Montana Drivers? (Billings, Great Falls, Bozeman: loan, cost, assessments)

[Radek]

Originally Posted by StuckPA

Wow that sounds like out here! Thanks for the input.

I think Montana drivers are sadly, in general, more dumb than normal drivers in cities. Put them on a rural road, few cars, they're awesome. But put them at a 4-way stop, and well... gear up to take a nap.

The thing is, I notice a bunch of dumb people (double left turn lanes, they merge to the right without a signal or a glance right in front of me, since Im in the right-hand left turn lane). Yeah, that one pissed me off a little.

So, you'll notice them... just like you'd do in Philly, or Seattle. But, theres going to be 1 of them a day. Instead of 30, due to population density.

And, if everyone else just looks around, waiting for someone else to go... just GO.

[StuckPA]

Originally Posted by Radek

I think Montana drivers are sadly, in general, more dumb than normal drivers in cities. Put them on a rural road, few cars, they're awesome. But put them at a 4-way stop, and well... gear up to take a nap.

The thing is, I notice a bunch of dumb people (double left turn lanes, they merge to the right without a signal or a glance right in front of me, since Im in the right-hand left turn lane). Yeah, that one pissed me off a little.

So, you'll notice them... just like you'd do in Philly, or Seattle. But, theres going to be 1 of them a day. Instead of 30, due to population density.

And, if everyone else just looks around, waiting for someone else to go... just GO.

Yea I never understood the idea of multi-way stop signs,it must mean that they don't trust drivers to stop when they're supposed to.

Growing up in NJ I don't think I ever saw multi-way stop signs,PA was the first state I saw like that. I guess in NJ the attitude is 'well if you can't read a stop sign then too bad'

It's not the dumb drivers that alarm me,it's the drivers that pass illegally at high speeds etc that scare me!

[jimj]

What scares me are those stupid round-a-bouts that they must think are so, so chic here. They just started putting them in instead of a 4 way intersection here in Kalispell and not only did they raise the center and plant stuff in it (so you can't see across it) when it snows and ices up it's real fun to try and make the constant turn....What a stupid idea!

[StuckPA]

Originally Posted by jimj

What scares me are those stupid round-a-bouts that they must think are so, so chic here. They just started putting them in instead of a 4 way intersection here in Kalispell and not only did they raise the center and plant stuff in it (so you can't see across it) when it snows and ices up it's real fun to try and make the constant turn....What a stupid idea!

We call them 'circles' out in NJ. Look up the 'Somerville Circle'...the most infamous of all!

[Reziac]

Originally Posted by jimj

What scares me are those stupid round-a-bouts that they must think are so, so chic here. They just started putting them in instead of a 4 way intersection here in Kalispell and not only did they raise the center and plant stuff in it (so you can't see across it) when it snows and ices up it's real fun to try and make the constant turn....What a stupid idea!

The concept is that if everyone is only turning right, there will never be anyone crossing someone else's lane, and it (theoretically) does away with the need for traffic signals, and if you miss your turn, at worst you just go around the circle again. Which is probably for the best if you have primarily non-slippery conditions, and if you have a lot of bus or heavy truck traffic (since changing lanes to the right in a vehicle with a long blind spot is always a hazard to clip or crunch cars in the next lane).

My observation has been that yeah, they work for all that, but they also clog things up because they slow everyone to a crawl. And it doesn't affect just THAT intersection; it affects the pace of EVERY intersection on EVERY street that feeds into a slow spot like this. So the net effect is MORE congestion, not less.

And yep, turning on ice is what you try to avoid as much as possible, because EVERY turn is another opportunity to start sliding. A constant turn is, as you say, the worst of all, especially if you have to change angles to get into your desired "exit". On ice it's much safer to come to a halt, make ONE turn starting from complete control, and continue in a straight line.

But these morons think because roundabouts work for European cities (which have way too many narrow streets and way too much bus and truck traffic, but for the most part don't get winter snowpack on their streets) it'll work in Montana. Right.

Worse yet is the PARTIAL roundabout combined with a freeway exit (there are several such along the 405 Freeway in Los Angeles), where you have to go left into highspeed traffic, or right into slower traffic, with no choice but to cross at least one other lane moving at a significantly different speed no matter which direction you're headed. The wonder is that there are as few wrecks as there are!!

.

[MontanaNative64]

There is definately something to be said about 4 way stops, however here in Livingston people seem to over polite as it is habit for us all sitting at a 4way stop to spend our time waving a hand and mouthing "no, go ahead you first." The 2 street lights we have are faster.

[Timberwolf232]

I think the awful driving skills are because its a mix of drivers from all over the place moving here. You can tell who's been around (especially during wintertime) and who hasn't. Most of us will help drag you out of the ditch when you slide off the road...

I get aggravated when nobody moves at a 4 way stop too!! Then everyone wants to go at once and round and round we go... (*hums circus music*)

[TristansMommy]

Originally Posted by StuckPA

Can anyone tell me how drivers in Montana are overall? I've heard the speed limits there are higher due to alot of openness,but just how is the pace overall? Will I get run off the roads there or are people more patient?
I've also heard there are many people moving in from other states so that would factor into it as well.

As a fellow East coaster (NY in the house) yes.. they drive differently.. I'll explain..

First, when you are behind someone who is making a left into a lot across a busy street.. be prepared to sit there awhile.. they won't do it unless a car is 2 or 3 blocks down the way.. they are very defensive drivers.. which is okay.. but for someone from the East Coast, particularly NY, it's a much slower pace of driving that could drive you nuts at first. And they do drive slow and really do follow the speed limits posted on streets (ie: 30 miles and they really go 30 miles, whereas here it's like. yeah right i'm going to go that slow).

As for the highways.. well here is where it' different.. Ironically on teh open roads they do tend to go FASTER than I am comfortable going with but they won't run you off the road. they are more friendly than that! They will pass you when teh opportunity arrises (if on a one lane either way highway).

For me, driving at night is scary but that is because i am used to having my roads well lit. If you are in Philly or right outside, you may feel weird about night driving in pitch darkness too.. but you'll get used to it. My mom had to get used to it again after havng lived in NY for so long before moving back.

I will say though, they are MUCH more polite drivers and you'll hardly ever..actually you'll NEVER hear a horn.. buty ou might be temted to honk yours because.. well 4 cars could have made that left turn while you waited.. After being there awhile though, you'll mellow out to their style of driving..

It's funny.. in MT my mom still has a little NY driver in her.. but in NY she's got a MT driver in her.. if you know what I mean.. LOL

[StuckPA]

Originally Posted by TristansMommy

For me, driving at night is scary but that is because i am used to having my roads well lit. If you are in Philly or right outside, you may feel weird about night driving in pitch darkness too.. but you'll get used to it.

After being there awhile though, you'll mellow out to their style of driving..

It's funny.. in MT my mom still has a little NY driver in her.. but in NY she's got a MT driver in her.. if you know what I mean.. LOL

I know what you mean because that kind of thing happened to me when I came back up from VA to NJ...just when my blood pressure was back down

[TristansMommy]

When I visit my mom in her small town they don't have stop signs at any of the intersections.. and I forget that I have to kind of be concious of that.. because here I only stop when I'm told by the sign to stop.. and there it's like you have to kidn of look around to make sure someone isn't coming.. it's weird..LOL.

Fortunately though the town is small and not much traffic anyway so it's good.. but it's kind of funny for me.. .