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I called my bank to get a copy of my closing documents since the ones I received at closing 5 years ago were not signed by either party... essentailly blank docs. They don't mean anything really.
The bank told me that they were destroyed and they only have an electronic version in their database. It would cost me $150 to get a copy...
OK, anyone know if any of this is illegal?
First, not providing me with a signed copy of my documents at closing?
Second, destroying the original documents?
Third, charging me to see my own documents and get a copy?
The title company didn't give you a copy of your signed docs at closing, they are responsible for that. Never leave the closing table without getting your copies.
I believe the bank can charge you for the work of providing them now since it was your responsibility to hold on to the documents the title company [should have] provided to you 5 years ago. You could also try calling the title company where you closed and ask them if they still have your records.
As Debsi said, the title company is required to retain a copy of all loan documents for many years. They will have to pull yours from their archives since they are 5 years old. Be prepared as they will probably charge you a fee as well.
Thank you... I realize I can ask the title company... but on the other side of all of this... can the bank legally destroy the documents and only retain them electronically? Is that legal?
Thank you... I realize I can ask the title company... but on the other side of all of this... can the bank legally destroy the documents and only retain them electronically? Is that legal?
Based on reading, no - they can't... It's my understanding that they are legally bound to have a "wet ink" copy clearly showing any transfers (ownership of the note being "sold" or transferred) - all being correctly and legally notarized. The actual note is the legal power needed to enforce a foreclosure and MERS is not a replacement for this process - although the banks want to believe it is. Legislation on this matter was recently tried to be pushed quietly through by the banking lobbies, but Obama sat on it and didn't sign it into law. Think "robosigning" scandal.
It's also my understanding that you have a clear legal right to demand to see the wet ink note from your servicer... How that works out for you in reality is a whole other story. We all know that the banks don't have to follow the same rules we all are forced to - they can make it all up as they go along because they're too big to fail.
I called my bank to get a copy of my closing documents since the ones I received at closing 5 years ago were not signed by either party... essentailly blank docs. They don't mean anything really.
The bank told me that they were destroyed and they only have an electronic version in their database. It would cost me $150 to get a copy...
OK, anyone know if any of this is illegal?
First, not providing me with a signed copy of my documents at closing?
Second, destroying the original documents?
Third, charging me to see my own documents and get a copy?
Thanks.
First: The title company gives you the copies, not the bank. Not illegal to give you unsigned ones. I see this a lot when the closer travels (i.e closes a refi in your office, not their's). They bring an extra copy of all the docs to provide the borrower.
Second: The original note goes to Fannnie or Freddie and an original mortgage got recorded at the county. Why do you need originals of anything? The lender can absolutely detstroy the rest and keep electronically.
Third: if you want replacment copies they can certainly charge you. Kind of like if you called your bank right now and requested copies of all your 2009 bank statements that they all ready sent you once. They are going to charge you to re-create them.
I am an NSA (Notary Signing Agent) and am the person that would bring the doc's and leave the un-executed copy for the borrowers. Many times the borrower asks me when they are going to get their signed copy. Since I am only there as a witness and do not represent the lender or the title company, per se, I usually only answer with, "unfortunately I'm not sure how that works, that's something you need to address with your L.O."
I have a couple of questions:
1) Are the borrowers entitled to an executed free copy of their doc's (at all-or) within a certain amount of time? Do they have to pay for it? (only asking because of the topic of this thread.) Should they have to, or do they have to request a copy? Or is it supposed to just be forwarded?
2) However, if in fact they cancel at the table and decide not to go through with the signing all together, whose property are the documents?; I think I already know the answer to this. I have heard that by law they have to be returned to the lender. Unsigned documents cannot be left with the borrower. Is this true? Why is it a law if it is?
Timtheguy hit this on the head. The borrower can get a copy of the signed documents at closing from the closing agent/title company. But other than the promissory note, I don't think the lender is legally required to keep the originals.
And I don't even think the lender or the title company is required to keep the copies for a certain length of time in most states. I know their E & O insurance carrier likes for them to keep them for 7 years, but I don't know of any legal requirement.
I am an NSA (Notary Signing Agent) and am the person that would bring the doc's and leave the un-executed copy for the borrowers. Many times the borrower asks me when they are going to get their signed copy. Since I am only there as a witness and do not represent the lender or the title company, per se, I usually only answer with, "unfortunately I'm not sure how that works, that's something you need to address with your L.O."
IMO, that is the correct answer. You are just there to witness and any questions should get directed to the closing agent or LO.
The simple solution is for the closing agent to scan and email the signed docs to the borrower once you get them back to them.
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Nsa
