Why so many panhandlers in Missoula? (Bozeman, Dayton: live, moving to, homeless)

[Reziac]

Originally Posted by MT Independent

I sometimes confuse the panhandlers with the trustafarians when in Missoula. I reckon that's just a generational gap thing.

Nah, it's just a difference in whether they eat at a burger joint or a boutique I agree, otherwise they can be hard to tell apart.

[griz134]

I live in Portland and work downtown. You have to step over homeless people everywhere you go. Always holding carboard signs asking for a handouts. They just lay on the sidewalk all day long. Most have mangy feral dogs with them. I saw one guy letting his dog drink out of a public drinking fountain. After the dog lapped up his water he pissed all over the fountain. There was a stabbing during lunch hour two weeks ago right downtown. I felt bad for one homeless person once, so I gave him half of a subway sandwich. I walked away, and when I turned to look at him he was feeding it to his dog. Portland has the worst homeless problem I have ever seen. I had a friend come visit from NYC, and she was shocked by what she saw here.

[rickers]

The only other place in Montana where I have seen a panhandler was in Hot Springs.
That is understandable because after all, Hot Springs is a territory of the state of Missoula !

[Timberwolf232]

They are at most intersections in Bozeman also. Some of them flock to the wally world parking lot, but they are all over town during the summer.

[Reziac]

Originally Posted by Timberwolf232

They are at most intersections in Bozeman also. Some of them flock to the wally world parking lot, but they are all over town during the summer.

Sounds like a good place to plant a few "DO NOT FEED THE TROLLS" signs

Now that I think of it, that might make a good ad campaign to educate people about the fact that most of 'em are professional panhandlers, not genuine homeless. If you don't feed 'em, they won't flock to your town!

What I don't mind are the buskers -- the ones who provide SOME sort of entertainment or service in exchange. I think that's perfectly fair, so long as they don't hassle passersby. Remember shoe-shine stands? same principle, with more equipment. Haven't seen one in a long time, tho.

[MT Independent]

Originally Posted by Timberwolf232

They are at most intersections in Bozeman also. Some of them flock to the wally world parking lot, but they are all over town during the summer.

That one fellow seems to work the entrance pretty regularly. He seems to be doing well if you extrapolate the donations I've seen in the 10 seconds it takes to make the turn.

[mysticaltyger]

Originally Posted by Klapton

"Liberal" and "Conservative" and "Left" and "Right" is how the people at the TOP keep those of us at the BOTTOM distracted from the fact that BOTH major political parties are owned by the same people and are bent on nothing other than maintaining their own wealth and power. And those same people who own the politicians also own the mainstream media. They want to keep US divided, because if WE ever united and rose up against THEM ... their game would be over and WE would get our country back.

Very well said. The only thing I'd add is that power elite groups are usually broken up into factions, since they can never get enough power. They fight among each other but close ranks when those of us at the bottom get an inkling of what they're up to.

[Reziac]

Some articles on how much money panhandlers make:

The Straight Dope: How much money do beggars make?
The most relevant section:

I bet this won't surprise you, but estimates vary. As Michael S. Scott, the director of the Center for Problem-Oriented Policing, says in his online article "Panhandling":

Estimates vary from a couple of dollars (U.S.) a day on the low end, to $20 to $50 a day in the mid-range, to about $300 a day on the high end. Women, especially those who have children with them, and panhandlers who appear to be disabled tend to receive more money. For this reason, some panhandlers pretend to be disabled and/or war veterans. Others use pets as a means of evoking sympathy from passersby. Panhandlers' regular donors can account for up to half their receipts.

In a study of Toronto panhandlers conducted by Robit Bose and Stephen Hwang, panhandlers reported a median monthly income equivalent to US $190-$200. The authors note that

a journalist who briefly lived on the street in Toronto working as a panhandler . . . reported that panhandlers can earn more than $200 per day . . . These differences may be partly explained by the fact that high-earning panhandlers were presumably less likely to participate in our survey, and these individuals may have formed the basis for Stackhouse's observations. Our results may be more representative of the majority of panhandlers who earn lesser amounts.

The Toronto study includes some detailed demographics charts, including average expenditure on drugs/alcohol (about $200/month).

Another study from Denver:

Of course, the main reason that there are so many panhandlers in Denver is that it's so lucrative. According to a recent survey conducted by the Downtown Denver Partnership, 42% of the population has given money to panhandlers in the past year and the average person there gives $1.84 each time he or she is approached by a panhandler, for a total of about $25 a year. This adds up to an awful lot of money - a total of over $4.6 million, divided among about a thousand panhandlers. That's an average of about $50,000 per active panhandler per year, with confidential interviews with panhandlers indicating that they make between $35,000 and $100,000 tax free per year and view panhandling as the equivalent of a job or a profession. Some even have homes and support families on their panhandling income. ...

At a cost of $174 per arrest the city has determined that it's not worth arresting panhandlers, because there are so many and if they arrested them all as often as they'd need to in order to discourage them, the cost would be so high it could never be justified.

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We're all in the wrong business...
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[mastersniper]

Okay , I just had to reply to this because I am out of work and homeless.(But hope to change that soon).If you are going to donate money to an organization to help the homeless make it your local Shelter , soup kitchen , or Salvation Army.Only about ten percent of the money donated to the United way goes to the people that need it.Before you give an individual money offer him or her a job such as rakeing your yard for twenty bucks and a Hamburger meal.They will turn you down.If they really wanted to work they would go to day labor.They are just another class of bum.

[rickers]

The appearance of some of the younger panhandlers that I have seen in many places including Missoula, somewhat resemble these Hindu Hermits.