you are north of I-44 from Joplin to Lebanon and then south of areas East from Lebanon to Edgar Springs,MO to Farmington, MO over to Shaneetown, IL you are in the south. Springfield is technically in the south as I consider most of the Ozarks to be in the south. Missouri's Osage plains are NOT in the south, those start north and west of Springfield. Tulsa is not in the south. STL is not in the south. Louisville KY is in the south, Lexington is not but sits right on the boundary.

This is the most ridiculous way of classifying the south I've ever seen, and doesn't coincide with cultural boundaries nor does it coincide with agricultural life or settlement patterns. The Ozarks are HALF in the Midwest, half in the South. They retain many Midwestern characteristics, such as the trees and tallgrass prairie plus the many dairy farms and while they are not as numerous as in the Interior Plains, cornfields as well. In addition, the Southern accent is present in less than 1/3 of the Ozarks in Missouri. Southern Illinois and all of Southern Missouri normally see at least 10 inches of snow a year...again, that is above what most of Kentucky or any of the Upper South for that matter sees. Lexington is most certainly in the South...the way of life and the speech patterns are unquestionably Southern. Southern Illinois and Southern Missouri are cultural melting pots. The Ozarks contain elements of both the Midwest and the South.

[GetmeoutofAR]

I am basing my reasoning for what is south or not along climatic boundaries not on cultural lines or accents. But, I do beleive cultural/accent boundaries follow these same lines. I think we can all agree on that