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so tell me what front leg kick is going to have anything on it? explain to me how a front leg kick could/would be used in any form other then a set up? do boxers use their jab to KO other fighters? they use it as a set up. a kick with the front leg (ie push kick) is there for 2 things, to set up something else or to give yourself space to "regroup". there is no credible attack that even remotely centers on the use of the front leg other then those 2 reasons.
so the round kick is slower, slower then what? a weak side kick? in a mma fight, i would take a slow power shot that i know is 90% going to land and cause some damage then a weak side kick or front kick that will land but will do little to no damage.
cung le is a sanshou fighter (strictly sanshou) and he rarely if ever uses a side kick or front kick except to set something else up. he didnt use a series of side kicks to break frank shamrocks arm, that was a quick round kick and nothing else.
i train thai boxing, BJJ (my fav), some judo, sambo, boxing, TKD (when i was a kid before i realized it was relatively useless) and JKD for years.
so tell me what front leg kick is going to have anything on it? explain to me how a front leg kick could/would be used in any form other then a set up? do boxers use their jab to KO other fighters? they use it as a set up. a kick with the front leg (ie push kick) is there for 2 things, to set up something else or to give yourself space to "regroup". there is no credible attack that even remotely centers on the use of the front leg other then those 2 reasons.
so the round kick is slower, slower then what? a weak side kick? in a mma fight, i would take a slow power shot that i know is 90% going to land and cause some damage then a weak side kick or front kick that will land but will do little to no damage.
cung le is a sanshou fighter (strictly sanshou) and he rarely if ever uses a side kick or front kick except to set something else up. he didnt use a series of side kicks to break frank shamrocks arm, that was a quick round kick and nothing else.
i train thai boxing, BJJ (my fav), some judo, sambo, boxing, TKD (when i was a kid before i realized it was relatively useless) and JKD for years.
While I agree with this,I do see tkd being useful.I have seen Josh Barnett land reverse sidekicks in many of his mma fights,effectively.Head kicks are nothing more than a tkd round kick.While other martial arts use these kicks they do work in mma fights.Tkd is very helpful in a street fight also and sidekicks can be used to stun your opponent very easily
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Originally Posted by CA central coast
Why does a BJJ master need wrestling? .
At least from my years of training in both styles and from observation of high level MMA athlete. I view it necessary for extensive knowledge both. Look wrestling is very good for the take-downs and control on the ground aspects of the fight game. I mean I been training BJJ for about 12 years now and it still hard to sweep most wrestlers because their balance is usually excellent. Plus even though wrestlers do leave there are arms/necks out there for an arm-bars/triangles (at least at the being of training BJJ) it still no picnic to finish most of them. Of course let look at when I good wrestler gets a BJJ guy to the ground and is on top in a MMA match. Usually it end up being a ground and pound match and with gravity on the wrestler side those punches and elbow that are thrown just have that more power behind them. (while I not fought in a MMA match, I have in the past help a couple of guys get ready for their fights, and let me tell you even going "light" those shot can rock you.)
Of course that not saying the BJJ guys is doomed. When you Train BJJ you do a lot of training from the back and the JJ player can create some offense from that position. Sometimes a opponent on top over extends or place there weight wrong that opens up an opportunity for the JJ player a change to a more dominant/submission position. Also BJJ will teach you submission to end a fight. This just adds to your arsenal ways to finish your opponent from both the top position and bottom positions. Basically your less one dimensional and it can/will make it harder for your opponent to predict your fight game plan. Lastly Bjj does teach some control positions (on top) that wrestling really does not get into. Like knee on belly and mount. Granted wrestlers do have the grapevine which is loosely similar to mount but the level of control and to create offense from there is not on the same level.
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Why Greco more than freestyle?
I think knowing free/folk style is just fine for MMA. Knowing any basic wrestling can't hurt your chances at a win. But I think greco allows you to get in a good grappling/take-down position with less chance of taking one on the chin. What I mean is I think now-a-days shooting in on an opponent is pretty risky overall. A good well prepared opponent would probably practice the basic sprawl. It a very simple move to learn and getting the timing is just a matter of practice. And if you shoot and that opponent does sprawl on you and stops your forward momentum, your open for knees, punches, and maybe even a soccer kick. Plus on top of this you putting a lot of energy in to the shot if you keep doing it eventually you'll get tired. While with Greco I think you can maneuver (closing the distance) in for a take down with a little less energy and less of a chance to take a shot that will end the fight. Granted greco is hard to learn (at least from my experience) because the game is about making good angles with in margins of errors that are measured millimeters. Plus just being able to feeling where your opponents weight when your in a tight clinch takes a lot of time and practice. But the pay off of being able to control the take-down is worth all the work.
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Why would a muy thai specialist need to work on his boxing? Why those 4 disciplines? How are they all incorporated into someone's game?
I'll defer that to someone that has more experience with the two arts than I have. I have a very rudimentary understanding of both.
Thanks for the info. So what I'm hearing is that boxing as applied to MMA is for it's footwork and certain punches which muy thai doesn't offer? Right. Because we all know or hear that the tradition boxing stance doesn't work in MMA. You see all the time in interviews guys saying they are working or need to work their "boxing". That's what led me to believe that muy thai is lacking in areas when it comes to throwing hands.
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