You got me scared. (Billings, Dillon: estate, housing, rent)

[jimj]

JJM,
I do understand how you feel but the question I always had was when exactly does one become a "local"? As for people coming here and buying that nice house you can't buy without batting an eye that happens everywhere. You can't buy the house that I can and I can't buy the house that someone on Big Mountain can and he can't buy the house that the guy in aspen can etc..... Most of the people I know worked their way up to the house they sold to get the money they used to buy here, they did not choose where they grew up. They did choose to spend that money here though! The other side of this coin is all of those people who paid 60k for their little house benefit as well since now it is worth 200k and yes there is growth but now there are jobs so maybe you won't have to work 2 or 3 to survive. good and bad no matter how you slice it but the bottom line is growth and progress are going to happen so either learn to deal or it will run you over. Hope things get better for you........... BTW, just so you know I am not one of those rich people, just living by the canyon in the flathead and being a realist.

[Quistoman]

Originally Posted by GiftShoppeGuy

If you're into crowds, noise, pollution, traffic, narrow and confining places topped off with exceptional liberal views, then I'm quite certain that Missoula will be a nice fit for you.

I live in Missoula and dont see any crowds, not much noise certainly not more noise than any other town of its size, pollution eh more from fire and air quality at times but not bad other than that, traffic is horrible and I hate to go out, mostly due to poor design. Im kind of scratching by head to understand why you think its confining though?

As far as liberal it is a collage town and Id be interested to how many "liberals" are actually residents but I dont consider myself a democrat or a republican and refuse to restrict my opinions to conform with any party.

It really is a nice place to raise kids for the most part, our parks are well kept and we added mini water parks to a good number of them for the kids to splash in, not much for teens though we need to work on that but all in all its a relaxed environment.

The thing about missoula and most of montana is whatever your occupation you can get paid better to do it someplace else in most cases. This is where missoula lags behind compared to most any city. The cost of living here is inflated, not a little but a lot and to make it worse you just dont get good pay for anything here heh. If you have a good occupation it might be well worth it, but for us its actually forcing our family to move away sadly.

I drove log truck but my employer tanked so I drove long haul for a wile but thats hell if you have 3 kids and a wife so that didn’t work so well so I tried delivery and they tanked too lol. I now work in costumer service until my wife gets out of collage.

Anyway, the cost of living vs the average wage is fairly stiff here. My wife and I have really had to think about whats important to our children and what the income difference would mean to us. To start here she would make around 45 k but just about anyplace else it jumps to 50, 55 and 60 k just depends, cost of living is a wash or less in most places and 10k more a year is the difference between buying a house or renting. To buy a house here, the prices are just obnoxious.

If you have money all thats a wash itself and makes missoula a good choice but we just DO NOT want to live poor and have to tell out kids we cant afford to go to a movie now and then or get them swimming lessons or cloths for school etc. I want some kind of recreation for us too and crap man at this rate Ill be able to afford a atv or jet ski's at around 70 haha. I love the northwest and even if we have to move I just refuse to go much farther south. If we have to chose a real city it will probably be spokane and I hope some day we can move back here.

[Zeepogee]

I moved to Lewistown, Mt. a year ago and love it here. Much to my son's complaints, who has lived here for ten years, I proudly left my Cal. license plates on as long as I could and still proudly talk of good ole Cal.. I keep tellin these here folks they are dead on their feet and have to catch up because drugs and the bad stuff is already here. I bought an unused church and turned it into a youth theatre and hang out. Havin a ball. Want to work with kids?, come join me, the need is great. Jack at the SPOTLIGHT!

[Zeepogee]

Come join me at Lewistown MT. Bought a church building and am working on a Youth theatre. Still proud of Santa Rosa Cal. and let all know it, but they need change and catch up work because drugs and the bad stuff is already here. Great little town of 7.000, very homey and friendly and they'll like you if you come chargin in. THey have a great bunch of kids here, need help, come on!
Jack at the SPOTLIGHT.

[JoeJoeMan]

jimj wrote

I do understand how you feel but the question I always had was when exactly does one become a "local"? As for people coming here and buying that nice house you can't buy without batting an eye that happens everywhere. You can't buy the house that I can and I can't buy the house that someone on Big Mountain can and he can't buy the house that the guy in aspen can etc..... Most of the people I know worked their way up to the house they sold to get the money they used to buy here, they did not choose where they grew up. They did choose to spend that money here though! The other side of this coin is all of those people who paid 60k for their little house benefit as well since now it is worth 200k and yes there is growth but now there are jobs so maybe you won't have to work 2 or 3 to survive. good and bad no matter how you slice it but the bottom line is growth and progress are going to happen so either learn to deal or it will run you over. Hope things get better for you........... BTW, just so you know I am not one of those rich people, just living by the canyon in the flathead and being a realist.

Hi Jim - they say in MT after you spend 25 winters you're a local
Some good points there BUT -
No growth and progress are always going to happen - there are lots of example of places and towns in this country that haven't grown or changed much in a generation or so, some towns have even shrunk.
Sure house prices went up in 'most' places in the country, but here in MT they went up completely disproportional to the its economy, and that's what really hurts, and the influx of those 750k seattle home owners moving in really put a hurt on the locals who were as of yet not into a home, like the kids coming up and will be looking for a place.....
As far as people already owning - and moving up - well when a 100k house doubles in price, to 200k - and you wanna sell to move up, well that 200k house you want has now double to 400k, so it now takes 200k to move up instead of 100k, if you get my point, so it really is to the disadvantage of those trying to move up to, the people who really beneift are those that can walk away with the cash.
Also, what use to be starter homes, like small places in town or a few acres outta' town - well the are not 'starter' places anymore, they are out of the question for young people coming at them, you really stretch now to get the starter place and you ain't getting nearly what you use to, in fact what you get now is something, maybe you, but certainly not me would want to live in, call me silly but I ain't paying 200k for a cheap chipboard town house with no yard or garage on some busy street packed in like monkeys in a zoo.

Yup but the world is the way it is, doesn't mean it's good or something we should concide to or except, if we were to except things as the way they are and buy into that idea, well I guess we'll just have to get use to murder, mayhem and war as inevitable, not to mention the illegal invasion - just except it all !

[snugglebump]

Hi(:

You and your Family are going to love Montana! Don't worry about what others have posted, the people are great and you are going to love the scenary! It is soooooo breathtaking! I'm from Seattle and my Mom is from Browning, Montana and we're getting ready to move in the next month or two. We have boxes all over the places and I am sooooo excited. I have always been welcomed nicely each time i've gone to Montana and I know you will be treated just fine! Good Luck!

God bless,
SnuggleBump
Seattle, WA soon to be Montana Resident! )

[jenzebel]

Originally Posted by jimj

JJM,
.... As for people coming here and buying that nice house you can't buy without batting an eye that happens everywhere. You can't buy the house that I can and I can't buy the house that someone on Big Mountain can and he can't buy the house that the guy in aspen can etc..... Most of the people I know worked their way up to the house they sold to get the money they used to buy here, they did not choose where they grew up. They did choose to spend that money here though! The other side of this coin is all of those people who paid 60k for their little house benefit as well since now it is worth 200k and yes there is growth but now there are jobs so maybe you won't have to work 2 or 3 to survive....

We did not choose to grow up in a place that has become a yuppie playground either. There are no jobs here that pay well enough for us to keep up with the housing prices that are artificially inflated by outside money coming in.

Just answer one question. At average pay here of @$29,000 and average house price @$168,000, how the h**l am I supposed to buy a house, any house? I guess I am supposed to rent for the rest of my life while all you outsiders come in, buy up the property and raise the prices even higher.

I've known people that sold their property in the Flathead and Bitterroot not to make a buck on out-of-staters, as someone suggested, but because they couldn't afford to pay the taxes on it anymore, now that their new neighbors from outside were willing to pay hugely overinflated price that drove up the values.

Bottom line is--people moving here from somewhere like California are the ones that can afford the price of real estate here. We don't have decent paying jobs--like logging or mining anymore. Too bad because I would rather see clearcuts than one more d**n Californian McMansion built here.

[jimj]

Jenzebel,
While I agree that some have had to sell because of taxes (mostly in Whiteifsh) the vast majority as far as I have read and from the people I talked to did it for the money. Take a recent pre-subdivision application from Kalispell (the largest on record) was done for as they stated "to prepare for our retirement" sometime in the future. As for selling because of taxes, this is not a new thing restricted to Montana, it happens in a lot of places. This happens because the "locals" demand more services AND because the costs to run a city go up. This state is in a transition right now, the pay here sucks compaired to the cost to survive and I have seen people who have just had to quit thier jobs because they can't afford to drive there after the gas hike. It is easy to blame this on Californians (by the way there are way more Washinton and eastern plates seen now) than it is to place blame where it belongs. 1. the business owners who make a real good profit on the backs of the people they pay next to nothing. 2. the people who suck off of the government instead of supporting themselves. 3. obviously the gas companies. I would like to know why no one is blaming the Canadians for innundating the valley and throwing cash around like it is water and the rudness they bring?

[MTTX]

Originally Posted by jenzebel

Just answer one question. At average pay here of @$29,000 and average house price @$168,000, how the h**l am I supposed to buy a house, any house? I guess I am supposed to rent for the rest of my life while all you outsiders come in, buy up the property and raise the prices even higher.


Bottom line is--people moving here from somewhere like California are the ones that can afford the price of real estate here. We don't have decent paying jobs--like logging or mining anymore. Too bad because I would rather see clearcuts than one more d**n Californian McMansion built here.

If the average pay is $29,000, what is above average pay and excellent pay?

How do you achieve that pay. Hmmm, well, you either work your ass for it or you get a college degree that lands you a cushy job.

So your answer. At $29,000 a year and with house prices at $168,000, you better get two jobs or deal with renting.

Also, you can afford a mobile home at that salary. It's not renting, at least. Plop it down on a piece of property and wah-la you have yourself a Montana McMansion.

[JoeJoeMan]

MTTX Wrote:

Also, you can afford a mobile home at that salary. It's not renting, at least. Plop it down on a piece of property and wah-la you have yourself a Montana McMansion.

Wrong Again ! Have you seen price of bare land lately, decent land ? The old 'montana dream' of "I'll save up and get 20 acres and kick back", Well I must say it is "A Dream", that's all it is anymore for most people just a dream.