Missouri...Southern or Midwestern? (St. Louis, Joplin: title, boundaries, identifying)
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Um, I said the STL area, not SG....one can still hear the German speech pattern in SG right now, but thats the exception, not the rule.
I speak to people all the time from all over MO, I only hear the southern accent become apparent when they come from the Bootheel area.
Ocala and a great swath of the surrounding rural area is very much Southern, all the way up to the FL/GA border, all the way over to the Gulf, and up into the Panhandle.
It only becomes Yankeefied south of Leesburg, and when one hits the Daytona area.
You are speaking of S FL with the Spanish and Creole, no problem with that in Central FL at all.
I'm sure that will one day change. Especially if the illegals are granted amnesty, Florida will see a bigger flood of them.
I can pick out alot of people from STL because of their nasal speech for lack of a better description. Once again on my side of the state one can't claim a majority of southern culture until one is at least halfway through Cape County headed South, and even then there are pockets that are 100% either direction. The village I live near has a Baptist church with many Scotch-Irish & English families living in the area. Go five miles southeast of me and the area is nearly 100% German & Lutheran. Completely different feel & connected only because both places are very focused on rural culture.
I have noticed that several people of German descent in my area that no longer identify with the Midwest & identify more strongly with the South as well. Not sure how common of a trend this is.
Speaking of Cape Girardeau, I go there to work every day and I must say that when college is out the town is probably 60-70% Southern in my estimation. However, many students at the university there are from STL, and the town's feel changes greatly during the school year. Also as I've stated before, south Cape feels much more southern than north Cape. It's crazy how much of a different feel that a town of that size can have (38,000 people).
Well the German accent was always present in places like Ste Gen since the 1860s. Of course I wasn't alive then, but politically and that Missouri was a lot more southern before the 1940s. MO was always lumped in with the "solid south." Also in the early 1900s there was segregation stuff passed, and voting literacy and poll tax very nearly passed in MO. Also in a some books I've read about Missouri when they were coming up with a state flag for MO 100 years ago, they almost put the Roman Cross from the MO Confederate battle flag in it but it was scrapped at the last minute and the design by Marie Oliver stayed the same.
It seems as the 1930s came, world war two and industialization of St. Louis and other areas of the state began to change things.
MO was a lot different 100 years ago.
However it seems the last 5 or so years the state is starting to change and becoming more conservative again. I hope it stays that way and hopefully we can get the Confederate battle flags restored that One term Bob Holden had taken down.
You live in Ocala right? Now that is old time south in those small old central, north Florida cities. However the rest of Florida has been ate up by urbanization.
It seems the state totally changes when you head south of Orlando. Not to be offensive but south of there is seems hardly anyone speaks English. It's either Spanish or Creol and it's a pain when going anywhere when you get service and the person has hard time understanding English.
Thats another thing. It seem in Florida Orlando, to just north of Tampa is a dividing line just like Cape Girardeau is for Missouri. In the winter it seems when you get passed Orlando there is a sharp temperature contrast. Above Orlando it gets colder, South is warmer. Could have to do with the elevations too as South Florida is as flat as a pancake.
EVERYTHING AND EVERYWHERE were a lot different 100 years ago......
Quote:
Originally Posted by kshe95girl
Um, I said the STL area, not SG....one can still hear the German speech pattern in SG right now, but thats the exception, not the rule.
I speak to people all the time from all over MO, I only hear the southern accent become apparent when they come from the Bootheel area.
Ocala and a great swath of the surrounding rural area is very much Southern, all the way up to the FL/GA border, all the way over to the Gulf, and up into the Panhandle.
It only becomes Yankeefied south of Leesburg, and when one hits the Daytona area.
You are speaking of S FL with the Spanish and Creole, no problem with that in Central FL at all.
I can pick out alot of people from STL because of their nasal speech for lack of a better description. Once again on my side of the state one can't claim a majority of southern culture until one is at least halfway through Cape County headed South, and even then there are pockets that are 100% either direction. The village I live near has a Baptist church with many Scotch-Irish & English families living in the area. Go five miles southeast of me and the area is nearly 100% German & Lutheran. Completely different feel & connected only because both places are very focused on rural culture.
I have noticed that several people of German descent in my area that no longer identify with the Midwest & identify more strongly with the South as well. Not sure how common of a trend this is.
Speaking of Cape Girardeau, I go there to work every day and I must say that when college is out the town is probably 60-70% Southern in my estimation. However, many students at the university there are from STL, and the town's feel changes greatly during the school year. Also as I've stated before, south Cape feels much more southern than north Cape. It's crazy how much of a different feel that a town of that size can have (38,000 people).
Cape has always been like that, I lived there for a year back in 81 while I was in school, stayed there for the summer, the difference was amazing!
Not sure about your question about southern Germans, havent run across that particular brand of Missourian in my travels about the state.
Cape has always been like that, I lived there for a year back in 81 while I was in school, stayed there for the summer, the difference was amazing!
Not sure about your question about southern Germans, havent run across that particular brand of Missourian in my travels about the state.
Texas hill country has a lot of Germans.
I think what he means is they identify with the South because of their location. Scott County's location is more southern, not really midwesterm as they're across from KY and near TN as well.
I think what he means is they identify with the South because of their location. Scott County's location is more southern, not really midwesterm as they're across from KY and near TN as well.
Regardless, when driving south on I44 out of Stl places like Crawford County, Phelps county, southern Franklin county it has a totally different feel to it and you can tell it's a transition zone as you head south places like Crawford, Washington county definatly do have somewhat southernish feel to them. I've drivin in other midwest states and I don't get the same feeling in IL, IN. Like the map I posted that divided missouri half midwestern, and half tansition zone and dixie you can feel it. Like driving down I55 when you get outside of Arnold and get into rural Jefferson county outside of the MS river areas and into western JEff county.
And its not just rural because its nothing like on the other side of the river in the rural farmlands across the bridge in rural IL. When you get away from the river areas it changes.
Same if for Ste Gen. Neighboring St. Francis county has a high protestant population compared to Ste Gen thats near the river.
I44 is a good highway to use for example because it goes SW and you gradually can see the transition from midwestern to dixie by the time you approach Springfield.
Here is a nice video. On youtube reading comments on videos about MO and Confederacy there are a good number of posters who have ancestors from Missouri who fought for the stars and bars.
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