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Roundabouts can be very efficient. They are virtually unknown in West Virginia, but are commonplace in New Jersey and parts of New York. They avoid the need for traffic signals. In fact, they avoid the need to stop at all. If you've travelled 705 you know of the long delays at the intersection with Mileground for signals that stop and start, stop and start. This eliminates that. I think it will work, as long as they do the logical and take the four lane construction down the hill to Point Marion Road. If they don't do that, we still have the bottleneck and it will largely be like the boondoggle construction on University Ave. where Don Knotts mysteriously funnels down to one lane.
I'm familiar with the concept. Back home in Cumberland, Maryland, they built a brand new, state-of-the-art hospital just east of town and installed two roundabouts on the adjacent highway to serve as the intersections for the hospital entrances. I'm just trying to picture how they're going to set this up so that it accommodates the massive amounts of traffic coming in from all directions.
You're right. Everything is relative and since we have been so grossly neglected for so long we should be jumping for joy. I am very happy with this development.
Also, I agree with you about the 64 bridge. There is a lot of traffic on that stretch and to see them putting money on expressways to nowhere in Buffalo and pie in the sky constructions in the coalfields when there are such glaring needs is beyond befuddling.
Why are people so uneducated about the new US 35. It is not a road to nowhere and is needed. Here are some simple facts that might help people understand the importance of this road.
1--- The old Us 35 is rated as one of the most dangerous roads in the state of WV because of its heavy truck traffic, and its poor construction. The area, which sees alot of big trucks, needed a new road to help make life for locals and travelers alike safer.
2--- The whole area has seen alot f suburban growth, and will likely see more in years to come. Also the area has seen industrial growth, and a better road is needed to help encourage more aswell as help existing companies like Toyota.
3--- Once complete, there will be nothing, but 4 lane highway from Charleston to Columbus, OH. this will cut travel time down alot, plus will make business between the two cities easier. The direct connection between the cities will also encourage business along the road to set up shop.
4--- Putnam County is trying to make itself more developable. Kind of like Bridgeport with Jerry Dove Drive, and Fairmont with its new road. This highway will set a foundation for future growth in Putnam, Mason, and even Kanawha County.
as for highways in southern WV, I couldn't speak on their behalf. Although I'm not saying that they are entirely bad either.
I'm familiar with the concept. Back home in Cumberland, Maryland, they built a brand new, state-of-the-art hospital just east of town and installed two roundabouts on the adjacent highway to serve as the intersections for the hospital entrances. I'm just trying to picture how they're going to set this up so that it accommodates the massive amounts of traffic coming in from all directions.
They work better than you think in traffic. At first they are dangerous as people learn how to drive in them. Once an area is used to them they move traffic, even heavily congested traffic much quicker than lights.
Ive spend 20-30 minutes in some cases dealing with congestion on one traffic light.
The longest I have ever spent entering and exiting a roundabout is maybe 3 minutes in heavy DC traffic, which is among the worst in the nation.
Trust me once you get used to it a roundabout beats waiting in a long line to get through a light.
Why are people so uneducated about the new US 35. It is not a road to nowhere and is needed. Here are some simple facts that might help people understand the importance of this road.
1--- The old Us 35 is rated as one of the most dangerous roads in the state of WV because of its heavy truck traffic, and its poor construction. The area, which sees alot of big trucks, needed a new road to help make life for locals and travelers alike safer.
2--- The whole area has seen alot f suburban growth, and will likely see more in years to come. Also the area has seen industrial growth, and a better road is needed to help encourage more aswell as help existing companies like Toyota.
3--- Once complete, there will be nothing, but 4 lane highway from Charleston to Columbus, OH. this will cut travel time down alot, plus will make business between the two cities easier. The direct connection between the cities will also encourage business along the road to set up shop.
4--- Putnam County is trying to make itself more developable. Kind of like Bridgeport with Jerry Dove Drive, and Fairmont with its new road. This highway will set a foundation for future growth in Putnam, Mason, and even Kanawha County.
as for highways in southern WV, I couldn't speak on their behalf. Although I'm not saying that they are entirely bad either.
I agree with you on this Chris. The complex that people in north-Central WV have regarding their road funding (or funding from the state in general) has always been an interesting one.
If you want a real 'road to nowhere' look no further than the Mon-Fayette Expressway. The state plowed a ton of money into the that road which PennDOT admits will likely never be fully completed to the south side of Pittsburgh. If you want to get technical the Mon Valley is as much 'nowhere' as places in southern WV. That is in addition to the fact that the trip up I-79 from Morgantown to Pittsburgh is smooth sailing even at peak periods. Morgantown itself only has 'bad traffic' while school is in session. Those roads are wide open during winter and summer breaks.
There are of course other examples...The widening of I-79 from Anmore to Shinston (has traffic in Clarksburg ever been bad?), the massive new gateway to downtown Fairmont, the upgrading of Route 50 to four lanes clear from Clarksburg to the Ohio line, etc.
It seems like plenty of road money has been plowed into portions of north Central WV...your politicians need to do a better job at applying it to projects that will actually put a dent in traffic.
And to agree with cry_havoc (welcome to the DC area btw!) above, roundabouts are very effective.
I agree with you on this Chris. This complex that people in north-Central WV have regarding their road funding (or funding from the state in general) has always been an interesting one.
If you want a real 'road to nowhere' look no further than the Mon-Fayette Expressway. The state plowed a ton of money into the that road which PennDOT admits will likely never be fully completed to the south side of Pittsburgh. If you want to get technical the Mon Valley is as much 'nowhere' as places in southern WV. That is in addition to the fact that the trip up I-79 from Morgantown to Pittsburgh is smooth sailing even at peak periods. Morgantown itself only has 'bad traffic' while school is in session. Those roads are wide open during winter and summer breaks.
There are of course other examples...The widening of I-79 from Anmore to Shinston (has traffic in Clarksburg ever been bad?), the massive new gateway to downtown Fairmont, the upgrading of Route 50 to four lanes clear from Clarksburg to the Ohio line, etc.
It seems like plenty of road money has been plowed into portions of north Central WV...your politicians need to do a better job at applying it to projects that will actually put a dent in traffic.
And to agree with cry_havoc (welcome to the DC area btw!) above, roundabouts are very effective.
I do enjoy the new area, however I disagree about NCWV.
It is one of the fastest growing areas of the state, both in population and economically. The infrastructure here is 30 years outdated, and nowhere near keeping up with growth. It isnt so much as a complex as people wanting the state government to do its job. For some reason the rest of the state resents NCWV and the Eastern Panhandle and feel they deserve nothing despite being the only 2 healthy areas of the state. Dont get me wrong the state government loves taxing NCWV and the Eastern panhandle and loves the new revenue they just dont like giving us benefits. Meanwhile southern WV which has been in economic decline and losing people is getting roads it doesnt need. That new highway isnt going to save Southern WV.
As for the Moncounty expressway. The state government deserves little credit. No work was being done into the FEDERAL government gave stimulus money to WV to work on the road. The road was built to get trucks off the old route which was dangerous.
The state contributes almost nothing to NCWV, especially Morgantown.
The ironic thing is if the state gave NCWV more support it would pay the state back, plus extra, from the increased economic activities. The state would rather hurt itself to spite NCWV than reap the obvious benefits.
The politicians feel threatened that the power and influence in WV is increasingly shifting away from their base to NCWV and the Eastern Panhandle.
I do enjoy the new area, however I disagree about NCWV.
It is one of the fastest growing areas of the state, both in population and economically. The infrastructure here is 30 years outdated, and nowhere near keeping up with growth. It isnt so much as a complex as people wanting the state government to do its job. For some reason the rest of the state resents NCWV and the Eastern Panhandle and feel they deserve nothing despite being the only 2 healthy areas of the state. Dont get me wrong the state government loves taxing NCWV and the Eastern panhandle and loves the new revenue they just dont like giving us benefits. Meanwhile southern WV which has been in economic decline and losing people is getting roads it doesnt need. That new highway isnt going to save Southern WV.
As for the Moncounty expressway. The state government deserves little credit. No work was being done into the FEDERAL government gave stimulus money to WV to work on the road. The road was built to get trucks off the old route which was dangerous.
The state contributes almost nothing to NCWV, especially Morgantown.
The ironic thing is if the state gave NCWV more support it would pay the state back, plus extra, from the increased economic activities. The state would rather hurt itself to spite NCWV than reap the obvious benefits.
The politicians feel threatened that the power and influence in WV is increasingly shifting away from their base to NCWV and the Eastern Panhandle.
Ok, so it's one of the fastest growing areas in a state that is hardly growing? Doesn't really say much. If you look at census data, NCWV in general isn't really growing that fast. Harrison County added maybe a few hundred people between 2000 and 2010 and Marion County actually lost population. The only regional county in the census to show fairly sizeable growth was Mon County, which has grown simultaneously with a large increase in student enrollment at WVU.
And yes the Federal government did kick in money for the Mon-Fayette through the stimulus program but the state provided plenty of funding as well. And you just said the road was being built to get trucks off the road because it was dangerous. Is increased transportation safety and efficiency not the main rationale behind projects like Corridor H or the Coalfields Expressway? In addition to economic development opportunities (especially for Corridor H).
Do I think a lot of West Virginia politicians (or those at any state and federal level really) make a ton of smart decisions? Absolutely not. And I am not trying to shift the focus away from this thread involving much needed transportation improvements in Morgantown. But at the same time, the same old song and dance in this forum that NCWV is somehow constantly slighted by the state in an act of economic sabotage to prevent it from growing makes no sense.
Last edited by NOVAmtneer82; 01-23-2012 at 08:34 PM..
Ok, so it's one of the fastest growing areas in a state that is hardly growing? If you look at census data, NCWV in general isn't really growing that fast. Harrison County added maybe a few hundred people between 2000 and 2010 and Marion County actually lost population. The only regional county in the census to show fairly sizeable growth was Mon County which has grown simultaneously with a large increase in student enrollment at WVU.
And yes the Federal government did kick in money for the Mon-Fayette through the stimulus program but the state provided plenty of funding as well. And you just said the road was being built to get trucks off the road because it was dangerous. Is increased transportation safety and efficiency not the main rationale behind projects like Corridor H or the Coalfields Expressway? In addition to economic development opportunities (especially for Corridor H).
Do I think a lot of West Virginia politicians (or those of any state really) make a ton of smart decisions? Absolutely not. But the notion that NCWV is somehow constantly slighted by the state in some sort of act of economic sabotage to prevent it from growing doesn't really make sense. At least not to me.
The vast majority of WVU students are not counted in Morgantown's or Mon counties population. The growth of WVU has certainly helped the area but Morgantown is thriving due to thriving private business and recently drilling.
The state building that road was a joke. They started construction in the 90s, and werent able to build a few miles of road in a decade. The state never funded it or gave it priority.
Morgantown and mon county never saw any economic benefits from the expressway. Drive along it and you will notice a lack of development. The whole, "if you build it they will come," belief over a road increasing the local economies is false. The road was needed because coal trucks could not use the existing road. Corridor H is not going to save an area in decline. It is like giving a vitamin pill to someone with terminal cancer. Im not saying the area cant be saved, but some giant useless pork project is not going to save it. Also it is not fair to compare the expressway with the road in the south, because one is MUCH MUCH bigger than the other. Which one? Ill give you a hint it is in the south. So after 30 years of rapid growth the city Morgantown gets a small expressway thanks to the feds. After decades of decline the state builds a big road in the middle of nowhere funded by the state and the feds.
Your comments even show an anti-NCWV vibe. You are all for corridor H, but are resentful that NCWV got a few miles of interstate. "How dare NCWV get anything!"
You're right the anti-NCWV attitude doesnt make sense. Not a whole lot about WV politics does. Hardly surprising the city is one of the poorest, the most depressed, and the unhealthiest. The era of robber barons never ended in WV and they have treated this state like a 3rd world country. Now NCWV, led by Morgantown, threatens this status quo and could empower and develop the state.
I agree with you on this Chris. The complex that people in north-Central WV have regarding their road funding (or funding from the state in general) has always been an interesting one.
If you want a real 'road to nowhere' look no further than the Mon-Fayette Expressway. The state plowed a ton of money into the that road which PennDOT admits will likely never be fully completed to the south side of Pittsburgh. If you want to get technical the Mon Valley is as much 'nowhere' as places in southern WV. That is in addition to the fact that the trip up I-79 from Morgantown to Pittsburgh is smooth sailing even at peak periods. Morgantown itself only has 'bad traffic' while school is in session. Those roads are wide open during winter and summer breaks.
There are of course other examples...The widening of I-79 from Anmore to Shinston (has traffic in Clarksburg ever been bad?), the massive new gateway to downtown Fairmont, the upgrading of Route 50 to four lanes clear from Clarksburg to the Ohio line, etc.
It seems like plenty of road money has been plowed into portions of north Central WV...your politicians need to do a better job at applying it to projects that will actually put a dent in traffic.
And to agree with cry_havoc (welcome to the DC area btw!) above, roundabouts are very effective.
You are wrong about that. The Mon Fayette has a vehicle use count of around 8,000 vehicles daily, but that will grow drastically when the PA section is completed to Pittsburgh. First of all, not one cent of state money was spent on the Mon Fayette. That was built with Federal funds in West Virginia. Secondly, the road has vastly improved transport between nearby Uniontown and Morgantown, resulting already in major increases in the number of people from Uniontown and environs who seek medical care in Morgantown, and more recently in additional workers for our understaffed and rapidly growing medical facilities. The Uniontown bus company has even added daily runs between the two cities.
705 is West Virginia's busiest state numbered highway. Morgantown has been grossly neglected by state government in terms of highway development. We desperately need a $100 million investment in infrastructure here based on demonstrated demand, not pie in the sky let's create something scenarios.
Chris's assertion the US 35 will somehow link isolated Charleston to Columbus is wishful thinking. There is a much better and more direct link between Wheeling and Columbus, and although I am very familiar with both towns, I don't see massive interaction between the two. If anything, it would make it easier to get from Charlotte or Atlanta to Columbus.
US 35 has a 10,500 per day vehicle usage. WV 705 has a 26,500 per day and rapidly growing vehicle usage. Where should the attention be focused?
The vast majority of WVU students are not counted in Morgantown's or Mon counties population. The growth of WVU has certainly helped the area but Morgantown is thriving due to thriving private business and recently drilling.
The state building that road was a joke. They started construction in the 90s, and werent able to build a few miles of road in a decade. The state never funded it or gave it priority.
Morgantown and mon county never saw any economic benefits from the expressway. Drive along it and you will notice a lack of development. The whole, "if you build it they will come," belief over a road increasing the local economies is false. The road was needed because coal trucks could not use the existing road. Corridor H is not going to save an area in decline. It is like giving a vitamin pill to someone with terminal cancer. Im not saying the area cant be saved, but some giant useless pork project is not going to save it. Also it is not fair to compare the expressway with the road in the south, because one is MUCH MUCH bigger than the other. Which one? Ill give you a hint it is in the south. So after 30 years of rapid growth the city Morgantown gets a small expressway thanks to the feds. After decades of decline the state builds a big road in the middle of nowhere funded by the state and the feds.
Your comments even show an anti-NCWV vibe. You are all for corridor H, but are resentful that NCWV got a few miles of interstate. "How dare NCWV get anything!"
You're right the anti-NCWV attitude doesnt make sense. Not a whole lot about WV politics does. Hardly surprising the city is one of the poorest, the most depressed, and the unhealthiest. The era of robber barons never ended in WV and they have treated this state like a 3rd world country. Now NCWV, led by Morgantown, threatens this status quo and could empower and develop the state.
This will be my last post on this subject as I don't want to derail this thread. Here it goes..I don't hate NCWV at all. I actively support my alma matter, I support local businesses by going to all home football games each year, I recruit for my company from WVU etc. What I don't agree with is the common sentiment that many have up that way that they have been somehow slighted by the state. It has never made sense to me and likely never will.
Regarding the "it is not fair to compare the expressway with the road in the south, because one is MUCH MUCH bigger than the other." The Coalfields Expressway and Corridor H are two roads being buiilt through communities that are essentially devoid of an effective method of transportation. Places in McDowell, Mingo, Hardy, Pendleton etc don't have 2 interstates surrounding them like Morgantown. They can't generate economic development if there isn't even a decent infrastructure to go with. After all they didn't have the luxury of being selected as the home of the state's land grant institution (and all the perks that come with that) like Morgantown.
If NCWV, led by Morgantown is such an economic powerhouse threatening the status quo in WV, why then did you follow the path of so many other WVU alums down here to the DC area?
You are wrong about that. First of all, not one cent of state money was spent on the Mon Fayette. That was built with Federal funds in West Virginia. Secondly, the road has vastly improved transport between nearby Uniontown and Morgantown, resulting already in major increases in the number of people from Uniontown and environs who seek medical care in Morgantown, and more recently in additional workers for our understaffed and rapidly growing medical facilities. The Uniontown bus company has even added daily runs between the two cities.
705 is West Virginia's busiest state numbered highway. Morgantown has been grossly neglected by state government in terms of highway development. We desperately need a $100 million investment in infrastructure here based on demonstrated demand, not pie in the sky let's create something scenarios.
Chris's assertion the US 35 will somehow link isolated Charleston to Columbus is wishful thinking. There is a much better and more direct link between Wheeling and Columbus, and although I am very familiar with both towns, I don't see massive interaction between the two. If anything, it would make it easier to get from Charlotte or Atlanta to Columbus.
US 35 has a 10,500 per day vehicle usage. WV 705 has a 26,500 per day and rapidly growing vehicle usage. Where should the attention be focused?
CT, the interchange with I-68 to the Mon-Fayette was built entirely with stimulus money not other portions of it that had been underway for more than a decade prior to work beginning on the final segment. There was state funding involved with those portions.
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