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Old 08-12-2008, 08:07 AM
 
4,963 posts, read 3,927,109 times
Reputation: 2917

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I was listening to the radio this morning. There was an ad for a credit counseling (I believe). But the first words out of their mouths was ; in debt ; its not your fault. Maybe its due to loss of a job, illness, or just hard luck.

So where does living beyond your means come in??? Will everyone blame hard luck on their foreclosures??

Get real ; it is your responsibility.

d
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Old 08-12-2008, 08:14 AM
 
Location: Destined to be banned
375 posts, read 701,473 times
Reputation: 198
Yeah, there is lot's of blame to go around, but don't dare suggest that the swindling mortgage fraudsters who initiated all these bad loans are innocent, please tell me you are not that naive.
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Old 08-12-2008, 08:19 AM
 
4,963 posts, read 3,927,109 times
Reputation: 2917
no no, I am not that naive. I understand that the banks/mortgage brokers need some responsibility. But the spenders also need to be told someone is to blame.

d
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Old 08-12-2008, 08:48 AM
 
947 posts, read 2,782,797 times
Reputation: 721
The sum of ones life is based on their individual choices. Everyone needs to go out and make good choices.

Sometimes people make bad choices. If a person makes a bad choice it doesn't make them a bad person, just a person who made bad choices.

Someone who racks up too much debt it's better to admit they made a bad choice and make the changes to pay it back or whatever needs to be done to correct it than pass the buck. - wait - that's called being a responsible adult!
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Old 08-12-2008, 09:00 AM
 
16,701 posts, read 18,917,881 times
Reputation: 6798
Passing the buck is THE American way... personal responsibility is that "old" thing from long ago.. the government advocates irresponsibility and their plan is to make someone else pay for it...
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Old 08-12-2008, 12:06 PM
 
Location: Houston, Texas
10,425 posts, read 43,523,011 times
Reputation: 10329
Passing the buck was the American way until now there ain't enough bucks to go around.

People..........have a heart. You cant predict when you might get sick or have any sort of family illness or if you lose your job. Dont say never. I dont care who you are or what you do, you are just a useless number to an employer. All you do is make your boss rich at the expense of your own time and pride. When you lose your job then come on this thread and tell your story.

I will never blame home buyers for this mess. Sure there were many who bought a home they should not have. But is that their fault or the lenders? We all were nice and comfy when our homes were rising in value 10% a month in some hot areas. We all thought the good times could never end. We all had that funny feeling that it cant go on forever but few did anything about it.

Then blink 3 times and its a couple years later past the peak times. It dont matter what you put your home up for sale at. There are no buyers. People like to say to sell if you cant afford it. To who? How can you sell it if it is worth half of the mortage balance?

I dont have the answers either but it bothers me when those who are working and have some money in the bank put down those who are simply victims of this 2nd Great Depression. It's going to get much much worse too. Mark my words. See what your tune is when 90% of the homes on your block are vacant with the familiar bright yellow placecard on the front window and you are sitting at your window with a rifle trying to fend off the homeless vagrants.
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Old 08-12-2008, 05:51 PM
 
Location: Southeast Georgia
65 posts, read 215,894 times
Reputation: 46
Desertsun, people buying more than they could afford or walking away even though they could afford to keep paying are the problem. They are the ones who signed the papers agreeing to the terms of their home purchase.

But now, hard working people who have struggled to do the right thing are losing their jobs and homes because of these people and the mess they got our economy in.

I have no sympathy for those that bought more than they could afford, used loan terms that would put them in this situation or choose to walk away instead of owning up to their contracts. The people loosing their jobs now because of this are the people I have sympathy for.
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Old 08-12-2008, 06:01 PM
 
Location: NW Las Vegas - Lone Mountain
15,756 posts, read 32,491,985 times
Reputation: 2661
Quote:
Originally Posted by phantoms View Post
Desertsun, people buying more than they could afford or walking away even though they could afford to keep paying are the problem. They are the ones who signed the papers agreeing to the terms of their home purchase.
After having been assured by the professionals in that field that what they were doing was normal and reasonable. It is clear today that it was not...but that is because we chose not to remember how it was in 2005.

Walking away is often the proper staff. The ability to pay is not the issue. The question is what is the right thing to do for ones family and self. Then you do it.

Quote:
But now, hard working people who have struggled to do the right thing are losing their jobs and homes because of these people and the mess they got our economy in.
On that point you have apparently drunk the nutty juice. The individual decisions of these people had no detectable impact on the economy. For that you look to the lenders and those who allowed them to function without rational regulation.

Quote:
I have no sympathy for those that bought more than they could afford, used loan terms that would put them in this situation or choose to walk away instead of owning up to their contracts. The people loosing their jobs now because of this are the people I have sympathy for.
You should develop a better line of sympathy. The 2005/6 cohort are no less worth of sympathy than the 2008.

In Las Vegas those who bought a home in 2004 to 2006 are roughly 60% of the foreclosures. They should be less than 25%. That would indicate that bad timing was a significant part of the problem. Just the luck of the draw mostly.
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Old 08-12-2008, 06:28 PM
 
Location: Southeast Georgia
65 posts, read 215,894 times
Reputation: 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by olecapt View Post
In Las Vegas those who bought a home in 2004 to 2006 are roughly 60% of the foreclosures. They should be less than 25%. That would indicate that bad timing was a significant part of the problem. Just the luck of the draw mostly.
Bad timing yes, but what has that to do with the foreclosure rate? You want to blame the lenders/banks/whatever, but the person who signed papers agreeing to terms and then getting in over their head because it are the ones to blame. The value of a home plummeted in Las Vegas, so what? Would they be crying if it had skyrocketed. How has the the timing of the housing market got anything to do with whether you can afford it or not later on? Sure, you might have lost equity or even be neg equity, but that has nothing to do with the terms you sign up for.

Yes there are many crooked lenders/bankers/realtors, etc. But they are not responsible for you. YOU ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR YOU!. It is your duty to research what you can afford and what terms are available. You are the one signing on the dotted line. Until people start taking responsibility for themselves we will continue to have issues such as the housing mess. And we will continue to have people that want to blame everyone else.
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Old 08-12-2008, 08:34 PM
 
Location: NW Las Vegas - Lone Mountain
15,756 posts, read 32,491,985 times
Reputation: 2661
Quote:
Originally Posted by phantoms View Post
Bad timing yes, but what has that to do with the foreclosure rate? You want to blame the lenders/banks/whatever, but the person who signed papers agreeing to terms and then getting in over their head because it are the ones to blame. The value of a home plummeted in Las Vegas, so what? Would they be crying if it had skyrocketed. How has the the timing of the housing market got anything to do with whether you can afford it or not later on? Sure, you might have lost equity or even be neg equity, but that has nothing to do with the terms you sign up for.

Yes there are many crooked lenders/bankers/realtors, etc. But they are not responsible for you. YOU ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR YOU!. It is your duty to research what you can afford and what terms are available. You are the one signing on the dotted line. Until people start taking responsibility for themselves we will continue to have issues such as the housing mess. And we will continue to have people that want to blame everyone else.
Garbage, unmitigated garbage. The number of civilian who have the skill and knowledge to know whether or not they were in over their head is very small. To master the arcane art of the mortgage on your own would take hundreds if not thousands of hours.

And note that all those professionals were wrong. None projected the bottom dropping out of the market driven almost exclusively by predatory pricing policies of lenders trying to dump non-producing assets. And that pricing policy has driven a significant pricing drop into a disaster.

Our leading local junk mortgage expert...the one who teaches the classes on mortgages to the RE community... just lost his own home in a foreclosure.

While the anarchists and libertarian cry for "self responsibiltiy" they do not even understand what happened. They cry that they should have known...but no one knew. If you were very unlucky you bought a home in Las Vegas during the market peak. You lost your equity and may well have no rational choice but to walk away. To behave irrationally because it makes Ron Paul happy is...in fact....irrational and probably indicates a problem in dealing with reality.

And thouse of you who urge others to committ financial suicide to meet some absurd goal from a Heinlen book should also have your brains checked by one skilled in that art.
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