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I have been in MT for a few years and I have to say, this State is horrible for dating if you are a single guy. The male to female ratio is like 4:1. Women seem to be really picky when it comes to dating which puts most guys at a disadvantage.
It seems like most women around here get married right after high school and start having kids. By the time the women are 30, a lot of them are divorced with kids from different fathers. What really grinds my gears is that those women have super high expectations in what they are looking for in a guy. That demand this and that, but what do they have to offer?
If you aren't born and raised in this State, a lot of women will look down on you and will not date you, period. I was told this from a MT born and raised gal. MT is notorious for being a very cliquey place. If you aren't part of the clique then good luck.
I know a lot of people have a fantasy about moving out west and living in rustic MT, but it comes at a price. If you aren't married and move here, you will probably end up being lonely and single for the rest of your time here. Women in general aren't very friendly or open to meeting or dating "outsiders."
Get away from the bars and the selection improves drastically.
My wife came from the other end of the state from where I live. I didn't get married until I was 29 and she was 25.
The quality is there, and there are sufficent decent women, but you aren't going to find the smorgasborg of unattached and desperate women you'll find in Seattle or LA for sure.
Montana women at all ages tend to be independent minded. I'm surprised by your comment that they are "all married young". That is opposite of my observation of friends & family. But maybe I tend to know people from families who stress getting a college education & a career start first, which winds up with marriages occurring after age 26. The married young seems more prevalent in the Midwest, where young ladies unmarried at 24 are rare and 40 year old grandmothers common.
Single professionals over 30 in Montana are usually considered "a catch" by either sex with plenty of buttinskis actively introducing prospective dates to each other.
Small farm communities might maintain a collective thought that marriage out of high school is the norm similar to the Midwest. Is that the issue?
I have been in MT for a few years and I have to say, this State is horrible for dating if you are a single guy. The male to female ratio is like 4:1. Women seem to be really picky when it comes to dating which puts most guys at a disadvantage.
It seems like most women around here get married right after high school and start having kids. By the time the women are 30, a lot of them are divorced with kids from different fathers. What really grinds my gears is that those women have super high expectations in what they are looking for in a guy. That demand this and that, but what do they have to offer?
If you aren't born and raised in this State, a lot of women will look down on you and will not date you, period. I was told this from a MT born and raised gal. MT is notorious for being a very cliquey place. If you aren't part of the clique then good luck.
I know a lot of people have a fantasy about moving out west and living in rustic MT, but it comes at a price. If you aren't married and move here, you will probably end up being lonely and single for the rest of your time here. Women in general aren't very friendly or open to meeting or dating "outsiders."
I'm considering moving to Montana and I am a single guy, although older than you, now late 30s, and have thought about the entire dating situation there, myself. What you wrote could easily be applied to the city of Seattle. Ironically, your same post has been made on the Seattle forum many times. Seattle is a city where men truly do outnumber women and many of the men have a lot of cash to blow. Washington has a lot of single mothers, I am surprised by how many, for a so-called progressive state. You will probably find most of the country has the epidemic of single mothers, its not limited to Montana.
Now, from reading your previous thread with same complaints I have discovered you live in some backwoodsy , small town up in the Hi-Line of MOntana. I mean seriously? What small town in rural America is the situation different from what you describe? I don't care if you are in rural New York or rural Texas or rural France. People in small towns who stick around do so because they married young, had family and have strong ties to these little towns.
WHat you need to do is quit your job in NoWheresVille, Montana and move to a place where this is younger women. Small towns are really tough places for single women to survive. If you consider Montana with its harsh winters, where exactly do you think these single women are going to make a living? Chopping stone, hauling loads in a blizzard, working on a ranch, or other physically demanding jobs are not the kind of job most single 20 something girls will do, but are common in rural towns. There can only be so many service and desk type jobs in a small rural town as well.
I am in a similar situation to you, being single with no good friends in a place I hate, except I am in a big metropolitan area and utterly hate it. Indeed, I could live with being single, but the lack of friends is a tougher nut to crack. Men in Seattle are as hard to know as women. I've grown up in Oregon in smaller to moderate size towns and also lived in Portland back when it was more like a big town versus the overgrown metro it is now. I will say that I loathe Seattle and find the snotty, ultra-liberal, condescending, judgmental and fake people, especially the women, to be nerve-wracking. It is hard to get involved in community stuff or network in a big city. I think a small Montana city would be a much better environment. But, if the town gets too small, well you will be out of luck anywhere on the Earth.
I'm at the point now where I rather be single and poor than be stuck in this rat-race of soulless drones who think being stuck in a cubicle is heaven. Wining and dining at fancy restaurants, clubbing and living the yuppie lifestyle is something I also do not desire.
I think Montana has some potential and you do have to put yourself out there. Bars are not totally a bad idea if they are not overly divey and rough. However, just going to bars is pretty useless. Being Jewish, I will not have the luxury of a church community, but if you are at all Christian, consider it. If you are not Christian or Pagan/Atheistic, move to places with other heathens.
I am considering Missoula, Kalispell, Bozeman and maybe a few other places. After hearing some stuff about Billings, I may pass on that, but it may be an option for you.
From reading your posts, I think you should consider living in Missoula. Take a pay cut if you must. Who wants to make a fortune living on a deserted island? Have you ever read the book The Little Prince?
From reading your posts, I think you should consider living in Missoula. Take a pay cut if you must. Who wants to make a fortune living on a deserted island? Have you ever read the book The Little Prince?
With the exception of Billings, Havre, and Great Falls, the other "cities" in MT like Missoula, Bozeman, and Kalispell are basically like Seattle, LA, and San Fran. They are full of the people you describe and loathe in Seattle. I guarantee if you move to MT, you will feel like you are in Seattle. There are a ton of west coast transplants in MT and their attitudes are the same.
Montana is basically a good place for someone who is married, has kids, has a decent job, and is looking for a rustic lifestyle.
If you are a single guy looking for women, you will be sorely disappointed...
I don't know.. I'm in Helena, married with kids and I've had 3 women ask me if I was 'attached'. I can't wear my wedding band on my left finger because my knuckle was broken and is huge now. I tell them I'm married, of course.
It's not like I go looking either.
Not sure what the boo is about. You butt ugly as a diver duck?
With the exception of Billings, Havre, and Great Falls, the other "cities" in MT like Missoula, Bozeman, and Kalispell are basically like Seattle, LA, and San Fran. They are full of the people you describe and loathe in Seattle. I guarantee if you move to MT, you will feel like you are in Seattle. There are a ton of west coast transplants in MT and their attitudes are the same.
Montana is basically a good place for someone who is married, has kids, has a decent job, and is looking for a rustic lifestyle.
If you are a single guy looking for women, you will be sorely disappointed...
I think any proud SF, Seattleite or LA person would be aghast at the comparison. I know I am, but for the opposite reason.
Not sure what the boo is about. You butt ugly as a diver duck?
(j/k of course)
A lot of the butt ugliest women in Seattle with multiple kids will be demanding of their tall, handsome and wealthy prince or stay single, thinking getting shagged at the local bar every now and again means they are some beauty queen.
I am hoping Montanan women are not as superficial and can be accepting of some of the people who are sub-par in the looks department as myself. When I was younger I was fairly attractive, but getting bald and old, so I don't attract the women much anymore, I have to chase them, which I don't make much effort to do. In between working 12+ hours a day and just having an utter distaste for women in Seattle, I don't feel like going after them and trying to break through their icy and feminist personas. However, it boggles my mind when I am seeing the 80lb+ overweight women with kids on dating sites here outright saying that only tall and attractive men should contact them. In Seattle, women can be picky and don't have to try worth a damn to get a date.
One thing about Seattle is that women do not go out much. They tend to find groups of women and spend time with each other. You go to bars, coffeeshops, events and just about anythign in Seattle you will never see women around. It is a town of men and it is kinda bizarre. Men, men, men everywhere! Quite a contrast from Portland where you will see women all over, even if they are a bit freaky looking. If you see women they usually are hidden in a corner of a room with their girlfriends. The women in Seattle are very rigid and terrified. Maybe, being in a city of desperate, overworked and wealthy men they feel they need to be extra guarded due to them being in high demand.
I think the OP's problem probably isn't being so unattractive physically (never seen him) then being stuck in some small, far away backwoods town.
OP, I don't agree people in Missoula and Kalispell are like people in Seattle, LA. People in Everett and Tacoma are not like people in Seattle. Seattle is an entity of its own, but is probably mar on par with Los Angeles and San Francisco and every other uppity, snobby and self-serving elitist type of city. It could be that Bozeman has these elements, as I hear it is a bit of a yuppie enclave. I remember not liking Bend at all. It was like living in a California mountain town as the locals were all pushed out and replaced by Californian elitists driving their fancy cars and big snobby attitudes.
How long have you lived in Missoula or Kalispell to make your judgment of the people? I'm not saying there isn't arrogant pricks there, but cannot imagine the people have the same mentality and are as cold, distant, uppity and snobby as we have here. I'm sure there are the political correct people who think they are the saviors of the world and need their butts worshiped, but I think the numbers of these type of people are minuscule compared to what you have in Seattle, LA , NY or San Francisco.
I grew up in liberal and conservative towns in Oregon and found them to be much more hospitable, down-to-earth and friendly places than Seattle. Even Boise, I found to be a pretty friendly and open place, although the Mormon and religious elements could be disconcerting to some.
I have been in MT for a few years and I have to say, this State is horrible for dating if you are a single guy. The male to female ratio is like 4:1. Women seem to be really picky when it comes to dating which puts most guys at a disadvantage.
It seems like most women around here get married right after high school and start having kids. By the time the women are 30, a lot of them are divorced with kids from different fathers. What really grinds my gears is that those women have super high expectations in what they are looking for in a guy. That demand this and that, but what do they have to offer?
If you aren't born and raised in this State, a lot of women will look down on you and will not date you, period. I was told this from a MT born and raised gal. MT is notorious for being a very cliquey place. If you aren't part of the clique then good luck.
I know a lot of people have a fantasy about moving out west and living in rustic MT, but it comes at a price. If you aren't married and move here, you will probably end up being lonely and single for the rest of your time here. Women in general aren't very friendly or open to meeting or dating "outsiders."
Thanks to the devastating and destructive feminist revolution, you're describing lots of women today...not just in Montana.
To address your immediate concern, though, I've heard similar complaints. However, it doesn't bother me. A long time ago, for several reasons, I gave up on traditional/conventional romantic relationships. So, that reason is why I had no problem moving here and why I love living here. I will say, though, that if I still wanted to engage in traditional/conventional romance and get married someday, I would probably hate it here.
Try to remember that you're not alone and other people have similar struggles. Although many people here do live more traditionally, I've never felt excluded or frowned upon for my unconventional choices.
To conclude, I will say that as more and more men see how much the family courts screw over fathers and husbands, it's very plausible that more and more men will continue to reject traditional relationships and marriage. Ok, sorry for the tangent.
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