General firearms laws/customs in Montana (home, purchase, school)

[ironranger77]

I'm moving to Montana. But, I don't know jack about the firearms laws. In Minnesota we can carry handguns if we acquire a permit, which means you can carry concealed or open (for the most part). Otherwise, a handgun pretty much needs to be in a box locked in the trunk on the way to the range (if not on your property).

Although it's somewhat common to see rifles in the woods, it's pretty rare to see anyone openly carrying a rifle inside a town. I can remember when I was a kid, say sixth or seventh grade, three or four of us would get our rifles and hop onto my buddy's four-wheeler to go into the woods and vaporize woodchucks and the occasional tweety-bird. I suppose if someone from Duluth or Minneapolis saw something like that they'd think we were terrorists or some sort of light mechanized militia guerrilla band. But, it was just something we did like playing hockey. Only on a few occasions during hunting seasons have I seen rifles in places like a bar or a within a city limit; pretty rare occurrence for me.

So, what is the general deal in Montana?

Can someone wear a side-arm openly and go about their business, and if so in which circumstances? I don't anticipate doing that myself, but I'd like to know since I'll be subject to Montana's laws and customs. I'm more interested to know what is allowed in the back country and in general to rifles. I know that in national forests rifles are allowed. Is it common to see people lugging rifles around Montana outside of cities? How about in towns? I don't have any machine pistols of light machine-guns, but I've got an old Carl Gustaf Mauser and a few .22LRs. If I'm out in the wilderness twisting ankles and dehydrating, etc., at least I could have the comfort of Carl, or at least a .22. Is it common (or within reason) for a hiker or explorer to roam around with a .30 calibre slung, or is it taboo?

Do the laws vary by county ordinance, or are there customs by region of the state? I'll be moving to western Montana, so maybe gun customs are far different than by the Dakotas.

We have black bears and timberwolves and lynx and bobcats where I grew up, and none of those are big problems. Black bears you just have to make sure not to surprise. So, make noise in the woods and they'll know you're there. Worst case scenario, so long as it's standing even a .22LR can take down a black bear if you shoot it in the chest. Wolves can get curious, but my philosophy is if one wanted to eat me, I wouldn't have any warning anyway so nothing I can really do. Lynx and bobcats are not typically aggressive to people unless they're diseased and mad. But, Montana has those grizzlies I've been told. So, my chances of being equipped while hiking are probably going to be a bit better when doing so in Montana compared to where I grew up. Accordingly, if someone can advise me on the general firearms situation in my new place of abode, I'll be happy with the insight.

[ElkHunter]

In Montana, there is no permit to purchase required for handgun or rifle. There is no requirement to register either one. There is no license required for either.

There is a requirement to have a Concealed weapons permit to carry a pistol concealed. Montana is an Open Carry state.

Now, as to the rest of your questions. Just because Montana is an open carry state doesn't mean you see a bunch of people coming and going to Costco with their rifle tucked under their arm. This is not 1850. You can, but people don't.

You also have to be familiar with local city and county ordinances.

[mica]

The problem you might have with long gun carry in the backwoods is hunting regulations. No hunting license, in the woods with a long gun, might be hard to explain to a NFS officer or other, that you are not hunting illegally.

Regarding handguns, MT is a traditional open carry state, no permit required. Open carry's legality was specifically codified last year. You must be a resident for 6 months before you can apply(shall issue) for a carry permit. Montana does recognize MN permit so you would be covered until then.

There is statewide preemption of local government with these exceptions;
* A public assembly
* A publicly owned building
* A park under it's jurisdiction
* A school

Local jurisdictions can regulate carry in those area's.

Hiking with a Mauser doesn't sound like fun. Have you considered a .44 mag maybe?

[Gunluvver2]

IronRanger,
You stated "Worst case scenario, so long as it's standing even a .22LR can take down a black bear if you shoot it in the chest." A .22 round in the chest might kill a Black Bear but it may not die until after he chewed on your carcass and you died before he did.

When I was a kid I killed a lot of coyotes, deer and even a bull Elk with eye shots with a .22 rifle. A .22LR in the eye would probably kill a Black Bear or Grizzly Bear but I sure as heck wouldn't want to try it and **** him off. If you are going to carry something in Grizzly country you better make sure it is big enough to put a Grizzly down immediately just in case you can't make the eye shot.. As far as Gun Laws in Montana I don't have a clue. However the NRA/ILA website has links to gun laws in all 50 states.

GL2

[Montana Griz]

Reminder: Effective Monday 2/22/10, it will now be legal to have LOADED firearms on your person, in your camp, in your vehicle, etc (subject to some restrictions).

See for details: End nears of 94-year-old ban on loaded guns in national parks | ScrippsNews

[inspironmini]

I am all for gun rights, but unless you have Doc Holiday style draw and aim ability, bear spray is far more effective against grizzlies.

[ElkHunter]

Originally Posted by inspironmini

I am all for gun rights, but unless you have Doc Holiday style draw and aim ability, bear spray is far more effective against grizzlies.

It's far more effective on home intruders too. Myself, I am armed. But when a novice asks me what's best for home defense, I tell them to plant 4 or 5 cans of bear spray around the house. Works great!

[ironranger77]

Hiking with a Mauser doesn't sound like fun. Have you considered a .44 mag maybe?

A .22LR in the eye would probably kill a Black Bear or Grizzly Bear but I sure as heck wouldn't want to try it and **** him off. If you are going to carry something in Grizzly country you better make sure it is big enough to put a Grizzly down immediately just in case you can't make the eye shot..

unless you have Doc Holiday style draw and aim ability, bear spray is far more effective against grizzlies.

Thanks for the replies!

I've definitely thought of a handgun with punch as a "go to hell" plan in case a Grizzly gets too familiar, you know when plans go to hell? I don't know Grizzly anatomy or physiology, so I don't know if a .40 would be enough or even a 9mm. Something a little easier to handle than a .44 mag since I'm not big into handguns, rifles are more my thing (I shot expert on the rifle-qual back in the day). I've also wondered if a semi-auto carbine camp style rifle with .30 or .45 slugs would be able to do it with enough shots. Or, even a semi-auto shotgun; those are always great for close-in!

I'll pick up bear spray for sure. I've heard that's something you can't go without in Grizzly country, and I have no intention of being stupid and unprepared. I also don't know anyone in Montana, so I'll be hiking alone, which isn't my favorite type of adventure in the first place. Being prepared will help, and so will living in the area.

I'm also interested in that new ruling for firearms in national parks - seems the laws depends on which state the park is in. I guess at Glacier and part of Yellowstone, it goes by Montana's laws as mentioned in your replies.

[ElkHunter]

Yes, by all means, pick up some spray. A 9mm or .40 cal will not do the trick. Either would do it with 8 or 10 well placed shots. Of course, when a bear comes at you and the adreniline starts flowing, "Well Placed" goes out the window. You just as well try and beat him to death with it.

Hiking alone is fine, if you have to. But do yourself a favor and talk to the local game and fish or forestry department before you go. They'll be able to tell you if there is any bear activity in that area. They'll also ask you to give them a shout when you come out from your hike. They're pretty good about that sort of thing. And, it's nice to have somebody, that's familiar with the area, kind of watching out and checking up on you.

If you are looking for a good camp gun for bears, think about a pistol grip 12 ga with 00 buck or single 0 buck. But more importantly, be mindful of your camp. Keep your food in coolers and keep the coolers at least 150 ft from your tent area. Tie the coolers and pull them up in a tree about 15-18 ft off the ground. Cook where your coolers are. Don't take any food back to the tent area. Cut some branches (2 or 3 inches thick and 12 ft long) and build yourself a small barrakade around the tent area so that if a bear comes snooping around, he/she has to crack some branches getting in close.

The new ruling says you can be armed while in National Parks. Doesn't say you can hunt (unless on a designated hunt by park officials). Simply protection like you would enjoy anywhere else in the free world.

When you mentioned shooting Expert in rifle quals back in the day it made me think of this: Was the target an 600 lb pissed griz sow? Was she going to allow you time to set up a table and chair and check windage?

[Klapton]

Originally Posted by ElkHunter

When you mentioned shooting Expert in rifle quals back in the day it made me think of this: Was the target an 600 lb pissed griz sow? Was she going to allow you time to set up a table and chair and check windage?

If he's talking about Army rifle qualification, it's popup targets; singles and doubles. 20 shots foxhole-supported, 20 shots prone-unsupported. No table and windage checking, lol.

The purpose, of course, is to prepare one for combat. But the tiny amount of nervousness one gets when taking a test doesn't compare to the pant-loading fear of real combat - or facing said grizzly sow.

Hopefully one has trained enough to use the four fundamentals without having to think about them. That's about the best you can hope for.

On the original topic, one place to find info on gun laws of various states is OpenCarry.org - A Right Unexercised is a Right Lost! . There are even forums there where people talk about specific locations and open-carry experiences; i.e. people in this town freak out and call the cops, cops in that town hassle you or don't, this city the cops don't even KNOW the gun laws and arrest you because they can. All that sort of thing.