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Old 07-25-2007, 04:31 AM
 
121 posts, read 361,659 times
Reputation: 73

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Those interested in moving to Montana that wonder why we Montanans are so concerned about the changes the influx of people moving here has brought and continues to bring should read this article:

“Blue state, red state, your state, my state” (broken link)


Then ask yourself; are you part of the problem too? Have you learned anything from living in the place you are fleeing, like how to do things differently here so as not to ruin Montana in the same ways? For many, I seriously doubt you have.

"Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results."--an old adage that seems to apply to many moving here. They think the geography will provide a change for them when actually they need to change themselves--their attitudes, beliefs and expectations, in order to not recreate the problems they are fleeing.
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Old 07-25-2007, 06:39 AM
 
Location: LEAVING CD
22,952 posts, read 22,560,704 times
Reputation: 15493
Nice, obviously written by a right wing ideologue. What I am missing is other than the lack of regulation how does the following apply to MT?

Rational Californians looked around and said, “hey, let’s move to a state where there are jobs, where I can run my business without a phonebook of regulations, where the state won’t take all my money in taxes, and I can send my kids to safe schools that teach math instead of transgendered sensitivity.” You know, we call them “red states.”

Maybe the writer would like to think that MT doesn't tax people to death or that people from other states look at MT job market with envy but I doubt it.
What I do see here is safety and clean air, and unless gang families move here the safety thing shouldn't change. As for the clean air thing, that could change by adding more cars but I can almost guarantee you that the cars that come here run cleaner than many,many of the cars already here. Maybe because where they are from they have those dreaded regulations on pollutants that a car can put out.
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Old 07-25-2007, 10:13 AM
 
40 posts, read 174,526 times
Reputation: 29
Too, how many Montanans leave the state to make their money elsewhere? Why do you think that is? Maybe we need a higher minimum wage here, more taxes (Oh, my gosh I said it!) so we can have some better services and pay our civil servants a decent, competitive salary. With such a high rate of small businesses where the owners declare their income and take losses on so many things and even get earned income credit, what can we expect. We need accountability.

As far as changing things, people moving do that in many places. When I tell the folks where we used to live how Californians are mocked and spurned here, they just laugh. Our school system back east has 164 different languages spoken. Kids wear turbans or burkas. I have mentioned Florida's change in other posts.

This isolationism is sickening. People from all parts of the country have fought and are fighting for all of us, not just those from their state of birth. So many people here complain about government and regulations, yet they take their subsidies, thank you very much. The people here who complain about outsiders coming in are not making the money off of them. You don't hear complaints from the local developers. And, no, they are not all from California.
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Old 07-25-2007, 10:48 AM
 
68 posts, read 218,294 times
Reputation: 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by jenzebel View Post
Those interested in moving to Montana that wonder why we Montanans are so concerned about the changes the influx of people moving here has brought and continues to bring should read this article:

“Blue state, red state, your state, my state” (broken link)


Then ask yourself; are you part of the problem too? Have you learned anything from living in the place you are fleeing, like how to do things differently here so as not to ruin Montana in the same ways? For many, I seriously doubt you have.

"Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results."--an old adage that seems to apply to many moving here. They think the geography will provide a change for them when actually they need to change themselves--their attitudes, beliefs and expectations, in order to not recreate the problems they are fleeing.

good reading. thx. but i myself have given up on voting. have you ever thought that they are rigged. waist of time to vote if you know someone high high up is making all of the decisions anyhow...
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Old 07-25-2007, 01:12 PM
AKS
 
10 posts, read 30,672 times
Reputation: 10
Good thought but... It is our given right to vote , it being republican or democrate atleast we can say we gave it our best shot
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Old 07-25-2007, 01:56 PM
 
5 posts, read 11,888 times
Reputation: 14
Default Isolationism?

"This isolationism is sickening. People from all parts of the country have fought and are fighting for all of us, not just those from their state of birth. So many people here complain about government and regulations, yet they take their subsidies, thank you very much. The people here who complain about outsiders coming in are not making the money off of them. You don't hear complaints from the local developers. And, no, they are not all from California."

When I fought for my country, I was fighting for my way of life. My way of life is rural MT. So now you left wing people who have already screwed up your "way of life" come to mine and screw it up.

And I don't think the people on this forum are complaining about outsiders so much as outsiders coming in and changing things they way they think it should be.

If you liked the way things are going from where you're from, why don't you go back there? Instead you look at MT, say how nice things are and how much you want to live here yet the first thing you try to do is change things to suit you. Now that wouldn't be so bad, but why try to change things to the very things you left behind?

And no, the local developers aren't all from CA - they also come from every other state in the union.

Go home, or fit in with my way of life - you know, the one YOU invaded.
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Old 07-25-2007, 02:24 PM
AKS
 
10 posts, read 30,672 times
Reputation: 10
Absolutely
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Old 07-25-2007, 08:48 PM
 
40 posts, read 174,526 times
Reputation: 29
Wrote a long reply about discrimination, but the computer ate it. With all of the conflict in this world, you are making some where there shouldn't be any. INVADED? Get real. So everyone who leaves Montana is invading their new state? Those who work elsewhere are enjoying the benefits provided by others who fought for higher wages and better working conditions. People all over the country are supporting the many subsidies provided to so many here and elsewhere. You don't seem to have a problem with that.

What about the Native Americans? Do you think their way of life changed?

You must be a teenager.
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Old 07-31-2007, 05:14 AM
 
121 posts, read 361,659 times
Reputation: 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by jimj View Post
Nice, obviously written by a right wing ideologue. What I am missing is other than the lack of regulation how does the following apply to MT?

Rational Californians looked around and said, “hey, let’s move to a state where there are jobs, where I can run my business without a phonebook of regulations, where the state won’t take all my money in taxes, and I can send my kids to safe schools that teach math instead of transgendered sensitivity.” You know, we call them “red states.”
How it applies to Montana is that the very people that move here because their state is "ruined" are just moving here, recreating what they say they don't want and in the process are ruining Montana.
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Old 07-31-2007, 06:28 AM
 
121 posts, read 361,659 times
Reputation: 73
Quote:
Originally Posted by mandapanda View Post
Wrote a long reply about discrimination, but the computer ate it. With all of the conflict in this world, you are making some where there shouldn't be any. INVADED? Get real. So everyone who leaves Montana is invading their new state? Those who work elsewhere are enjoying the benefits provided by others who fought for higher wages and better working conditions. People all over the country are supporting the many subsidies provided to so many here and elsewhere. You don't seem to have a problem with that.

What about the Native Americans? Do you think their way of life changed?

You must be a teenager.
Actually, the person who wrote the essay I linked to is a professor of political science at Central Washington University. He doesn't appear to be a teenager.

Subsidies, I didn't write anything about subsidies.

The Native American argument is really off-subject and it is being used here as justification to personally attack me. You know nothing about my genealogy and heritage yet you are implying that my ancestors are all Europeans who destroyed some Native cultures and are using that assumption to argue that I have no right to complain about the current destruction of rural Montana culture. Wow, you win the twisted logic award.

Native Americans' lifestyles have changed but guess what, it wasn't through anything I did. You want to talk discrimination--you have discriminated against me by assuming I only have European ancestors and by assuming my European ancestors, along with other European immigrants of the time, were all responsible for destroying Native American cultures. I have Native American ancestors too and they experienced the loss of culture and Europeans in my linage supported Native cultures, even adapted some Native cultural practices. You need to re-visit American History if you think that no Europeans were supportive of Native Americans and their struggles. Did Native Americans like their losing their culture--of course not. Do I like losing the culture here in Montana--of course not.
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