What if Montreal was predominantly English speaking today? (how much, unemployment)

[Trimac20]

Originally Posted by Acajack

There is no guarantee that Montreal as an English-speaking city would develop a unique culture similar to that of New Orleans. Plenty of places in North America have non-English origins but now have English as their main language (including some with French origins like St Louis, Detroit) and they are as mainstream North America as you can get, so it's not a given that Montreal wouldn't just be another Pittsburgh or Cleveland (nothing against these places) but with some French street names.

St. Louis or Detroit never really developed much of a French culture. By the time of the Louisiana Purchase they were still remote outposts, while New Orleans, founded in 1718, was already a thriving trade centre and centre for the slave trade.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Trimac20

Clearly I don't mean any major city where English is spoken in the US will attract tourists. Atlanta is a good case in point.

I'm thinking French culture + English widely spoken/a culture connected more to the English world..

For tourism requirements, English is more than present enough in Montreal already. There is very little inconvenience in visiting the city for a tourist who only speaks English.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Trimac20

St. Louis or Detroit never really developed much of a French culture. By the time of the Louisiana Purchase they were still remote outposts, while New Orleans, founded in 1718, was already a thriving trade centre and centre for the slave trade.

New Orleans was indeed bigger around 1800, but keep in mind much of the city's population was comprised of African slaves: they weren't likely big on "French" culture. Both Detroit and the St. Louis area (Ste-Geneviève, Cape Girardeau) did have an organized society in French, with parishes, schools, colleges, etc.

The second-oldest Catholic parish in the United States is called Ste-Anne-de-Détroit...

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Trimac20

I assume you've been to NOLA?

Whether through Acadia/Creole/Cajun culture or otherwise, there is plenty of French influence/feel still in the city. Maybe not so much 'pure' French culture as in Quebec City, but it's enough that NOLA feels significantly different from any other city in North America. And what's more, English is widely spoken. No conflict there. No reason why Montreal couldn't be the same.

Yes, I have been to New Orleans and all over southern Louisiana. French may be a tiny part of the original mix, like a smidgen of an ingredient you add to a dish or a drop of something you put in a bigger drink, but as I said I don't find it French at all. It's more Caribbean and Spanish than French.

Louisiana Cajun country, around Lafayette, is more culturally French than New Orleans is. As is northern Maine around Madawaska.

[Acajack]

Just a general comment - I see ZERO advantage to Montreal becoming more English at the present time.

- Head offices that moved to Toronto wouldn't come back anyway.

- Montreal is not the richest place on the continent but it is richer than many places in North America where English is totally "unrestricted", so it's not as if English has magic properties that makes a place automatically rich.

- Eventually, it might make it less interesting as a potential tourist destination.

- Culturally, pretty much everything that exists in English can already be had in Montreal (books, movies, music, magazines, TV, etc.), so the whole city doesn't have to function in English in order to have this, and the English community could actually be even smaller in Montreal and most of this would still be available

- In addition to the English stuff, you have an entire "national" French-language culture that exists over top of it with tons of stuff you don't have anywhere in North America, which means Montreal actually has *more* stuff available than most other places on the continent, NOT LESS.

- Montreal is a place where you can talk about Quentin Tarantino and you can talk about Denys Arcand and you can talk about Claude LeLouch. Charles Aznavour and Francis Cabrel and Daniel Bélanger are as much topics of musical discussion as are John Coltrane and Bruce Springsteen. Make the city more English, and you'll eventually be left just with Tarantino, Coltrane and Springsteen. Trust me.

So as I said - nothing to gain. My honest opinion.

[Trimac20]

You may be right...and I assume all school children in Quebec now learn English and will be bilingual. If they aren't, that's just criminal.
For better or worse, English will probably grow, maybe not at the expense of French (although there may be erosion).

I guess it would be beneficial for people wanting to move to Montreal, who can fill a lot of positions without having to speak fluent French. It might help boost the economy a bit.

[PostSecularist]

What if Montreal was predominately English speaking today?
Very difficult for Quebec to separate

[jambo101]

Originally Posted by Trimac20

You may be right...and I assume all school children in Quebec now learn English and will be bilingual. If they aren't, that's just criminal.

For better or worse, English will probably grow, maybe not at the expense of French (although there may be erosion).

I guess it would be beneficial for people wanting to move to Montreal, who can fill a lot of positions without having to speak fluent French. It might help boost the economy a bit.

There is a bit of English taught in French schools but its just a token effort compared to the French immersion the English students are subjected to, result most English students finish their schooling being totally bi lingual whereas the French students not so much as once outside Montreal theres very little opportunity for them to experience any English..All Students coming from outside the province are mandated to attend French schools unless you send them to some very expensive private schools.Most of the English kids i know leave Quebec shortly after graduation to take advantage of better job prospects outside Quebec.
English is dwindling in Quebec and will never grow in Quebec As long as Bill 101 is in place, and language police (Office de la Langue Francais) are free to ticket any company not in compliance with the strict language laws.Such as if you do have the audacity to post a sign with English on it the French translation better be on the top and the French font better be twice the size. More likely your English sign will be vandalized long before the language authorities arrive.
French is supposed to be the language of the workplace but its a rule thats hard to enforce.
On top of that Quebecers pay the highest taxes in N.America. And then there's the ever present possibility that Quebec could call a referendum on sovereignty (Separation from Canada)..
On the whole not a place conducive to English or Business expansion.But a great place to visit..

[Trimac20]

Originally Posted by jambo101

There is a bit of English taught in French schools but its just a token effort compared to the French immersion the English students are subjected to, result most English students finish their schooling being totally bi lingual whereas the French students not so much as once outside Montreal theres very little opportunity for them to experience any English..All Students coming from outside the province are mandated to attend French schools unless you send them to some very expensive private schools.Most of the English kids i know leave Quebec shortly after graduation to take advantage of better job prospects outside Quebec.
English is dwindling in Quebec and will never grow in Quebec As long as Bill 101 is in place, and language police (Office de la Langue Francais) are free to ticket any company not in compliance with the strict language laws.Such as if you do have the audacity to post a sign with English on it the French translation better be on the top and the French font better be twice the size. More likely your English sign will be vandalized long before the language authorities arrive.
French is supposed to be the language of the workplace but its a rule thats hard to enforce.
On top of that Quebecers pay the highest taxes in N.America. And then there's the ever present possibility that Quebec could call a referendum on sovereignty (Separation from Canada)..
On the whole not a place conducive to English or Business expansion.But a great place to visit..

Well more and more people in France itself and wanting to learn English, there's no denying it, English is the unofficial lingua franca and in one generation hundreds millions more around the world will be fluent in it. Whether the Quebecois want to adapt, especially being in an English majority country is up to them. Perhaps if they want to continue being French-speaking splitting away from Canada might be a better option after all.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by PostSecularist

What if Montreal was predominately English speaking today?
Very difficult for Quebec to separate

Quebec would probably separate before that scenario could fully realize itself, so in a way creeping anglicization of Montreal is actually more of a factor that favours Quebec independence, rather than preventing it from happening.