Medical Marijuana? (Missoula, Great Falls, Bozeman: construction, living, law)

[Capt. Dan]

Originally Posted by Reziac

Really?? Well, I agree, but people are going to farm what they can make a living at, and it's tough to make it with veggies at this point.

Pot is actually California's #1 cash crop, despite every effort to suppress it, which goes to show how dumb it is to NOT legalize and tax it.

It's also Tennessee's #1 cash crop! I will agree with previous poster--legalize it and tax the hell out of it.

[Reziac]

Grizz, I think what you say goes to point out a problem with the whole "war on drugs" thing:

If only outlaws can get drugs, then only scum and lowlife will have drugs. It encourages the very lowlife you're describing.

As to the notion of MJ being a 'gateway drug' -- that's really just propaganda. It's like saying beer is a gateway to alcoholism. Sure, if you have a tendency toward falling into addiction already (which is an inherited problem, not made), one beer can be enough to ruin you. But the average person isn't that abnormal, and a daily beer after work or a whiskey now and then doesn't turn them into a lush.

People tend to fall into whatever suits their base personality. Yeah, I've noticed a big correlation between irresponsible scum and regular pot use. But if pot wasn't available they'd be smokin' something else, and the pot exacerbates their base personality, which is already poor. But it doesn't turn a normal person into scum.

And yeah, that sort of scum would love to get high-quality pot for free, so they'll come nosing around medical MJ trying to get something for nothing, but they'd rob banks if they thought they could get out of jail free, too.

There's also the problem that prohibition always INCREASES consumption, because it becomes the Thing To Do. Look at the consumption stats for alcohol in the U.S. before and after Prohibition if you don't believe me.

Mind you, I don't use, grow, or truly give a damn one way or the other if anyone else does. But I've watched what the 'war on drugs' has done to our Constitutional freedoms over the past few decades (it has done more than anything else to propel us toward a surveillance and police state), and what it's done to make gang warfare a way of life in big cities (mainly over drug-marketing turf -- which would have NO value if drug prices weren't artificially inflated by prohibition).

[MTSilvertip]

Great Falls marijuana moratorium in effect | greatfallstribune.com | Great Falls Tribune

Not everybody embraces the drug culture with all its associated problems.
The above article appears in todays Great Falls Tribune.

I for one do not support the wide spread use of weed. For Terminal patients or those that for some reason couldn't take the pill form of THC, fine.
What I saw in California and Hawaii were legalized head shops that supplied dope for pretty much anybody who wanted to get high. Prescriptions for the stoners were a joke. I don't want to see that here.

In the Netherlands all kinds of dope is available, the government even supplies it for the burned out drug addicts. You see them gather in the parks waiting for the government to deliver their next high to get through another day of their useless lives.

I do find it funny that people have worked so hard for "Smoke free Montana" to demonize a legal product, tobacco, while at the same time working to legalize dope which is also smoked and does all the same damage to lungs and heart etc.
Something doesn't track here
Maybe the second hand smoke is better Hmmmm?

I agree though, tax the ##%# out of it, legal or not, Just like cigarettes or alcohol.

[Reziac]

Originally Posted by MTSilvertip

I do find it funny that people have worked so hard for "Smoke free Montana" to demonize a legal product, tobacco, while at the same time working to legalize dope which is also smoked and does all the same damage to lungs and heart etc.
Something doesn't track here
Maybe the second hand smoke is better Hmmmm?

No. I would put the same rules on smoking whether it's tobacco, dope, banana peels, or old tires -- do it in your own space, but don't impact anyone else's body or property. Additionally, since it is a "mind-altering" drug (ie. affects your judgment), I would put the same rules on it as for alcohol re DUI etc. (Is Med.MJ labeled "do not use while driving or operating machinery" like some other drugs? If not, it should be.)

And no, the smoke from pot is not only not "better" -- per the only research on the subject I know about, it contains approx. 5 times the irritants, particulates, and carcinogens of tobacco smoke, and concluded that the only reason we don't see much pot-related cancer is because users ingest a mere few tokes at a time, not 2+ packs a day.

But as with tobacco -- my attitude is, if you want to stink up your own house (or your own smoking bar, or whatever wholly private facility) and clog up your own lungs, go for it. Just don't "share" it with the world at large.

(My sister is so allergic to pot smoke that if she comes into a room where someone has been smoking it, her whole face swells up like she's been beaten with a baseball bat.)

And my own opinion is that only morons get high (personally I don't want random chemical screwing with my brain), but the fact is trying to suppress the practice is a losing battle that has done nothing positive, but has engendered both a police state and a gang culture. It's better to bow to reality and regulate/tax the stuff than it is to criminalize a widespread and unstoppable behaviour. Are you aware that the U.S. has the most people in prison per capita of any nation on earth, and that about half are in for non-violent drug offenses? This gains society nothing (tho costs a lot of tax dollars), but makes a lot of money for corporate-run prisons, since these drug offenders are low-maintenance prisoners yet are just as profitable as high-risk prisoners. And the artificially-high price of illegal drugs likewise gains society nothing, but does benefit drug lords (who can't make any money on non-prohibition prices) and street gangs, and radically increases crime rates (mainly armed robbery, burglary, and the like) because paying for a habit at prohibition prices is more expensive than the average addict can manage, even if they have a job. This problem does not occur in countries that have legalized it -- there's no longer any money in bootlegging, and no need to rob to support a now much cheaper habit.

I'd prefer that MT have a few more losers on skid row, than have the higher crime and gang activity (effectively the new bootleggers and mobsters) that comes from prohibition. And we might as well have tax INCOME from it, rather than being made to pay for prohibition of our own wallets.

This by no means is "embracing a drug culture" -- it's just being realistic, same as we learned that we had to be with booze, cuz prohibition sure as hell wasn't working. Do we have a "drunk culture" as a result of legalizing booze? of course not. Naturally there are some losers and some addicts, but you can't legislate perfect behaviour.

[Timberwolf232]

Originally Posted by MTSilvertip

Great Falls marijuana moratorium in effect | greatfallstribune.com | Great Falls Tribune

Not everybody embraces the drug culture with all its associated problems.
The above article appears in todays Great Falls Tribune.

I for one do not support the wide spread use of weed. For Terminal patients or those that for some reason couldn't take the pill form of THC, fine.
What I saw in California and Hawaii were legalized head shops that supplied dope for pretty much anybody who wanted to get high. Prescriptions for the stoners were a joke. I don't want to see that here.

In the Netherlands all kinds of dope is available, the government even supplies it for the burned out drug addicts. You see them gather in the parks waiting for the government to deliver their next high to get through another day of their useless lives.

I do find it funny that people have worked so hard for "Smoke free Montana" to demonize a legal product, tobacco, while at the same time working to legalize dope which is also smoked and does all the same damage to lungs and heart etc.
Something doesn't track here
Maybe the second hand smoke is better Hmmmm?

I agree though, tax the ##%# out of it, legal or not, Just like cigarettes or alcohol.

I think the reason that certain groups want to outlaw tobacco, and legalize marijuana is also political. Tobacco companies have contributed lots of $$ to republican causes and the legal weed crowd are usually democrats.

If the left supports outlawing tobacco, they look like they are just trying to keep people healthy, and the republicans lose campaign money. If they support legalizing marijuana, the college crowd supports them, they look like they are trying to ease peoples suffering by calling it medicinal, and their candidates GET campaign money from lobbying groups.

Personally I don't care either way. What do you folks think?

[Reziac]

Originally Posted by Timberwolf232

I think the reason that certain groups want to outlaw tobacco, and legalize marijuana is also political. Tobacco companies have contributed lots of $$ to republican causes and the legal weed crowd are usually democrats.

If the left supports outlawing tobacco, they look like they are just trying to keep people healthy, and the republicans lose campaign money. If they support legalizing marijuana, the college crowd supports them, they look like they are trying to ease peoples suffering by calling it medicinal, and their candidates GET campaign money from lobbying groups.

I think there's a great deal to that. Very few at the political level are looking beyond how it impacts their next campaign.

However, at least the tobacco companies have contributed a lot of taxes, primarily as direct taxes on cigarettes. It's time for weed to contribute its fair share.

[ElkHunter]

The OP asked:

Hi guys, I was wondering does anyone know anybody who is actually prescribed marijuana for medical use? I noticed Montana is a state that allows it so I was curious as to how often doctors actually prescribe it and what for. I know it helps with appetite for people on chemo and maybe anti-anxiety? Our current state doesn't allow it (though it is decriminalized here for recreational use).

I see nothing in this about legalizing pot for everyday use, nor do I see left wing and right wing talked about. I don't even see any questions about tobacco use.

I'll ask again for folks to get back on track.

[Reziac]

from 14 Legal Medical Marijuana States - Medical Marijuana - ProCon.org

Approved Conditions: Cancer, glaucoma, or positive status for HIV/AIDS, or the treatment of these conditions; a chronic or debilitating disease or medical condition or its treatment that produces cachexia or wasting syndrome, severe or chronic pain, severe nausea, seizures, including seizures caused by epilepsy, or severe or persistent muscle spasms, including spasms caused by multiple sclerosis or Crohn's disease; or any other medical condition or treatment for a medical condition adopted by the department by rule.

(Added links to explanatory material for uncommon terms)

Offhand I didn't find anything on how many people use the program.

[TimtheGuy]

Originally Posted by rickers

Yea right ! Why do I not believe you on that ? You are very good at finding facts. Maybe you can find some data on cannabis to convince us that these plants can survive our cold winters.
If you saw MJ growing in the ditch in Montana is was most likely from some kids tossing a bag of useless seed out the window of a car and they grew tall and quick until the winter killed them off. Cannabis can not sustain a regenerating patch in Montana's climate, but however you have proved me wrong before and I may be wrong again.

Pretty cold here in MN and marijuana grows wild all over the place.

[Rickers]

I have never seen it grow wild anywhere except as a teenager. Someone planted two plants on either side of the alley back door of a police substation at the beach and they grew 4 feet tall before the police discovered them. !
I think there is supposed to be a program on a Great Falls news station tonight about some new proposed or soon to come into effect changes to the states program. Some cardholders are upset with the current system of being stuck with one caregiver and having to switch a bunch of times due to caregivers not coming through with good product or bait and switching, and the state may go to a system where a patient can shop at different dispensaries where free market pricing can be enabled easier.They may also want to start taxing it.
I also think they may be cracking down on all the 20 year old healthy young bucks getting cards to be a patent first growing his own, then once an inventory is established he can earn money being a caregiver right away without making new clients wait 7 months before being able to buy any product.
The picture below is of a legal female marijuana flower (bud) before manicuring. Manicuring would be sniping off the little green pointy leaves on the bud.