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Old 03-03-2010, 10:06 AM
 
Location: Brendansport, Sagitta IV
7,540 posts, read 12,568,785 times
Reputation: 2952

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Quote:
Originally Posted by rondelli View Post
Being someone who lived in Great Falls, MT and moved to northern California for better job opportunities, I know both sides of the debate being discussed within this forum. I haven't changed but GF locals do a 180 degree personality switch towards me if I'm driving up to visit my family in Black Eagle. It's the CA license plate on my vehicle, I think!
I grew up in Great Falls, and going into Black Eagle was always like going to a totally different place. Might be cuz it's more old blue collar and relatively poor? Dunno. Used to be a good Italian restaurant up there, tho.

I'm reminded of how Bismarck and Mandan ND are just across the river from one another, but might as well be on different planets so far as how the towns look and feel. Fargo and Moorhead used to seem real different too, but that went away as Moorhead got more suburbanized.

I guess the thing is, those "little town next door to a big town" places sometimes still have their own identity and they don't want to be eaten by the bigger town, and anything that looks like it might do so is viewed with automatic suspicion, as if you were carpetbaggers bent on taking advantage of 'em. It's not really fair, but I think the attitude is understandable considering that they might feel somewhat threatened by overbearing outsiders.
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Old 03-05-2010, 01:21 AM
 
Location: Upper Midwest
1,877 posts, read 3,711,306 times
Reputation: 1884
Quote:
Originally Posted by starrfillednights2010 View Post
Why are the majority of Montanas People Angry..rude.. and obviously.. carry a chip on their shoulder? Where I come from we like happy .. friendly people..and don't tollerate anything less. Is life in Montana that hard?
Where do you come from?
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Old 03-05-2010, 05:34 AM
 
281 posts, read 727,168 times
Reputation: 299
If you have fake deer in your yard as a decorative ornament, that means you are an outsider to Montana!

Just kidding, of course
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Old 03-05-2010, 06:46 AM
 
Location: Brendansport, Sagitta IV
7,540 posts, read 12,568,785 times
Reputation: 2952
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heart View Post
If you have fake deer in your yard as a decorative ornament, that means you are an outsider to Montana!
Conversation just yesterday in email with a friend:

Him: Trivia heard in commercial: "A flamingo's mother's milk is also pink." Trivia I said right after: "Birds don't lactate."

Me: Clearly you have never raised lawn flamingos. <g>

Him: Easy to care for, hard to breed?
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Old 03-05-2010, 04:20 PM
 
2,147 posts, read 4,328,736 times
Reputation: 1644
Quote:
Originally Posted by Timberwolf232 View Post
The "Californian" problem goes way back in the rocky mountain west. It's synonymous with people taking up their own causes and views in an area that may not, nor want to share those said views. MOST, but not all of this frustration is based on the "California" attitude.

Unfortunately, it's a true stigma, not about judgment of people individually, but of a collective attitude that IS a part of a lot of the mindset of a lot of people mostly from California. (and other larger areas)

I understand that every person is different, and a lot of Californians are really nice people. I just pick on CA folks more because the majority of the greedy real estate types come from out there... Actually I have quite a few friends from CA, and we agree about the mindset thing... There are quite a few nice Californians on this forum too.. but again most agree about the mindset in the area and want to move! I don't blame them!

What I have a hard time with is the attitude of people that have this desperate drive to move here, and live here for a few months and then express a need for "change". GO HOME!

The beauty of Montana has been there for thousands of years and it's really frustrating to live here, and hear from and see people that want (and aggressively attempt) to change the way things are done here.
We're not Al Quada.. We don't make women wear hoods, nor do we chop the hands off of thieves or cut the tongues out of the mouths of liars.. (although if you steal from or lie to the wrong person you might get an old fashioned western ass whoopin'..)

Addressing the housing issue... People from areas that have inflated home values that take advantage of the rural economy by buying property to resell for profit, or as a tax write off as a small business (We call these California ranches) really do more hurt than benefit for the state as a whole. (You'll hear politicians lie about this all the time and say it's good, but come visit some ranch/farming families and see how it effects them.)

I don't blame the honest immigrants , but we do get a lot of the ones who knew what they were doing when they "back doored" the area they moved from. Now they try and do it here. (by "back dooring" I mean the ones who bought land and homes just to "flip" the property for a profit based on the current economy.) This is how they make their money.., is it an honest trade??
NO!
It's not honest to bleed other people for money, even if it's in a roundabout way. PERIOD.
If YOU WANT TO EARN A LIVING HERE GET A JOB THAT HELPS the economy, instead of one that bleeds it.


Another crazy thing is these types of people move in and as the property values and taxes go up take it in the shorts as well, because they pay the inflated prices.. if they were smart they could have SAVED that extra money and bought low and had some security. All it takes is the patience and forethought not to pay too much, along with the willingness to walk out of the broker's office because the asking price is too much.

They think that because they moved to a lower value market that the price was good.. Not if your job won't support the difference... and that is exactly what a lot of newbies are starting to find out. Unfortunately it's effecting the honest ones that simply wanted to better their lives more than the greedy ones that pay attention to the market and know how to work it to their advantage.. (Life is not a poker game folks, as fun as it sounds the house always wins in the long run. )

Some of the new folks think that they figured out how to make "easy" money by "flipping" properties in a slower market based on what they learned in the big city or town they came from, then moved to Montana with the attitude of "who's to blame me for bettering myself?" right?? "I'll just pass my loss on to the next buyer."

WRONG
What they do is jack up the prices for the majority of the honest people (and themselves) that are pursuing an honest reason to move out here.... An escape from crime, drugs, gangs, greed etc...

How bad does it suck for people that scrimped and saved to be able to move and then come to face a grossly inflated housing market that they can't afford??..
Especially on Montana salaries? We are in the running for the LOWEST pay and LONGEST HOURS WORKED in the NATION.

And 75% of the newbies don't consider at all the impact they have on the people that have lived here for all or most of their lives. That sucks.

I can't think of a single friend or coworker out here that would turn a blind eye to someone new that was looking for friendship, advice, or opportunity regardless of where they came from, but at the same time almost everyone I know has had at least 2-3 bad run-ins with people trying to gather info from them, or to try to get them to sell out land that has been in their family for generations so they can divide it up and sell it for a profit. Some of them now taxed out and living in apartments instead of on their families ranches.. Makes ya sick.

I'm curious to see how others see this.

Comments??
'The Californians' problem is that California has grown from 10 to almost 40 million in a 30 yr span or so. All of these 'Californians' are actually from other parts of the US/world!!!! Natives like my spouse and friends I know,cannot afford a home in CA anymore. But the 'Californian' does not 'complain' like his other US counterparts who blame the 'Californians' for every problem in the lower 48 states,it seems.

In fact,the 'Californian' does not even complain or tell others to not come to CA. The 'Californian' [who by definition is usually from somehwere else,second generation CA,tops],knows that CA is a desireable place to live,and that CA was built,as were other states,esp in the west,on migration and new industries,and that change is inevitable.

Grow up,people! It's called LIFE.
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Old 03-05-2010, 04:50 PM
 
Location: Brendansport, Sagitta IV
7,540 posts, read 12,568,785 times
Reputation: 2952
Quote:
Originally Posted by lrmsd View Post
In fact,the 'Californian' does not even complain or tell others to not come to CA. The 'Californian' [who by definition is usually from somehwere else,second generation CA,tops],knows that CA is a desireable place to live,and that CA was built,as were other states,esp in the west,on migration and new industries,and that change is inevitable.
If you think that, you haven't been listening. I presently live in SoCal (grew up in MT), and there is increasing resentment here over pressure from immigrants of all descriptions (mostly foreign, not so much from other states anymore), driving prices up and wages down, while quality of life continues to decline for average folks. CA is something like 40% first-generation immigrants (some very rich, mostly very poor, not many inbetween), and it has entirely destroyed both the economy and what used to be a good place to live and do business.

The difference is, people in CA have flung up their hands and given up, and as a result the swarms continue to arrive and consume like locusts, and everything that used to be worth having has been paved over or restricted. Conversely, Montana is still in a position to halt the infestation before it totally ruins the MT way of life.

.
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Old 03-05-2010, 05:12 PM
GLS
 
1,985 posts, read 4,836,666 times
Reputation: 2408
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reziac View Post
If you think that, you haven't been listening. I presently live in SoCal (grew up in MT), and there is increasing resentment here over pressure from immigrants of all descriptions (mostly foreign, not so much from other states anymore), driving prices up and wages down, while quality of life continues to decline for average folks. CA is something like 40% first-generation immigrants (some very rich, mostly very poor, not many inbetween), and it has entirely destroyed both the economy and what used to be a good place to live and do business.

The difference is, people in CA have flung up their hands and given up, and as a result the swarms continue to arrive and consume like locusts, and everything that used to be worth having has been paved over or restricted. Conversely, Montana is still in a position to halt the infestation before it totally ruins the MT way of life.

.
"Infestation". You couldn't have chosen a better word.
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Old 03-05-2010, 05:17 PM
 
Location: Lost in Montana *recalculating*...
11,818 posts, read 15,432,391 times
Reputation: 12084
Then don't turn western states into mini-California sub-divisions. Shun the development by voting councils that repress that mentality. I watched the front range of CO turn into a mini-CA over the course of 20 years.

It's gut wrenching. If you want Cali... go to Cali... if you want something else- adapt.


Same here in West Virginia. We are all about NOT being want you want. We are what we are.
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Old 03-06-2010, 10:11 AM
 
Location: Montana
448 posts, read 918,828 times
Reputation: 253
Amen to all of the above. Even though the prices of real estate is jacked way beyond what things are really worth in MT we have only the Hollywood type to thank for that. Since they can move in or at least buy up real estate, it gives the hard working here a chance to "make it" good off of them and the trickle down effect began. It's really hard for the working class to live here and the older retired people. But all in all we have great things to do and live by in MT. Having migrated to ID from the REAL N Ca to get out of that mentality that emerged with So Cal bringing in their $$ and their "changing" the area to their way was too much for us to bear. ID was great, not over inflated real estate and the people where we lived were fantastic, JUST don't go trying to change things. Our thinking? Why did we move there in the first place? oh duh!!

We love it here, tighten our belts, and we can make it here. There's fishing, hunting, and the way life should be lived is here. As long as you stay away from the big city living and politics that want to run things into the ground.
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Old 03-06-2010, 05:41 PM
 
Location: Montana
1,219 posts, read 2,810,323 times
Reputation: 672
Quote:
Originally Posted by lrmsd View Post
'The Californians' problem is that California has grown from 10 to almost 40 million in a 30 yr span or so. All of these 'Californians' are actually from other parts of the US/world!!!! Natives like my spouse and friends I know,cannot afford a home in CA anymore. But the 'Californian' does not 'complain' like his other US counterparts who blame the 'Californians' for every problem in the lower 48 states,it seems.

In fact,the 'Californian' does not even complain or tell others to not come to CA. The 'Californian' [who by definition is usually from somehwere else,second generation CA,tops],knows that CA is a desireable place to live,and that CA was built,as were other states,esp in the west,on migration and new industries,and that change is inevitable.

Grow up,people! It's called LIFE.
Easy tiger.. It's not about complaining, it's about stopping an insane change like what happened in California, and Colorado from happening here in Montana.

If you have a problem with that kind of mindset, I'd suggest that you never, ever move to Montana.
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