U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > Montana
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 1.5 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Jump to a detailed profile or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Business Search - 14 Million verified businesses
Search for:  near: 
 
 
Old 10-10-2009, 09:25 PM
 
Location: Billings, MT
3,331 posts, read 1,994,708 times
Reputation: 1618

Advertisements

Remember, the MFFA applies ONLY to firearms and accessories manufactured IN Montana, and KEPT in Montana. Once the item crosses the State Borders, for commercial purposes (for sale in another state) the Feds retain control.
I think the general idea is to get this before the United States Supreme Court.
Quick reply to this message

 
Old 10-12-2009, 11:00 AM
 
Location: NW MT
309 posts, read 608,467 times
Reputation: 123
Quote:
Originally Posted by monkeywrenching View Post
if this holds up under constitutional muster, Montana could see an influx of firearms owners in the near future.
And, o'great firearms inspections at the state lines!
Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-12-2009, 01:47 PM
 
Location: Brendansport, Sagitta IV
6,488 posts, read 7,480,582 times
Reputation: 1994
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtlogger View Post
And, o'great firearms inspections at the state lines!
Now wouldn't THAT get the attention of the rest of the country...
Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-12-2009, 01:53 PM
 
Location: Brendansport, Sagitta IV
6,488 posts, read 7,480,582 times
Reputation: 1994
Quote:
Originally Posted by Redraven View Post
Remember, the MFFA applies ONLY to firearms and accessories manufactured IN Montana, and KEPT in Montana. Once the item crosses the State Borders, for commercial purposes (for sale in another state) the Feds retain control.
Note the emphasis (added) -- that's the real point. We don't really CARE how they're regulated when SOLD in another state. Which should NOT interfere with your right to carry your PROPERTY over state lines, nor should it result in "border inspections" -- all that's necessary is that dealers in other states certify WHERE they bought their merchandise. Of course if their states pass laws reciprocal to MT's law, then we've got a different can of worms...

It occurs to me as I type this that the 2nd Amendment, being a right of The People, may trump the interstate commerce clause (NOT a right of The People, but rather of the Gov't which is supposedly made up of The People), were such a reciprocal law ever brought to court.
Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-12-2009, 04:09 PM
 
Location: Nebraska
2,708 posts, read 3,809,973 times
Reputation: 2707
Quote:
Originally Posted by monkeywrenching View Post
I agree, it is a really big state rights issue.
************************************************** *****
Don't confuse the Montana Firearms Freedom legislation with the issue of States Rights.

The Second Amendment guarantees ALL citizens the Right to Keep and Bear Arms. If States can infringe the right to keep and bear arms in the Second Amendment they should also be able to infringe the rights guaranteed in the other Amendments known as the Bill of Rights (1-10).

The Montana Firearms Freedom Act is basically a declaration by a STATE that it is NONE of the Federal governments business to regulate firearms in the individual states.

States cannot infringe individual rights to keep and bear arms or other rights (1-10). And neither can the Feds. Montana state lawmakers just have the guts to put the Feds on notice.

GL2
Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-14-2009, 12:09 PM
Status: "V.O.A." (set 16 days ago)
 
Location: My ranch
15,117 posts, read 6,398,796 times
Reputation: 3974
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gunluvver2 View Post
************************************************** *****
Don't confuse the Montana Firearms Freedom legislation with the issue of States Rights.

The Second Amendment guarantees ALL citizens the Right to Keep and Bear Arms. If States can infringe the right to keep and bear arms in the Second Amendment they should also be able to infringe the rights guaranteed in the other Amendments known as the Bill of Rights (1-10).

The Montana Firearms Freedom Act is basically a declaration by a STATE that it is NONE of the Federal governments business to regulate firearms in the individual states.

States cannot infringe individual rights to keep and bear arms or other rights (1-10). And neither can the Feds. Montana state lawmakers just have the guts to put the Feds on notice.

GL2

but it is also a states rights issue, the 10th Amendment.

I also do agree that the states should put the feds on notice, I am just wondering why states took so long to do it.
Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-01-2010, 09:05 PM
Status: "V.O.A." (set 16 days ago)
 
Location: My ranch
15,117 posts, read 6,398,796 times
Reputation: 3974
to those living in Montana, any word on how the MFFA is doing in court? I have heard that it was supposed to go through the fed courts, but cant seem to find anything on the interenet.

any word at all on how it is doing?
Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-02-2010, 02:33 AM
 
Location: Maяlyaиdstaи
119 posts, read 220,904 times
Reputation: 53
They filed for a declaratory judgment in October. I haven't heard anything since then.

I first caught wind of this when MSSA tried to get this law in 2007. That's when I started looking into moving there. I like the way way think.

My state of Virginia is introducing a clone of MFFA this legislative session.
Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-13-2010, 07:54 AM
 
305 posts, read 573,600 times
Reputation: 206
Looks like Wyoming is taking it one step farther:

State plan fines feds $2,000 over gun rules
Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-13-2010, 09:14 AM
 
Location: Brendansport, Sagitta IV
6,488 posts, read 7,480,582 times
Reputation: 1994
The most interesting part of the article:
In the Montana lawsuit, the federal government's brief argues it can regulate intrastate commerce because of the Commerce Clause.

But the analysis said what the states are doing is simply a nullification.

"Laws of the federal government are to be supreme in all matters pursuant to the delegated powers of U.S. Constitution. When D.C. enacts laws outside those powers, state laws trump. And, as Thomas Jefferson would say, when the federal government assumes powers not delegated to it, those acts are 'unauthoritative, void, and of no force' from the outset," Boldin wrote.

"When a state 'nullifies' a federal law, it is proclaiming that the law in question is void and inoperative, or 'non-effective,' within the boundaries of that state; or, in other words, not a law as far as the state is concerned. Implied in such legislation is that the state apparatus will enforce the act against all violations in order to protect the liberty of the state's citizens," he continued.
See also Boldin's site: Wyoming Firearms Freedom Act with Teeth | Tenth Amendment Center
(turn off javascript if it slows your computer to a crawl -- I'll have to get back to it in another post because of this)

Here's the most fundamentally relevant comment, also by Boldin:
That's a major misunderstanding of the constitution. NO rights are given to you by the constitution. They are yours by your birthright.

The constitution doesn't apply to me, it doesn't apply to you. It doesn't apply to any person at all. It applies to the government primarily the federal and in a few places, the states.

The 2nd amendment, like the rest of the bill of rights, is a restriction on government power as a way to ensure your RTKBA!
See, that's what most people forget. The Constitution and Bill of Rights are NOT restrictions on citizens. They are restrictions on the federal government.

Last edited by Reziac; 03-13-2010 at 09:23 AM..
Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


 
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Options
X
Data:
Loading data...
Based on 2000-2011 data
Loading data...

123
Hide US histogram

Over $84,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > Montana

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2014, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25 - Top